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Google to lay off 12,000 staffs

Bernkastel

Ask me about my fanboy energy!
The cuts will affect 6% of Alphabet's workforce worldwide, in teams including recruitment and engineering.
...
This comes days after Microsoft announced 10,000 jobs would be lost, and weeks after Amazon announced 18,000 job cuts.
This was hinted back in September last year
 

Nobody_Important

“Aww, it’s so...average,” she said to him in a cold brick of passion
I saw this and its awful. Loads of tech companies like Google, Amazon, and others saw the 2020 lockdowns alongside the sudden rise in dependency on tech and tech related services and invested heavily under the assumption that the dependency would continue. And it has held true in certain areas, but not across the board. The same mistakes were made in the gaming sectors because people were stuck inside and had nothing else to do. various companies saw the surge and thought it was the new standard. Time has passed and those new players/customers have gone away as time has passed.


Combine all that with an across the board financial recession? You get layoffs. Particularly in the tech sector which thought this would be a new age of tech and internet dependency and in many ways it is. I myself order online more than ever since 2020 for my groceries and other common goods. However its not the new world order that some of these places seem to have expected.


I hope everyone lands on their feet in a place that can save their current way of life.
 

Panajev2001a

GAF's Pleasant Genius
I saw this and its awful. Loads of tech companies like Google, Amazon, and others saw the 2020 lockdowns alongside the sudden rise in dependency on tech and tech related services and invested heavily under the assumption that the dependency would continue. And it has held true in certain areas, but not across the board. The same mistakes were made in the gaming sectors because people were stuck inside and had nothing else to do. various companies saw the surge and thought it was the new standard. Time has passed and those new players/customers have gone away as time has passed.


Combine all that with an across the board financial recession? You get layoffs. Particularly in the tech sector which thought this would be a new age of tech and internet dependency and in many ways it is. I myself order online more than ever since 2020 for my groceries and other common goods. However its not the new world order that some of these places seem to have expected.


I hope everyone lands on their feet in a place that can save their current way of life.
Mistakes or did they think that starting to hire rapidly under pressure (Take Advantage of Lockdown!!!!) is easy or efficient or effective. Hiring takes a toll on teams, it takes months for people to be truly effective (despite what some people will tell you, there is only so much you can solve with documentation and tooling to ease onboarding unless the company is very very efficiently setup and communication/transparency is not a problem)… yes the market increased but most companies started late in hiring and had impossibly high expectations. If you hired tons of people only to take advantage of the lockdowns you a.) did it late/ineffectively and b.) you likely knew these layoffs were coming.

Thinking that you can maintain similar margins after the pandemic is not miscalculation, either the leadership is incredibly dumb or they knew… problem with non private companies is that shareholders do not really give a crap and they expect profit margins to stay so employees get the chop, product lines get cut, etc… in some cases you will kill good products / investments and fire great people because they do cost more on the payroll…
 
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feynoob

Banned
Will apple and other big techs layoff in huge numbers too?
The market isn't getting healthy, if we keep getting these numbers.
 

akimbo009

Gold Member
I read on Reddit that Google employees literally had to go to the office and use their badge to see if it worked or not. If it didn't, it meant you were fired.

Fucking wild.

They really fucked this one up. MS was tone deaf, and Google seems have basically fired any new staff and any making X dollars - including recently promoted and long tenured talent. Just absolutely stupid and arbitrary - managers didn't even know their teams were being impacted until the person was gone. That's madness.

They also are making massive profits still so it's hard to say this was really needed. Just lemming behavior running off cliffs. Leadership - thank God - didn't get a pay cut....
 

Mesousa

Banned
Let’s remember, layoffs come with severance packages and unemployment. Not to mention, some of these companies help get people employed at other companies. It’s not good but it’s also not as terrible as a car company laying people off that don’t have degrees.
Its even worse in many cases because tech companies are full of people on H1B who will literally be sent back to the third world if they cant quickly replace their job. At least a car company worker in most cases will still be able to be in driving distance of friends if they lost their job.
 

daffyduck

Member
Its even worse in many cases because tech companies are full of people on H1B who will literally be sent back to the third world if they cant quickly replace their job. At least a car company worker in most cases will still be able to be in driving distance of friends if they lost their job.
Besides, a degree doesn't mean what it used to.
 

pramod

Banned
If youve been on sites like Blind, you probably wont feel sorry for these people, just saying.

Yes most of them are smart. But a lot of them are also spoiled overpaid entitled tech bros. And trust me they wont have any problems finding new jobs with Google on their resume.
 
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Mesousa

Banned
If youve been on sites like Blind, you probably wont feel sorry for these people, just saying.

Yes most of them are smart. But a lot of them are also spoiled overpaid entitled tech bros. And trust me they wont have any problems finding new jobs with Google on their resume.


Of course they will. the average tech department of an insurance company, or even a "Technical" bank like Capital One is a fiefdom where guys are just bringing in folks from their hometowns(usually overseas) or school.The only people who cream over these google/netflix/apple companies for the most part are VC-funded start ups who think they will turn water into wine by getting a bunch of FAANG engineers. VC money has dried up too.

L6's who were making 500k are going to fight it out with everybody else for 150k jobs at best, and they better pray the competition isnt manager's buddy from back home's son or daughter. Take off 25k from that 150k job too if you arent in a major metro.
 

pramod

Banned
If hes been at Google for 16 years, hes prob worth tens of millions from stock alone.

So, yeah, that evil faceless company sure did him wrong.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
If hes been at Google for 16 years, hes prob worth tens of millions from stock alone.

So, yeah, that evil faceless company sure did him wrong.
Exactly.

If he was still an employee, he wouldnt be doing that post. He'd still be working there making big bucks from that faceless corporation he made bank on for 16 years.

Work hard, play hard, paid hard. It goes with the territory. People shouldn't complain when they should be aware of the company and industry. The guys been a tech bro for 16 years and now he realizes it?

"Live life, not work"

Easy to say when a techie makes big bucks. And if Google is a faceless slave master, he sure didn't mind doing it for 16 years.
 

pramod

Banned
Of course they will. the average tech department of an insurance company, or even a "Technical" bank like Capital One is a fiefdom where guys are just bringing in folks from their hometowns(usually overseas) or school.The only people who cream over these google/netflix/apple companies for the most part are VC-funded start ups who think they will turn water into wine by getting a bunch of FAANG engineers. VC money has dried up too.

L6's who were making 500k are going to fight it out with everybody else for 150k jobs at best, and they better pray the competition isnt manager's buddy from back home's son or daughter. Take off 25k from that 150k job too if you arent in a major metro.

Yeah u have a point. I remember a few years back i interviewed at some.obscure tiny startup and the CTO was some kid who looked like he just graduated and then he told me he worked at Google for a year before getting hired as "CTO"..then it all made sense.
 
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Aesius

Member
Of course they will. the average tech department of an insurance company, or even a "Technical" bank like Capital One is a fiefdom where guys are just bringing in folks from their hometowns(usually overseas) or school.The only people who cream over these google/netflix/apple companies for the most part are VC-funded start ups who think they will turn water into wine by getting a bunch of FAANG engineers. VC money has dried up too.

L6's who were making 500k are going to fight it out with everybody else for 150k jobs at best, and they better pray the competition isnt manager's buddy from back home's son or daughter. Take off 25k from that 150k job too if you arent in a major metro.
150k jobs?

Holy fuck. Do those come with directions to the nearest soup kitchens and homeless shelters?
 

akimbo009

Gold Member
If hes been at Google for 16 years, hes prob worth tens of millions from stock alone.

So, yeah, that evil faceless company sure did him wrong.

Not likely. It's not like he was there pre-IPO. Well off, but unlikely anything you describe.

Tech pays, but this is the third major lay off it's seen in 20 years - dotcom, 2008, and now this. It's a high pressure high risk space with some folks doing very well but not most.

Either way, 16 years at Google doesn't make someone a millionaire by default, let alone tens of millions.
 
Not likely. It's not like he was there pre-IPO. Well off, but unlikely anything you describe.

Tech pays, but this is the third major lay off it's seen in 20 years - dotcom, 2008, and now this. It's a high pressure high risk space with some folks doing very well but not most.

Either way, 16 years at Google doesn't make someone a millionaire by default, let alone tens of millions.

16 years mean they are likely high in level. base salary > 200k and that's before stock options. SDM salary band is also higher than an SDE

even without stocks, 16 x 200k = 3.2 mil (pre-tax obviously). but still, their salary is likely getting at least doubled by RSUs

they'd have to mismanage their money pretty badly to not have at least a couple mil in the bank between cash and stocks over 16 years

i've been working at a FAANG company (won't say which) for the last 6 years, for what it's worth
 
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JayK47

Member
The trades are in very short supply. So learn a trade I guess. Move out of the city and into a small town where a decent plumber, electrician, or handyman is in desperate need. At least that is what my parents say in their small town. Cities are no longer the place to be it seems. Crime, homelessness, and now no jobs.
 

Aesius

Member
The trades are in very short supply. So learn a trade I guess. Move out of the city and into a small town where a decent plumber, electrician, or handyman is in desperate need. At least that is what my parents say in their small town. Cities are no longer the place to be it seems. Crime, homelessness, and now no jobs.
Good luck convincing someone who made $300k+ in a tier 1/2 city to take an apprenticeship making 1/10th of that in a town with nothing but fast food restaurants and Dollar Generals.
 

Mesousa

Banned
Good luck convincing someone who made $300k+ in a tier 1/2 city to take an apprenticeship making 1/10th of that in a town with nothing but fast food restaurants and Dollar Generals.


Its easier when all the workers are on H1B and live under constant fear of being shipped to the third world. They'd do anything to stay....the perfect sheeple I suppose.
 

BadBurger

Is 'That Pure Potato'
Working in this industry is wild. I know a guy who interned with us, went to work at Twitter and got laid off, then hired at Google. I just checked with him on Discord, and he's OK, but he knows a few who got laid off.

He's basically just a programmer but has worked in data science for both.

Small fucking world. Like I always tell them: just work in IT. You do basically the same work, over less hours, for the same pay. Screw being a software engineer. Not worth it.
 

ReBurn

Gold Member
Working in this industry is wild. I know a guy who interned with us, went to work at Twitter and got laid off, then hired at Google. I just checked with him on Discord, and he's OK, but he knows a few who got laid off.

He's basically just a programmer but has worked in data science for both.

Small fucking world. Like I always tell them: just work in IT. You do basically the same work, over less hours, for the same pay. Screw being a software engineer. Not worth it.
It's totally worth it to be a software engineer. It can be a very rewarding career. Creating things and seeing people use them to make their lives somehow easier or better is amazing.

Even with these layoffs there are still a couple hundred thousand open software engineering jobs in places in the US that are not west coast Silicon Valley companies. There still aren't enough software engineers out there to fill demand. So some of the software engineers let go from these massive companies may have to relocate, but I imagine the majority will be just fine. And I know from personal experience there are much better places to work than Google.
 

BadBurger

Is 'That Pure Potato'
It's totally worth it to be a software engineer. It can be a very rewarding career. Creating things and seeing people use them to make their lives somehow easier or better is amazing.

Even with these layoffs there are still a couple hundred thousand open software engineering jobs in places in the US that are not west coast Silicon Valley companies. There still aren't enough software engineers out there to fill demand. So some of the software engineers let go from these massive companies may have to relocate, but I imagine the majority will be just fine. And I know from personal experience there are much better places to work than Google.

Good fucking point man
 

akimbo009

Gold Member
16 years mean they are likely high in level. base salary > 200k and that's before stock options. SDM salary band is also higher than an SDE

even without stocks, 16 x 200k = 3.2 mil (pre-tax obviously). but still, their salary is likely getting at least doubled by RSUs

they'd have to mismanage their money pretty badly to not have at least a couple mil in the bank between cash and stocks over 16 years

i've been working at a FAANG company (won't say which) for the last 6 years, for what it's worth

I am a sr manager at one of these companies, I get it.

If they bought a house anywhere near Google HQ with a family that money is as good as gone.

It's ridiculous to make assumptions. Like I said, they are well off, but 16 years and now laid off doesn't imply much about anything except that they don't have a job anymore (and hopefully - like everyone - has at least 6 months of savings to weather storms).
 

LordCBH

Member
Ain’t gonna get any easier this year either. But the real shit storm will hit when automation and AI can fully replace 75% of the workers these companies employ, which is absolutely their goal.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
Working in this industry is wild. I know a guy who interned with us, went to work at Twitter and got laid off, then hired at Google. I just checked with him on Discord, and he's OK, but he knows a few who got laid off.

He's basically just a programmer but has worked in data science for both.

Small fucking world. Like I always tell them: just work in IT. You do basically the same work, over less hours, for the same pay. Screw being a software engineer. Not worth it.
I dont do tech, but I enjoy reading all the ups and downs articles you get from tech companies. The dom com bust was the best which was the greatest hoopla of exuberance with zero business plans in history. I bet a square block of moms and dads running bakeries or pottery stores in ancient Rome had more business sense what to do with their cash.

The only time you get such wild swings in other industries is when there's a commodity collapse (lets say oil takes tumble), global financial crisis (banks shutting down), or maybe Walmart or Amazon is doing their annual PR about hiring tons of people for the Xmas rush. But other than those rare instances, you dont get companies in other industries every week wildly hiring or firing. Other industries typically need a big event to make things happen.

With tech, the economy might be humming along and next thing you know Yahoo Finance says tech company X is laying off 30% of workers and the stock drops 50%. So wild westy.
 
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taylor34

Neo Member
I work in this industry and recently changed jobs in the past year. These are my thoughts:

1) They're not going to have any issues finding high paying jobs. Like zero. A lot of these companies who are firing people are actually still hiring, lol. I think a lot of this is a coordinated effort by the big players to try and knock down salaries some. They have so much money in the bank, there is little reason to make such cuts unless you're trying squeeze the workers bargaining power. I have recruiters calling/contacting me EVERY day for a job. Most people have no comprehension of being in an industry that's so in demand that you're getting called daily. Yes, even this week I was contacted multiple times.

2) The guy is right, so many people think their job is life or death, and then when they cut out of the blue after a couple decades they're just lost. You should care about your company as much as they care about you. No more, no less. And in most companies, that level is care is so small that you shouldn't care at all.

3) Most of the time, you know who the employee's worst enemy is? Themselves. It's because they get comfortable in a job and don't ever look for other options again, even though the job might be 10x better and the salary 25% to 50% higher. My old employer said "everyone back in the office 3 days a week minimum, no exceptions". I was like ok, I'll just go get a raise from someone else and work remotely full time for them. Most people won't do that, they'll just bend to the employer. The employers have no leverage currently, the sooner people realize that the better. I would bet that a large portion of the people laid off this week will get a raise and even better job than they had at Google, and wonder why they didn't do it sooner. You have some overpaid people, but in these large corporations there are vast amounts of underpaid people who have been there for years and have been getting subpar raises.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
I work in this industry and recently changed jobs in the past year. These are my thoughts:

1) They're not going to have any issues finding high paying jobs. Like zero. A lot of these companies who are firing people are actually still hiring, lol. I think a lot of this is a coordinated effort by the big players to try and knock down salaries some. They have so much money in the bank, there is little reason to make such cuts unless you're trying squeeze the workers bargaining power. I have recruiters calling/contacting me EVERY day for a job. Most people have no comprehension of being in an industry that's so in demand that you're getting called daily. Yes, even this week I was contacted multiple times.

2) The guy is right, so many people think their job is life or death, and then when they cut out of the blue after a couple decades they're just lost. You should care about your company as much as they care about you. No more, no less. And in most companies, that level is care is so small that you shouldn't care at all.

3) Most of the time, you know who the employee's worst enemy is? Themselves. It's because they get comfortable in a job and don't ever look for other options again, even though the job might be 10x better and the salary 25% to 50% higher. My old employer said "everyone back in the office 3 days a week minimum, no exceptions". I was like ok, I'll just go get a raise from someone else and work remotely full time for them. Most people won't do that, they'll just bend to the employer. The employers have no leverage currently, the sooner people realize that the better. I would bet that a large portion of the people laid off this week will get a raise and even better job than they had at Google, and wonder why they didn't do it sooner. You have some overpaid people, but in these large corporations there are vast amounts of underpaid people who have been there for years and have been getting subpar raises.
And that's the great thing about tech. The industry has so much demand, you have the luxury of people calling you for jobs. I do finance. Aside from occasional recruiters contacting me on Linkedin because they saw my profile, I'm getting contacted maybe once a quarter from them. And most contact I get is from me initiating it with job applications. So it's up to me being proactive scoring a new job. Most industries I'll guess are more similar to my career than techies getting constant calls.

As for the life or death job part, that's probably an industry issue. The whole bring your home life to work, and bring your work home ordeal. Where it seems tech people seem to meld personal life and politics with the office. Most office workers in general go to work, get paid, and go home. Aside from occasional evening or weekend work to finish a job you're falling behind on (I do it too sometimes), only tech workers seem to have this chummy home+work intertwining where if if the company fires them or makes a stand on something, it becomes a giant stink or personal insult. Most people in other office jobs sitting in a front of a monitor would react more subdued. But a tech worker will go on social media complaining about the company and bosses like it's everyday course of business. You dont get the average bank worker or guy working at Nike or Coke doing the same kind of thing even if they hit with layoffs too.
 
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GeekyDad

Member
I work in this industry and recently changed jobs in the past year. These are my thoughts:

1) They're not going to have any issues finding high paying jobs. Like zero. A lot of these companies who are firing people are actually still hiring, lol. I think a lot of this is a coordinated effort by the big players to try and knock down salaries some. They have so much money in the bank, there is little reason to make such cuts unless you're trying squeeze the workers bargaining power. I have recruiters calling/contacting me EVERY day for a job. Most people have no comprehension of being in an industry that's so in demand that you're getting called daily. Yes, even this week I was contacted multiple times.

2) The guy is right, so many people think their job is life or death, and then when they cut out of the blue after a couple decades they're just lost. You should care about your company as much as they care about you. No more, no less. And in most companies, that level is care is so small that you shouldn't care at all.

3) Most of the time, you know who the employee's worst enemy is? Themselves. It's because they get comfortable in a job and don't ever look for other options again, even though the job might be 10x better and the salary 25% to 50% higher. My old employer said "everyone back in the office 3 days a week minimum, no exceptions". I was like ok, I'll just go get a raise from someone else and work remotely full time for them. Most people won't do that, they'll just bend to the employer. The employers have no leverage currently, the sooner people realize that the better. I would bet that a large portion of the people laid off this week will get a raise and even better job than they had at Google, and wonder why they didn't do it sooner. You have some overpaid people, but in these large corporations there are vast amounts of underpaid people who have been there for years and have been getting subpar raises.
Denzel Washington Yes GIF by SAG Awards


Thank you. Saved me from having to write all that shit (which no one would heed). But companies across industries started doing this at least two years ago.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
He's apparently getting 48 weeks of salary, accelerated share vesting, his 2022 bonus, paid vacation time, and six months of healthcare.

I think he'll be fine.
And he'll likely get a job quickly. So all that pay out is a bonus. It's like hitting the lottery.

I highly doubt Google has a clause in the severance package (some do this) that if you get a new job, the pay out is stopped immediately. Some places will dole out severance bit by bit as opposed to a lump sum.
 

Bernkastel

Ask me about my fanboy energy!
Remember when Elon fired 3,500 employees and the world was on fire for a month?

This week the FAANG boys and MS fired like, what.. 40,000 people often overnight and nobody gives a shit.
Before Musk joined, Twitter had 7,500 employees. Now, they have 1,300 working(of which 550 are full time engineers) and 1,400 non-working employees. In comparison, Google had 150,000 employees and Microsoft 229,000 employees. The latter actually hired more than they fired. Twitter never had 10,000 employees to fire.
 
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Nobody_Important

“Aww, it’s so...average,” she said to him in a cold brick of passion
Remember when Elon fired 3,500 employees and the world was on fire for a month?

This week the FAANG boys and MS fired like, what.. 40,000 people often overnight and nobody gives a shit.
Yeah it turns out when you compare completely different situations there are completely different reactions. Crazy I know.
 
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BadBurger

Is 'That Pure Potato'
I dont do tech, but I enjoy reading all the ups and downs articles you get from tech companies. The dom com bust was the best which was the greatest hoopla of exuberance with zero business plans in history. I bet a square block of moms and dads running bakeries or pottery stores in ancient Rome had more business sense what to do with their cash.

The only time you get such wild swings in other industries is when there's a commodity collapse (lets say oil takes tumble), global financial crisis (banks shutting down), or maybe Walmart or Amazon is doing their annual PR about hiring tons of people for the Xmas rush. But other than those rare instances, you dont get companies in other industries every week wildly hiring or firing. Other industries typically need a big event to make things happen.

With tech, the economy might be humming along and next thing you know Yahoo Finance says tech company X is laying off 30% of workers and the stock drops 50%. So wild westy.

I really don't know how to explain it to outsiders. It pays absurdly well, but then, if you're not in the right position your job can be gone in a day.

There's many days that I wish I was project manager or something. Anything but an engineer. I just do IT these days but half my job is still writing code, and I know some kid would relish my job for half my pay.

Hell. Getting old right? Seeing your eventual obsolescence. *shrug*
 

EverydayBeast

thinks Halo Infinite is a new graphical benchmark
Google is loaded with money and tech this tells you they’re just like any other average company.
 

akimbo009

Gold Member
I really don't know how to explain it to outsiders. It pays absurdly well, but then, if you're not in the right position your job can be gone in a day.

There's many days that I wish I was project manager or something. Anything but an engineer. I just do IT these days but half my job is still writing code, and I know some kid would relish my job for half my pay.

Hell. Getting old right? Seeing your eventual obsolescence. *shrug*

It's a lot of this. Tech moves incredibly fast. Not just what products it drives but the underlying way to use technology. As engineers we are also driven to constantly improve and automate, which means "I can replace you with a script" joke always has some truth to it.

Further, this shit breaks - a lot. So we're often on call and getting pages at some point of our careers so we can be called in to fixed or otherwise resolve a problem after hours. This means we don't get the luxury to just "leave it at home". I have had that once, and it was a completely weird feeling. These jobs often have more in common with nursing or ERs than other industries which makes it really incestuous but all incompasing.

So yeah, when you build thing you love and sacrifice your evenings, weekends and holidays to be on call or get paged unexpectedly you develop an odd relationship with your job.

It's hard to explain to those not in it - all they see is the upside - but the salaries are support with the talent but also paying for the uncertainty and constant pressure people have in this industry (those who don't adapt get fired or layed off as we see).
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
I really don't know how to explain it to outsiders. It pays absurdly well, but then, if you're not in the right position your job can be gone in a day.

There's many days that I wish I was project manager or something. Anything but an engineer. I just do IT these days but half my job is still writing code, and I know some kid would relish my job for half my pay.

Hell. Getting old right? Seeing your eventual obsolescence. *shrug*
When I hear about how great tech pay, I dont know how common all those awesome $150,000-200,000 jobs are. And I dont know what the typical starting salary is for a new grad, but all I know is in my industry (the type of shit you see selling at Walmart and grocery stores), that kind of money is Director level. You're a seasoned vet and got probably at least 5 people working for you, in which those people (middle managers) also have people working for them. And a new grad student being a sales rep or junior analyst might get $50,000-60,000. There is no way any kind of starting role hits $100,000 that fast.

The only individual people who might make that kind of money are top end senior account managers. Aside from them, no common other function makes that kind of money as a solo worker. You got to be a manager of some kind. Ok, there are some roles that might also make good money like senior tax guys and the legal team. But for the common kinds of roles and departments, it's not common to have swaths of young individual workers all making $150,000+.

As for being a project manager, I have no experience with that except from what I've heard from people I know who do it for a living as a seasoned vet. It can pay shit loads of money. And it has nothing to do with tech. One friend I know makes over $200,000 doing it and she has nobody reporting to her. She does her own thing ensuring new production runs flow smoothly from start to finish. Not a quick and dirty job as it can take years for a project to finally work. But it pays a lot.
 
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