Support NeoGAF

[MonarchJT]

Someone is trying to embellish what the market cap means for Xbox. Investments? That isn't what was said at all. This was about surviving losses. The problem here is you are confusing overall Microsoft with the part of it that is Xbox. If Xbox became an overall negative aspect of Microsoft then it would be vulnerable, just as PlayStation would. Companies invest in order to see a return on that investment. Gaming is clearly a good investment right now. If the Xbox today were floundering in the same way that Xbox One did at launch and the prospects of a turn around were grim then all the market cap in the world would not have saved Xbox.



I'm amazed that there are people like you still that believe a new market means the death of the existing market. You've got record demand for consoles and local hardware and the availability of cloud streaming hasn't slowed that down one bit. But yeah......keep your faith. I'm sure the end really is nigh.

I never said that it's the end of the console world it is as we know it...that is to say..."walled garden". It's the end of console exclusives ... so maybe I'm more specific

 

[reksveks]

boy i wish it would get that popular

It does sound very much like 'Year of the Linux Desktop' saying.

Don't reply about Linux Servers please.

 

[Matsuchezz]

Yes, i am ok with Sony release the game at the same time on PS5 and on PC. They are doing gradually once they have all the pieces that they need to have simultaneous launch they will do it. It will be a matter of preference where the player wants to play the games.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

They are growing in revenue, profits and install base. Notice in the last image they also plan to increase their market share in the console market this generation.

And well, they now monetize way more each user, hardware sales are less important to them, as they get more money than before due to digital games being more profitable than physical games, games now featuring DLC and MTX, the growing importance of subscriptions, etc.

They will use mobile games, movies and pc ports as extra revenue to keep growing, but also as you mention as trojan horse to sell more consoles because that would help them increase their main business: to sell (primarly 3rd party) software for it.

They are growing revenue and profits due to everyone trending to digital cuts and mtx. The user base hasnt budged since the PS2 days with 150 million users. It's actually gone down. Those days of PS2 and PSP had Sony at 200M+ units sold.

That's why when you look at the PS1 to PS3 eras, the bar charts barely moved.

 

[MOTM]

Easy the real money is made selling 3rd party games, plus and 3rd party dlc. Selling less hardware equals less of all that. Selling a few copies on steam at a discount minus lord gaben's 30% cut hardly makes up for that. Not like they are selling 10 million copies at 70 dollars.

Horizon Zero Dawn’s PC launch sales ‘were nearly as large as The Witcher 3’s’ | VGC

Guerrilla’s game was also up 50% on Death Stranding, according to research firm…

www.videogameschronicle.com

 

[MOTM]

I'm telling you no one knows what the future reserves for Sony with this possible day one strategy. A game sold on their own ecosystem gets them more money than selling on a different platform, this is basic. Services like Plus is not necessary on a PC is another simple observation.

With the info and data Sony has I'd say they're betting the people who play only on PC will overshadow the cons of losing people who would invest on a playstation hardware and their own ecosystem buying games, dlcs and services. Maybe Jimbo is right or maybe he's fucking Playstation medium to long term, who knows. And it's not like he'll be there to take responsability for it, others will have to lead with the consequences anyway.

You can go either route with your opinion, you're not necessarily wrong cause we still don't know what are the impacts for the Playstation ecosystem.

Just remember it took Kaz Hirai some good years to put Sony back on the right tracks. Bad decisions happens.

Thank you, I’ll let the people who have the data make business decisions.

 

[kingfey]

Northern mythology uses real location... Where? Oh, so you can fight trolls in real life? And you can climb gigantic robot dinosaurs in real life? Huh, where?
Isn't FH5 set in Mexico? I thought that was a real place. And you actually can sail the seas, fish and sing shanty songs irl, lmao. Nah, you're just fanboying, stop.

As if fighting trolls a real thing.

Sailing the sea is a dream for many people. Dressing up as a pirates, and sailing with your boat.

That is no fanboism, but realism, which you cant understand it.

Valhalla is the closest one to your argument, unlike God of war. That game has old England, and the vikings. You can actually walk with people, and visit locations, explore ruins compared to God of war. One is exploration, while the other is fighting with old gods.

I could agree with horizon zero down. Fighting dinasour robots is fun. And that game has more freedom compared to God of war.

 

[kingfey]

I'm telling you no one knows what the future reserves for Sony with this possible day one strategy. A game sold on their own ecosystem gets them more money than selling on a different platform, this is basic. Services like Plus is not necessary on a PC is another simple observation.

With the info and data Sony has I'd say they're betting the people who play only on PC will overshadow the cons of losing people who would invest on a playstation hardware and their own ecosystem buying games, dlcs and services. Maybe Jimbo is right or maybe he's fucking Playstation medium to long term, who knows. And it's not like he'll be there to take responsability for it, others will have to lead with the consequences anyway.

You can go either route with your opinion, you're not necessarily wrong cause we still don't know what are the impacts for the Playstation ecosystem.

Just remember it took Kaz Hirai some good years to put Sony back on the right tracks. Bad decisions happens.

Playstation won't have that much impact.

People don't buy ps5/ps4 for their exclusives, unlike the switch. They buy it for their COD, fifa, and other 3rd party games, despite those games being on pc, and Xbox.

Sony will lose money, if they don't invest on pc now. The longer they wait, the longer the gap between them and Xbox will be on pc.

Look at Xbox games on steam. Despite being on MS store and gamepass pc, they are on top 10 steam sales chart. Sony wants some of those money.

 

[yurinka]

Horizon Zero Dawn’s PC launch sales ‘were nearly as large as The Witcher 3’s’ | VGC

Guerrilla’s game was also up 50% on Death Stranding, according to research firm…

www.videogameschronicle.com

Almost 2M units sold on PC as of now. Back in February 2019 Horizon had sold 'way over 10M' in PS4.

 

[On Demand]

That's not true. Nintendo easily beats Playstation at profits. When talking about profit margin, it's actually miles ahead.

Which just further proves my point actually.

Sony and Nintendo make so much money from the console business. MS puts all their games on PC and gamepass and they still don’t make as much as the 2 that sells their games on one console.

All this talk about Sony needs to follow MS is incorrect. They don’t need to do any of what MS is doing at all. I’m starting to believe people only want Sony to follow MS because then Sony will dumb PlayStation down to having no exclusives and value. Then the arguments will be the same for both.

Crab in a bucket.

 

[MOTM]

Almost 2M units sold on PC as of now. Back in February 2019 Horizon had sold 'way over 10M' in PS4.

So 2 million additional sales.

 

[Swift_Star]

As if fighting trolls a real thing.

Sailing the sea is a dream for many people. Dressing up as a pirates, and sailing with your boat.

That is no fanboism, but realism, which you cant understand it.

Valhalla is the closest one to your argument, unlike God of war. That game has old England, and the vikings. You can actually walk with people, and visit locations, explore ruins compared to God of war. One is exploration, while the other is fighting with old gods.

I could agree with horizon zero down. Fighting dinasour robots is fun. And that game has more freedom compared to God of war.

You're 100% fanboying. What you like about experiences is not what other people like or else GoW wouldn't have sold 20M copies. You're wrong. It's as simple as that.

 

[reksveks]

Sony and Nintendo make so much money from the console business. MS puts all their games on PC and gamepass and they still don’t make as

Make as much what?
Profit? Probably not
Revenue? MS has beaten Nintendo for two Q in a row, all hail 3rd party dlc and expensive hardware.

 

[kingfey]

You're 100% fanboying. What you like about experiences is not what other people like or else GoW wouldn't have sold 20M copies. You're wrong. It's as simple as that.

I am amazed that a game with angry man, who kills gods as part time job, will hit 20m. I am very shocked.

Please look what god of war is about first, before you type that shit. Gow existed for a long time, and people play it for angry kratos. nothing else.

 

[yurinka]

honestly you wrote lots (LOTS) of wrong things and lots of unlikely assumptions

Honestly you have no idea how servers and cloud works.

I don't know in what reality you can compare the servers owned by Sony acquired with the small Onlive

Stop mading up nonsensical stuff. The onlive servers had nothing to do with the PS Now ones. The PS Now ones did use PS3 hardware embedded in server racks to run and stream PS3. Later they made a newer versions that were using PS4 hardware to run PS4 games. If fact Sony already had their technology build by the Gaikai team, they basically only got some game streaming patents Onlive had.

with what is Azure and Xbox has available with Xcloud. They are these investments behind such an infrastructure are so huge that I don't think Sony could grant them for the PlayStation division at the moment and in the near future.

Xcloud is only MS's version of PS Now, it doesn't add anything special to their streaming tech and the MS infrastructure doesn't add anything that Sony already had before.

And you will understand for yourself that renting servers definitely costs X times more than owning them and being able to make money on them (check the earnings of azure and Xcloud expense)

I worked in a very successful F2P company with games that had many dozens of millions of users and we rented servers and have friends and former coworkes now working in the biggest mobile F2P companies of the work. So I know the costs of owning, mantaining and renting servers. And I also know that companies like MS, Sony, Amazon, Facebook, Google and thousands more with big services have their own servers and on top of that most of the servers they use aren't owned by them, but are datacenters spread around the world 'rented' in 3rd party data center companies who work at the same time for MS, Azure, AWS, Google, Facebook, Sony, EA and any random webiste, app service or whoever else wants to pay for it.

People use 3rd party data centers because they cover more countries and cities and are cheaper than to rent them to Azure or ASW, or own them yourself because they share cost between more apps/services/webs and cut middleman costs. And obviously they offer basically the same. The cost for their internet and electricity usage plus maintenance is pretty much the same for everyone, mostly depends on the country. And the hardware for PS Now servers is a custom one made by Sony.

Azure only is a software to manage this cloud of servers, as Amazon AWS and many other ones are. The cost of that license is a tiny portion of running the whole game streaming business. What Sony pays yearly for that is way smaller than what MS spends on getting 3rd party and indie games that debut on a month of game pass to name an example, and this is without considering what MS sacrifices in game sales for their 1st party games putting them there day one.

Psnow which was an acquisition for Sony (gaikai+onlive), in view of the future that is starting in this days, is a commercial failure from all points of view it was so bad that Sony herself took the app off its televisions because it couldn't even guarantee access to the service in the vast majority of cities. It is (a failure) also from the point of view of number of users. For this I bet that within this gen we will see a rebrand and a relaunch under another name.

If it's a failure why MS copied it? And why Sony makes more money with their game subscriptions strategy and has more subscribers than MS without needing to throw billions to it and to sacrifice many dozens of millions of day one game sales? And why Sony's strategy of focusing on selling their games and to keep as secondary businesss the subscriptions to include there mostly the games that already sold all their copies generates them way more money as division?

In terms of users, how many Xcloud users are there? Do you know them? Or at least do you know the users of GP Ultimate also including the ones who don't use Xcloud? And do you know that Xcloud is also limited to some countries like PS Now instead of having a global coverage?

Ms does not take money for any software sold on PC (unless there is some copyright for some stuff that it makes money behind the scenes as it happens onevery device sold with Android on) but the Windows platform is theirs and then decides what DirectX support and what not and who decides which API to push (directstorage say something?) or deprecate and if that's not enough you will find only one store and advertising integrated into the operating system and it will only be Xbox in fact we have Gamepass integration inside windows 11.

There is no reason for MS to block Sony or anyone else for using DirectX on PC or something like that. If fact MS wants to have everyone using their APIs instead of alternatives like Vulkan. In fact Sony doesn't use DirectX at all on their PlayStations. Regarding the MS store being integrated in Windows doesn't matter if almost everybody use other ones like Steam, GoG or Epic Store instead.

So 2 million additional sales.

Yup. I don't know the current exact sales, but as of now they should be ~2M units sold in PC + ~15?M units sold + some millions more who played it on PS Plus/PS Now/Play at Home/etc.

 

[MonarchJT]

Honestly you have no idea how servers and cloud works.


Stop mading up nonsensical stuff. The onlive servers had nothing to do with the PS Now ones. The PS Now ones did use PS3 hardware embedded in server racks to run and stream PS3. Later they made a newer versions that were using PS4 hardware to run PS4 games. If fact Sony already had their technology build by the Gaikai team, they basically only got some game streaming patents Onlive had.


Xcloud is only MS's version of PS Now, it doesn't add anything special to their streaming tech and the MS infrastructure doesn't add anything that Sony already had before.


I worked in a very successful F2P company with games that had many dozens of millions of users and we rented servers and have friends and former coworkes now working in the biggest mobile F2P companies of the work. So I know the costs of owning, mantaining and renting servers. And I also know that companies like MS, Sony, Amazon, Facebook, Google and thousands more with big services have their own servers and on top of that most of the servers they use aren't owned by them, but are datacenters spread around the world 'rented' in 3rd party data center companies who work at the same time for MS, Azure, AWS, Google, Facebook, Sony, EA and any random webiste, app service or whoever else wants to pay for it.

People use 3rd party data centers because they cover more countries and cities and are cheaper than to rent them to Azure or ASW, or own them yourself because they share cost between more apps/services/webs and cut middleman costs. And obviously they offer basically the same. The cost for their internet and electricity usage plus maintenance is pretty much the same for everyone, mostly depends on the country. And the hardware for PS Now servers is a custom one made by Sony.

Azure only is a software to manage this cloud of servers, as Amazon AWS and many other ones are. The cost of that license is a tiny portion of running the whole game streaming business. What Sony pays yearly for that is way smaller than what MS spends on getting 3rd party and indie games that debut on a month of game pass to name an example, and this is without considering what MS sacrifices in game sales for their 1st party games putting them there day one.


If it's a failure why MS copied it? And why Sony makes more money with their game subscriptions strategy and has more subscribers than MS without needing to throw billions to it and to sacrifice many dozens of millions of day one game sales?


There is no reason for MS to block Sony or anyone else for using DirectX on PC or something like that. If fact MS wants to have everyone using their APIs instead of alternatives like Vulkan. In fact Sony doesn't use DirectX at all on their PlayStations. Regarding the MS store being integrated in Windows doesn't matter if almost everybody use other ones like Steam, GoG or Epic Store instead.


Yup. I don't know the current exact sales, but as of now they should be ~2M units sold in PC + ~15?M units sold + some millions more who played it on PS Plus/PS Now/Play at Home/etc.

is honestly impossible to talk with you. again full of wrong things.

- it seems that you live in a parallel dimension.
xclouds is spread through hundreds of more server farms than psnow. there is a substantial difference in infrastructure
we all know what are farms...servers and racks Sony have to rent the space in server farms to turn on their PS3 racks ....and it cost money more space and racks you want around the world to reach more user and more it will cost and maintain. Ms own farms server and space and is probably the second biggest owner in the world. Sony it's not even listed. PS3 racks are in place (in addition to those in leased datacenters space) in the little infrastructure that Sony bought with OnLive.
Xcloud runs in data centers.that are up and working and making money for Ms already.

- Microsoft has no intention of blocking anyone from using its API but it is Ms who designs them and it is Ms who pushes their use on its Windows platform (with the obvious advantages that this entails). For this Direct3d won over opengl and DirectX over vulkan and directstorage will win against anything Nvidia has. Sony does not use directx but uses GNM and GNMX which he will not be able to use on PC which will increase development costs..and since Sony seems intent on releasing everything on PC either it will spend more or most likely the PS6 will no longer use those APIs, this is another striking example of the advantages of being owners of the Windows PC platform

etc etc etc

 

[yurinka]

xclouds is spread through hundreds of more server farms than psnow.

You live in a fantasy world. You have zero idea of the amount of servers that Xcloud and PS Now have because Sony and MS never mentioned them.

there is a substantial difference in infrastructure

No, cloud gaming works in the same way: there are servers streaming and clients who play on a console, PC or mobile.

servers and racks Sony have to rent the space in server farms to turn on their PS3 racks ....and it cost money more space and racks you want around the world to reach more user and more it will cost and maintain.Ms own farms server and space and is probably the second biggest owner in the world. Sony it's not even listed. PS3 racks are in place in the infrastructure that Sony bought with OnLive.

Both Sony and MS own 'farms' (you mean data centers), and in both cases most of the data centers they use aren't owned by them, but are outsourced to 3rd party data center companies whose cost for Sony and MS to rent that space is the same. And the internet, electricity, maintenance etc is the same too owning the datacenters or not. PS3 racks are totally unrelated to OnLive, Sony only got some patents from them when they already had PS Now running and in the market. PS Now was built by the Gaikai team, not OnLive.

- Microsoft has no intention of blocking anyone from using its API but it is Ms who designs them and it is she who pushes their use on its Windows platform (with the obvious advantages that this entails). For this they won the Direct3d on opengl l and DirectX on vulkan and directstorage will win against anything Nvidia has. Sony does not use directx but uses GNM and GNMX which he will not be able to use on PC which will increase development costs..and since Sony seems intent on releasing everything on PC either it will spend more or most likely the PS6 will no longer use those APIs, this is another striking example of the advantages of being owners of the Windows PC platform

Again, if MS wants other devs to develop for their platform and to use their APIs instead of the competition for APIs, they must provide them their best stuff they have and the same one they use, as they do. The only benefit it gives to MS is that they have access to it a few months before. And Sony ports old games so don't care too much about newest stuff. And well, other than the typical generational changes, they don't change a lot so don't care about getting access to the newest version some time later. Nowadays consoles are very similar to PCs hardware wise, so to port games is very easy and fast. The APIs are never an issue.

And no, Sony doesn't plan to port everything. Sony said they will keep porting some of their old games while others will remain exclusive to PS.

 

[MonarchJT]

You live in a fantasy world. You have zero idea of the amount of servers that Xcloud and PS Now have because Sony and MS never mentioned them.


No, cloud gaming works in the same way: there are servers streaming and clients who play on a console, PC or mobile.


Both Sony and MS own 'farms' (you mean data centers), and in both cases most of the data centers they use aren't owned by them, but are outsourced to 3rd party data center companies whose cost for Sony and MS to rent that space is the same. And the internet, electricity, maintenance etc is the same too owning the datacenters or not. PS3 racks are totally unrelated to OnLive, Sony only got some patents from them when they already had PS Now running and in the market. PS Now was built by the Gaikai team, not OnLive.


Again, if MS wants other devs to develop for their platform and to use their APIs instead of the competition for APIs, they must provide them their best stuff they have and the same one they use, as they do. The only benefit it gives to MS is that they have access to it a few months before. And Sony ports old games so don't care too much about newest stuff. And well, other than the typical generational changes, they don't change a lot so don't care about getting access to the newest version some time later. Nowadays consoles are very similar to PCs hardware wise, so to port games is very easy and fast. The APIs are never an issue.

And no, Sony doesn't plan to port everything. Sony said they will keep porting some of their old games while others will remain exclusive to PS.

inform yourself better
as for everything you wrote

"All the electrical and mechanical infrastructure at Microsoft datacenters keep the company’s more than 4 million servers in datacenters around the world operating with what’s known as “five nines” of reliability, or 99.999% of the time, Walsh noted.
“The server is the precious part,” she said."


"Currently, the company operates more than 200 datacenters, and that number continues to grow. To date, the company’s operating and planned datacenter footprint spans 34 countries around the world all networked together via more than 165,000 miles of subsea, terrestrial and metro optical fiber.
What’s more, Microsoft is slated to add datacenters in at least 10 more countries this year, and the company is on pace to build between 50 and 100 new datacenters each year for the foreseeable future, Walsh said."

 

[vkbest]

Also, you seem to forget one thing. This doesn't mean Sony will sell all their games on PC, these games are more like an appetiser for people to see the type of experiences they're missing by not having a Playstation. Offering some of your services on other platforms can act as a Trojan horse to actually sell more of your products. Apple Music exists on Android and Windows, but the premium experience is within the Apple platform. Youtube exists on iPhone, but its integration on Android with all the other Google services makes it enticing to switch (even though Google services are pretty good on iOS). MS is the only one playing differently, but that's because it's a win win situation for them. You sell your services on another platform and even if you don't get those people to switch, you will still have their money anyway.

lol, they are announcing more ports to PC on the last year than new games on PS5, they clearly have plans to porting the full catalog , after they will release the games at same time when they get several millions of PS5 sold, they are not openly discussing this to avoid people buying a PC instead PS5 or PS4

I can't understand what is the point on 2 or 3 years to buy a PS5 when you will be able to get a PC similar or even stronger at similar price and no need to pay PSN+ to play online every year, and get the full catalog from Microsoft, Steam, other stores and Playstation games. Its probably even if Steam Deck is successful we will see desktop products competing consoles.

 

[quest]

Horizon Zero Dawn’s PC launch sales ‘were nearly as large as The Witcher 3’s’ | VGC

Guerrilla’s game was also up 50% on Death Stranding, according to research firm…

www.videogameschronicle.com

So it couldn't Crack a million sales at 50 bucks with 120 million users. It got a few more sales at the bargain bin yippee. Call me when we see 2-3, million launch month. Until then it is lord gaben making the profits and sony long term losing by creating a super competitor that has every game ps and xbox at discounted prices since no buys games Until they are in the bargain bin on PC.

 

[yurinka]

inform yourself better
as for everything you wrote

"All the electrical and mechanical infrastructure at Microsoft datacenters keep the company’s more than 4 million servers in datacenters around the world operating with what’s known as “five nines” of reliability, or 99.999% of the time, Walsh noted.
“The server is the precious part,” she said."


"Currently, the company operates more than 200 datacenters, and that number continues to grow. To date, the company’s operating and planned datacenter footprint spans 34 countries around the world all networked together via more than 165,000 miles of subsea, terrestrial and metro optical fiber.
What’s more, Microsoft is slated to add datacenters in at least 10 more countries this year, and the company is on pace to build between 50 and 100 new datacenters each year for the foreseeable future, Walsh said."

Nothing you posted proved me wrong in anything. MS will 'operate' (notice they mention this verb instead of to 'own') this year datacenters in 44 countries. Which is normal, since they are a big corporation with a server cloud service and many cloud based apps. As an example, Tencent has 40 datacenters in China alone.

But there are around 200 countries in the world (Xcloud is supported in 26 of them and PS Now in 19) and cloud gaming requires to have the datacenter relatively way closer to have an optimal experience compared to the typical website, game server or app hosted in normal servers that are usually hosted in datacenters.

 

[MonarchJT]

Nothing you posted proved me wrong in anything. MS will 'operate' (notice they mention this verb instead of to 'own') this year datacenters in 44 countries. Which is normal, since they are a big corporation with a server cloud service and many cloud based apps. As an example, Tencent has 40 datacenters in China alone.

But there are around 200 countries in the world (Xcloud is supported in 26 of them and PS Now in 19) and cloud gaming requires to have the datacenter relatively way closer to have an optimal experience compared to the typical website, game server or app hosted in normal servers that are usually hosted in datacenters.

Ms owns and build their datacenters stop it
you being embarassing

Microsoft's virtual datacenter grounds 'the cloud' in reality - Source

The cloud is a globally interconnected network of millions of computers in datacenters around the world that work together to store and manage data, run applications and deliver content and services.

news.microsoft.com

 

[Kokoloko85]

Didnt the Nvidia leak also say Mario and some other Nintendo games were coming?

 

[reksveks]

Didnt the Nvidia leak also say Mario and some other Nintendo games were coming?

It was the shield ports I think for China

 

[kingfey]

Nothing you posted proved me wrong in anything. MS will 'operate' (notice they mention this verb instead of to 'own') this year datacenters in 44 countries. Which is normal, since they are a big corporation with a server cloud service and many cloud based apps. As an example, Tencent has 40 datacenters in China alone.

But there are around 200 countries in the world (Xcloud is supported in 26 of them and PS Now in 19) and cloud gaming requires to have the datacenter relatively way closer to have an optimal experience compared to the typical website, game server or app hosted in normal servers that are usually hosted in datacenters.

Are you understanding what you are typing?

There are tons of data centers in the world. Ms owns these data centers.

Microsoft currently operates more than 200 datacenters. Its currently operating and planned datacenters are located in 34 countries worldwide, networked with more than 165,000 miles of subsea cable, officials said.Apr 20, 2021

They aren't renting those data centers. They are using their own data centers. You are mistaken operate/planned to owning.

There are currently some data centers which is in the work, hence operating. Those data centers falls on planing section.

It doesn't change the fact that MS owns these data centers.

 

[yurinka]

Ms owns and build their datacenters stop it
you being embarassing

Microsoft's virtual datacenter grounds 'the cloud' in reality - Source

The cloud is a globally interconnected network of millions of computers in datacenters around the world that work together to store and manage data, run applications and deliver content and services.

news.microsoft.com

Are you understanding what you are typing?

There are tons of data centers in the world. Ms owns these data centers.

Microsoft currently operates more than 200 datacenters. Its currently operating and planned datacenters are located in 34 countries worldwide, networked with more than 165,000 miles of subsea cable, officials said.Apr 20, 2021

They aren't renting those data centers. They are using their own data centers. You are mistaken operate/planned to owning.

There are currently some data centers which is in the work, hence operating. Those data centers falls on planing section.

It doesn't change the fact that MS owns these data centers.

As usual in this kind of companies, they mention there that they operate these datacenters, not that they own them. It's because part of them are outsourced to 3rd party local companies who build and mantain them for different companies, obviously following the specs of whoever hires them.

You can hire this companies to have a certain amount of standards servers in their existing datacenters of certain country, or to send them your own servers and pay them to keep them and maintain them (part of the price includes bandwidth, electricity, maintenance, taxes...). Or paying more, depending on your volume needed, to keep or build a complete datacenter for you instead of the usual, which is sharing datacenters with more companies, where each one has there different servers running different services, apps, games, websites, etc of different companies.

In the case of my previous game company we started having a few servers for our games in our offices. After that we moved to ASW, Google Cloud or Azure changing between them every few months depending who offerered a better price/was a better fit for our needs. After that we moved to hire directly 3rd party data center companies to skip middleman costs.

 

[Jim Ryan other Clone]

So 2 million additional sales.

Which they wouldn't have If they weren't selling it at steam. That's money and Sony like every business want to make money, I don't understand why some people care where other people enjoy their game. You go to your home sit on your couch and play GOW and you enjoy it but why you care if other people can enjoy it in another ecosystem, how is that affecting people?

 

[MonarchJT]

As usual in this kind of companies, they mention there that they operate these datacenters, not that they own them. It's because part of them are outsourced to 3rd party local companies who build and mantain them for different companies, obviously following the specs of whoever hires them.

You can hire this companies to have a certain amount of standards servers in their existing datacenters of certain country, or to send them your own servers and pay them to keep them and maintain them (part of the price includes bandwidth, electricity, maintenance, taxes...). Or paying more, depending on your volume needed, to keep or build a complete datacenter for you instead of the usual, which is sharing datacenters with more companies, where each one has there different servers running different services, apps, games, websites, etc of different companies.

Microsoft own and build their datacenters where there are Microsoft employees inside stop being voluntarily obtuse.
This is not an argument you will win

 

[yurinka]

Microsoft own and build their datacenters where there are Microsoft employees inside stop being voluntarily obtuse.
This is not an argument you will win

I forgot to mention that in my current project during a few months we did use Azure for free until we had our own (internal servers) storage, because one of our project partners (the network engineer) also works for MS in his company so they give him a lot of free storage.

 

[adamosmaki]

You really need to remember that a PS5 is currently really powerful and not a half baked shit show like last gen. Buying a gaming PC is right now a nightmare. Why spend 1-2000 when you can spend 500 and play the games.

yeah because finding a ps5 at msrp (or even fimdimg one at all) at least here in EU is really easy.

 

[EDMIX]

doubtful.

That leak has shit like FF9 remake and KH4, most of that list simply doesn't sound like "soonish" lol

 

[kingfey]

As usual in this kind of companies, they mention there that they operate these datacenters, not that they own them. It's because part of them are outsourced to 3rd party local companies who build and mantain them for different companies, obviously following the specs of whoever hires them.

You can hire this companies to have a certain amount of standards servers in their existing datacenters of certain country, or to send them your own servers and pay them to keep them and maintain them (part of the price includes bandwidth, electricity, maintenance, taxes...). Or paying more, depending on your volume needed, to keep or build a complete datacenter for you instead of the usual, which is sharing datacenters with more companies, where each one has there different servers running different services, apps, games, websites, etc of different companies.

In the case of my previous game company we started having a few servers for our games in our offices. After that we moved to ASW, Google Cloud or Azure changing between them every few months depending who offerered a better price/was a better fit for our needs. After that we moved to hire directly 3rd party data center companies to skip middleman costs.

That still doesn't change the fact the owners are Microsoft.

Its like you own a house. You bought all furniture and everything, then you rent it to people.
Do people own your house now?

Everything on those data centers is owned by 1 company. Their employees are the ones who run those data centers. Your company have been only giving permission to use it.

 

[MonarchJT]

I forgot to mention that in my current project during a few months we did use Azure for free until we had our own (internal servers) storage, because one of our project partners (the network engineer) also works for MS in his company so they give him a lot of free storage.

exciting and we are proud of you. But the fact remains that Ms is in fact one of the top 3 players in the cloud market and owns datacenters. And as we said before this unlike other players who they are forced to deduct rental costs from their receipts, including Sony. That said, you can believe it or not or bend reality to your liking. let's change subject

 

[Nickolaidas]

Can we please unban Bryank75 right now?

You enjoy watching people suffer, don't you?

 

[Gameplaylover]

You enjoy watching people suffer, don't you?

Sure. But in this case i just wanted to see him insult Jim. Always funny as hell.

 

[yurinka]

exciting and we are proud of you. But the fact remains that Ms is in fact one of the top 3 players in the cloud market and owns datacenters.

Thanks. Yep, in fact they are top 2 in terms of market share.

That still doesn't change the fact the owners are Microsoft.

Its like you own a house. You bought all furniture and everything, then you rent it to people.
Do people own your house now?

Everything on those data centers is owned by 1 company. Their employees are the ones who run those data centers. Your company have been only giving permission to use it.

It depends on the case.

In some datacenters they outsource the job of building, managing and maintaining to a 3rd party datacenter company, but that big company (in this case MS) owns the datacenters. In other datacenters MS (or any other similar big company) does everything by themselves and own everything. In other datacenters MS (or whoever else) send their server racks (only if are custom made, like the PS Now or Xcloud ones, it isn't needed for standard ones) and rent space in a datacenter owned and managed by a 3rd party datacenter company. In all these 3 cases MS (or whatever company) operates them.

Smaller companies simply rent servers to other companies who provide this services (can be some like AWS or Azure, or other type of companies as can be ISPs or Wordpress or other), or instead only have some servers in their own offices. The thing is that small guys in many cases don't need or want data centers.

 

[kingfey]

Thanks. Yep, in fact they are top 2 in terms of market share.


It depends on the case.

In some datacenters they outsource the job of building, managing and maintaining to a 3rd party datacenter company, but that big company (in this case MS) owns the datacenters. In other datacenters MS (or any other similar big company) does everything by themselves and own everything. In other datacenters MS (or whoever else) send their server racks (only if are custom made, like the PS Now or Xcloud ones, it isn't needed for standard ones) and rent space in a datacenter owned and managed by a 3rd party datacenter company. In all these 3 cases MS (or whatever company) operates them.

Smaller companies simply rent servers to other companies who provide this services (can be some like AWS or Azure, or other type of companies as can be ISPs or Wordpress or other), or instead only have some servers in their own offices. The thing is that small guys in many cases don't need or want data centers.

Your 3rd party case is called renting.

Those 3rd party rent it from MS. Ms doesn't get in to their business.

Sony is one of those 3rd party.

What you are describing is like this. You own a building. A renter wants to lease your building, so you lease it to him. You open a store in that building, and pay that guy. That is what you are trying to argue here.

In this case, it doesn't make sense for MS.

Unless you really mean those 3rd party security guys. Those who partner with MS to handle other enterprise cloud business. In that case, MS has 0 business putting their business in those data centers.

Usually for these type of business, MS leases them a part of the datacenters, and they use the rest.

 

[Utherellus]

Horizon Zero Dawn - 1.35 mil for 50$
Days Gone - 1.60 mil for 50$
Death Stranding - 1.64 mil for 60$

Taken into account Steam's fee, regional prices and sales, if we roughly set average earning from each copy to be 30 bucks (DS not included because not a first party ip), Sony easily earned over 50-60 million with 2 ports.

That's a development budget for Zero Dawn.

It's a low effort, free money for sony. And they are just starting to warm up.

 

[Swift_Star]

I am amazed that a game with angry man, who kills gods as part time job, will hit 20m. I am very shocked.

Please look what god of war is about first, before you type that shit. Gow existed for a long time, and people play it for angry kratos. nothing else.

Lmao, you just lost yourself. maybe, just maybe, people like to have the experience of killing gods. Sorry, bud, you lost.

 

[kingfey]

Lmao, you just lost yourself. maybe, just maybe, people like to have the experience of killing gods. Sorry, bud, you lost.

I dont know what to tell you buddy.

It seems you are jumping around the topic.

Anyway, its time for me to stop this pointless argument, since you cant seem to understand the original topic.

 

[kingfey]

Horizon Zero Dawn - 1.35 mil for 50$
Days Gone - 1.60 mil for 50$
Death Stranding - 1.64 mil for 60$

Taken into account Steam's fee, regional prices and sales, if we roughly set average earning from each copy to be 30 bucks (DS not included because not a first party ip), Sony easily earned over 50-60 million with 2 ports.

That's a development budget for Zero Dawn.

It's a low effort, free money for sony. And they are just starting to warm up.

Not to mention, pc can still buy the game. Unlike consoles, pc games stays on the system for 20 years, unless developers removes it. So more money in the long run. Just like how gtav and skyrim still is making money to this day.

 

[Kenpachii]

Jimbo got hired to expand into asian markets. Because he was also the one that setup europe in the original days. It's pretty obvious after his interview that this is his goal.

Which makes sense as the entire industry is moving into those markets.

He thinks PC is the key focus for the asian market as consoles are simple to limited. Add with it streaming that's around the corner that basically will make brand recognition the most important factor for people to subscribe towards something ( same reason why microsoft banks on gamepass to people to know there ip's more), they need to push there brands forwards and make there ip's known. This is why u see them focus heavily already straight out of the gate on PC, with renaming company's to PC solutions and getting new company's setup to port games to PC in the first year of the PS5.

They will do all of this expansion while trying to keep there current console market as happy as they can, so i could still see delays on titles moving to PC for now but they will want to probably push there PC releases sooner and sooner to the point of being the same day to push more brand recognision on PC forwards as they can leech of the marketing and hype which was deader then dead with there PC ports they currently pushed. Honestly non of my PC buddy's is talking about god of war.

This is why i don't think 2 years delay will happen on newer titles as they want to release them as soon as possible after there console version or on the same day eventually, even if it costs them sales.

I think jimbo recognises that he's in a market thats stagntant for playstation even with there huge success in the PS4 area, new gamers aren't incoming. This is also why u probably see dad of war instead of god of war. God of war was cool for 12 year olds, dad of war is cool for 30 year olds. The market shifts for them and they need to branche out and with 80 euro games + PS5 being 500 euro's u are not going to reach younger kids like they once did with the PS2 that will stick around to see the next ip when they get older.

I would also not be shocked if they will branch out into mobile sooner or later also.

I think personally and this is for the entire market, that at the end of the PS5 generation we will pretty much see every big pc and console IP being focused around Asian themes.

 

[remember_spinal]

The last of us: Tokyo drift

 

[MonarchJT]

The last of us: Tokyo drift

i don't think that china India and that part of Asia love japanese stuff very much the opposite... especially china )

 

[Corndog]

So it couldn't Crack a million sales at 50 bucks with 120 million users. It got a few more sales at the bargain bin yippee. Call me when we see 2-3, million launch month. Until then it is lord gaben making the profits and sony long term losing by creating a super competitor that has every game ps and xbox at discounted prices since no buys games Until they are in the bargain bin on PC.

Not true. It’s the same as console. Some people buy at release, others wait for sales. Both generate income.

 

[Bryank75]

You and @Topher are messed up for that .


But I'm sure Bryank is probably laughing in good nature about this. Hopefully he returns sooner than later. Kinda miss the guy already.

Yo! I'm back....



(Appreciate the sentiment and kind words)

 

[reksveks]

You were missed Bryank75 for sure

 

[Bryank75]

You were missed Bryank75 for sure

But.... I'm a no good, troublemaker!

 

[kingfey]

But.... I'm a no good, troublemaker!

We missed you buddy. glad you are back.

 

[Kenpachii]

But.... I'm a no good, troublemaker!

Welcome back i think gaf missed you the most in the last few weeks.