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Opinion Analysis Retro Grew up loving JRPGs. Getting old hating them.

cireza

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Jun 1, 2014
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cyberpunk sold 13 million so it mean 13m people love it lol
Obviously the game has been a huge success and people enjoyed it.

You can turn it around in your head as much as you want, you don't sell 13 millions copies of a game while disappointing 13 millions. It simply does not exist. People around the internet are nothing, the vast majority of players don't talk about the games they play.

I watch movies, I buy many of them. But I have never participated I any forum nor posted about it, because movies are not my main point of interest. This behavior means that I am actually part of the majority of people who consume movies. The passionate minority is the one that is vocal on the internet. Not every single person who buys something is going to spend time saying to the world that he enjoyed it. People have other things to do in life.

I have many friends who play quite a lot of video games. They never posted anything about it on the internet. I am actually the only one in the group doing this. They all enjoyed FF XV by the way, and XIII as well.
 
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Kumomeme

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Obviously the game has been a huge success and people enjoyed it.

You can turn it around in your head as much as you want, you don't sell 13 millions copies of a game while disappointing 13 millions. It simply does not exist. People around the internet are nothing, the vast majority of players don't talk about the games they play.

I watch movies, I buy many of them. But I have never participated I any forum nor posted about it, because movies are not my main point of interest. This behavior means that I am actually part of the majority of people who consume movies. The passionate minority is the one that is vocal on the internet. Not every single person who buys something is going to spend time saying to the world that he enjoyed it. People have other things to do in life.

I have many friends who play quite a lot of video games. They never posted anything about it on the internet. I am actually the only one in the group doing this. They all enjoyed FF XV by the way, and XIII as well.
yes. it sell a lot and lot of people enjoyed it. but doesnt mean it doesnt have it share of flaw. thats what i keep saying. despite people enjoying it, doesnt mean it doesnt have any critism and that did happen. nobody turn it around in someone head, except someone here.

Not every single person who buys something is going to spend time saying to the world that he enjoyed it.

where have you been? did you check on social media? you have no idea. tons of it. you can check on fb, twitter, youtube, etc. even FFXV has tons of people praise it, stated how they love the game which is also same for those who heavily throw critism. it is wrong to assume those people just voiced negative opinion. just because you didnt participate doesnt mean majority of people are like you. you clearly didnt see it. sure, lot of people not actively participate in forum but social media is different. it is more accessible and you gonna be suprise at how much it can be. ofcourse not everyone participate but no matter how much the fraction is, if a game is good, the vocal voice gonna be good. if it bad, they gonna shitting on the game. it is that simple. on this aspect, FFXV has both. it has very mixed reception.

I have many friends who play quite a lot of video games. They never posted anything about it on the internet. I am actually the only one in the group doing this. They all enjoyed FF XV by the way, and XIII as well.
no offense but you friend not represent everyone. you should not judge solely by people around you. try to compare on broader view. we got social media for example. try to view the communty as whole. i know this because i also like you. but doesnt mean people like us has no place. you just need to seek proper place. for example there tons of active group on facebook. final fantasy, jrpg etc there are hundreds or thousand of people there that passionate unlike our friend. at right place you can see the overall reception which is gonna more or less gonna mirror overall concensus. not to mention for casuals, they didnt see things same way. people can be too hard to please but at same time they also can be easily satisfied.
 
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Amiga

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Jul 8, 2020
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Dragon Quest XI was mild fun but cmon now the game was too easy and there was no strategy in the combat.
DQ was a hold out for tradition. but SE realized the franchise needs an evolution when they announced the new game.

Nioh and Souls are new age JRPGs.

Persona 5 evolved the traditional turn based format and eliminated a lot of the things that slow down the experience. it's very fast to go from character missions to dungeon battles.
on the other hand I couldn't get into Divinity/Tides of Nomuria/Pillars of Eternity but they were so archaic in design and slow.
 
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SlimeGooGoo

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For the golden age of JRPGs, the combat is perfectly suited to the game as a whole. What specifically changed about the genre was a lack of narrative focus and pacing and an extreme tidal wave of mind-numbing filler shit with no dramatic urgency, which is a problem with modern production pipelines and its touched every other genre too. No combat system in the world is enough to fix a shit game, especially a game like FFXV that has no real clue what it wants to be.
Agreed.
I want more of the same, but with good story and characters. Today games are designed with fear of not selling enough, and so they appeal mostly to the coomer and weaboo audience first and foremost.

To add salt to the wound, most developers artificially prolong the game's lenght with long and boring cutscenes and characters interactions that add literally nothing to the enjoyment or comprehension of the plot.

This implies that developers had some TODO that required the game to last some 40+ hours, and they came up with filler just to achieve that goal and be able to market that, because otherwise the lenght would be reduced to some 15 hours or so.

In the past games like FF7 would normally take some 30~40 hours to beat, but all that time was worthwhile.
 

killatopak

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Aug 29, 2013
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Opposite for me.

More into platformers and actions games and learned to love and now prefer RPGs
 
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Arsic

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Dec 30, 2020
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Tales of Arise started out with some unique plot, albeit familiar territory.

JRPGs at the time were being made for a teen audience, and the majority to this day still are. In Japan these tropes etc are acceptable to them.

The issue is too many of these devs haven't realized the western audience is their primary target market, and most jrpg fans at this point are not in their teens. The ones who recognize this just flat out fail to create worlds, characters, and stories that resonate with western audiences that have matured.

I would say my favorite jrpg in a hot minute is Nier Automata followed by Persona 5. Nier is quite unique in many facets and is absolutely a must play to see endings CDE.
 

rofif

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drunk the simpsons GIF
drunk dog GIF
At least it tried some other stuff instead of bloat + random crap encounters waste of time
 
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cireza

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eitherway fact is fact
Facts are facts indeed. A mixed game does not have metacritic or opencritic scores of 80. Mixed = 50. A mixed game does not sell 9 millions copies. These are actual facts, your arguments certainly not.

People here also believe they hold the truth about the Sonic franchise. It is exactly the same situation. Keep dreaming...
 
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wzy

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Dec 29, 2018
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Tales of Arise started out with some unique plot, albeit familiar territory.

JRPGs at the time were being made for a teen audience, and the majority to this day still are. In Japan these tropes etc are acceptable to them.

The issue is too many of these devs haven't realized the western audience is their primary target market, and most jrpg fans at this point are not in their teens. The ones who recognize this just flat out fail to create worlds, characters, and stories that resonate with western audiences that have matured.

I would say my favorite jrpg in a hot minute is Nier Automata followed by Persona 5. Nier is quite unique in many facets and is absolutely a must play to see endings CDE.

Have you met the Western audience? These people are routinely brought to tears by Captain America. I don't think maturity level is the problem.
 
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Kumomeme

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Facts are facts indeed. A mixed game does not have metacritic or opencritic scores of 80. Mixed = 50. A mixed game does not sell 9 millions copies. These are actual facts, your arguments certainly not.

People here also believe they hold the truth about the Sonic franchise. It is exactly the same situation. Keep dreaming...
my argument based on fact. metacritic and copies sold not reflect overall quality. by this logic COD is damn good game and people loving it lmao.

whatever. choose and denied what comfort you. just saying that it is not wrong to enjoy something while acknowledge the flaw.
 

wOs

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Sep 20, 2020
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I think in a way I lucked out not being into rpgs when I was younger. I love them now and not only have a decent back catalog, but I'm not burnt out either.

im currently really enjoying tales of arise.
 
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BlackTron

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Jun 30, 2016
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The only RPG that I played through with random encounters was Pokemon on game boy, and I was resistant to the game before all my siblings managed to suck me into it. Most JRPGs I would not be able to stick it out till the end.

The genre is too tedious and doesn't respect your time. My first one was Mario RPG which only starts a battle when you touch an enemy. This is a big reason one of the only other RPGs I've finished is Grandia 2 which works the same way, and that's back when I was 15.

Today the idea of trying to navigate a dungeon while being stopped every 10 paces for a random battle is nauseating. I don't even want to try or check out a game like that, but it's not really getting old I think. I always disliked it and just have even less patience for it now.

So if you don't like JRPGs, congratulations, now you can do something else with all that time you were throwing away tapping the A button.
 
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SkylineRKR

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I think there are JRPG, and there are JRPG. I used to like a wider amount of them back in the PS1 and PS2 days but since then I grew to dislike more and more. I generally like FF, DQ, Tales Of when they're good (I skipped Zestiria after trying the first few hours for example, skipped Berseria altogether). And I hated FFXV. But I really enjoy playing Arise, and I had a decent time with FFVII R though I do find it a bit shallow and overrated.

Games I avoid are those Atelier, Ar Tonelico games. And basically anything from NIS. I just hate their art style and stuff, its too weeb for me. Tales of is kind of the limit I can fathom and I think with Berseria they already overdid it.
 

Corgi1985

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Dec 31, 2020
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Lol pokemon is babys first video game. It isn't even an rpg because it requires no player decisions since it has no difficulty and nothing worth exploring. Awful series made by hack developers
 

Isa

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I was kind of there, but much younger. I went through a phase where I greatly disliked Japanese design, but not all of it. It was when my friends and I started getting into table top roleplaying. Western rpgs began to start being really damn good, and offered more choice. So that, and all the grim dark resonated with us instead of the usual kids save the world/universe. Deep down I'd keep buying and supporting jrpgs I liked even though I backlogged them because I knew my tastes would once again change. It took some time, I even stopped with anime for a good while.

But man did I swing back around hard, and I really love where I am at personally. I can love all styles of games regardless of their regional or stylistic differences. I can hop from Xenoblade Chronicles to Wasteland and Fable and Fallout, to 13 Sentinels, Persona, SMT, Neptunia, Atelier, DQ, and back to The Witcher, Elex, Divinity, Baldur's Gate etc. I've not been happier because I no longer struggle with cognitive dissonance about whichever style I think is "superior". I can just enjoy something for what it is. And I've noticed a few things about myself. I really prefer Jrpgs. There is a ton of variety in game design and especially art, which is what helps set these games apart for me. I love unique art that draws me in to a world, especially worlds that I'd actually prefer to live in, most western games tend to be horrible grimdark affairs that bring me down too much, and there is already enough problems IRL that I'd rather take a break from.

One of the complaints I see leveled at Jrpgs is the tropes, but something they handle well is how the story is told and characters are handled. Most stories are just reskins of what came before, sure there are some unique experiences every now and then and its important to recognize that. But there is nothing wrong for wanting to enjoy some comfort food. Its one of the reasons I love me some Musou games, I love the power fantasy seeing cool characters clear the map of mobs. Also, there are plenty of modern Jrpgs that have evovled with the times, letting players save more frequently and see enemy encounters on the field. Also plenty of difficulty options for those wanting to breeze through the game, or enjoy a more difficult experience.

I recommend taking a good lengthy break, play other genres, then when something finally catches your eye, and you get that hankering, you'll have a blast. That's what I did and it payed dividends.
 

Ceadeus

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Jun 22, 2013
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We're about to hit 2022 and it baffles me we are still getting "new" (turn-based) JRPGs with exactly the same battle system + random encounter mechanics from 35 years ago or so. If it wasn't for modern graphics, you'd be hard-pressed to spot the difference between dungeon gameplay from back then, to one now.

I'm not that fed up about the predictable characters, towns, predictable "save the world" stories (although for once it would be nice to have a more personal story where you save your friend/family/town only). I'm just pissed an AI could probably be programmed to produce the gameplay aspects of a full RPG in (probably) mere minutes.

Create a plain dungeon> scatter a bunch of easy enemies, repeatedly fight the same enemies, scatter some treasure in different corners to attract MORE random encounters and increase your playtime. And there you have it. The only meaningful fight will be the boss - but even that will most likely be a breeze cos you were forced to grind/level up with the other encounters.

Instead of all these easy/repetitive fights that take so much time and are of no challenge, why not make a dungeon that has only 5 or 6 quality battles? Each one lasting about 5-8 minutes each, with unique enemies that make you reassess your team/equipment/tactics. Enemies that have SOME degree intelligence, reacting to what equipment you're wearing, or that are faster/stronger in certain terrain/weather etc etc. Battles that have been given thought and attention to by the devs. None of these ideas are mindblowing, but how lazy is it to only develop decent boss fights (which make up around 5-10% of game time), and feed the player fucking fodder for the rest of the 90%?
That's some pretty good ideas actually
 
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DZ_b_EZ

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For me, it's about the horrible quality of the overall writing, especially the dialogue. There's no substance in most of these JRPGs and its like all Japanese high schoolers get a chance to write for a video game. I'm tired of it.
 

Life

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The only RPG that I played through with random encounters was Pokemon on game boy, and I was resistant to the game before all my siblings managed to suck me into it. Most JRPGs I would not be able to stick it out till the end.

The genre is too tedious and doesn't respect your time. My first one was Mario RPG which only starts a battle when you touch an enemy. This is a big reason one of the only other RPGs I've finished is Grandia 2 which works the same way, and that's back when I was 15.

Today the idea of trying to navigate a dungeon while being stopped every 10 paces for a random battle is nauseating. I don't even want to try or check out a game like that, but it's not really getting old I think. I always disliked it and just have even less patience for it now.

So if you don't like JRPGs, congratulations, now you can do something else with all that time you were throwing away tapping the A button.

Well put. The older I got, the more aware and sensitive I became regarding my time. When I see that a game is blatantly disrespecting my time, it frustrates me cos it's much more valuable than the purchase itself. When you're younger, you don't think about things like that as much - which is probably why I enjoyed JRPGs more then.
 
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iHaunter

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We're about to hit 2022 and it baffles me we are still getting "new" (turn-based) JRPGs with exactly the same battle system + random encounter mechanics from 35 years ago or so. If it wasn't for modern graphics, you'd be hard-pressed to spot the difference between dungeon gameplay from back then, to one now.

I'm not that fed up about the predictable characters, towns, predictable "save the world" stories (although for once it would be nice to have a more personal story where you save your friend/family/town only). I'm just pissed an AI could probably be programmed to produce the gameplay aspects of a full RPG in (probably) mere minutes.

Create a plain dungeon> scatter a bunch of easy enemies, repeatedly fight the same enemies, scatter some treasure in different corners to attract MORE random encounters and increase your playtime. And there you have it. The only meaningful fight will be the boss - but even that will most likely be a breeze cos you were forced to grind/level up with the other encounters.

Instead of all these easy/repetitive fights that take so much time and are of no challenge, why not make a dungeon that has only 5 or 6 quality battles? Each one lasting about 5-8 minutes each, with unique enemies that make you reassess your team/equipment/tactics. Enemies that have SOME degree intelligence, reacting to what equipment you're wearing, or that are faster/stronger in certain terrain/weather etc etc. Battles that have been given thought and attention to by the devs. None of these ideas are mindblowing, but how lazy is it to only develop decent boss fights (which make up around 5-10% of game time), and feed the player fucking fodder for the rest of the 90%?
Have you tried Nier: Automata?