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George RR Martin's latest blog post has broken me.

Loope

Member
I can't wait to read that book during my breaks from Star Citizen.
Animated GIF
 

IDKFA

Gold Member
Not really, if there was no publisher supervision the most common situation was that he didn't write much at all, if anything. It looks like there are no penalties for him for not delivering the book, so why should he rush. It looks like he also likes each new, shiny project he undertakes. Probably part of that is his desire NOT to work on Winds.

Wonder why there has been no publisher supervisor, or at least some form of contract to get the book out in a reasonable time frame?

I understand your point. I haven't read the rest of this series but I have read more than enough to know that just about any book series is going to have to cut a lot of things out for a movie or tv series. I've also heard about the various characters and such that the show never touched on.

At the same time, I don't think it's realistic to expect the books pulled off the shelves if Martin says Winds (or book 7) will never come out. Book series are left unfinished all the times. TV series and planned movie sequels are canceled yet the seasons/movies that were made are still for sale physically and/or digitally.

It's absolutely realistic when the author has been promising a completion to the series. The paperback version of Dance came with a sample chapter of Winds. When George announced the Folio society editions of ASOIAF (which are over £135 per book) he confirmed that the Folio society would also release editions of Winds and Dream. Basically people have invested a lot of time and money expecting this series to be completed.

George might not be legally obliged to finish the series, but he is morally obliged to do so. Not doing so is a huge dick move and will forever tarnish his reputation.
 

Croga

Member
Brandon Sanderson would be a poor fit for ASOIAF. The only author I think could do it justice would be Joe Abercrombie.

I was taking the piss to be fair, Brandon Sanderson is just a machine when it come to churning out content. :messenger_winking:

I do like your pick though to be serious about it, Joe's book are quality.
The First Law trilogy is one of my favorites, he writes very memorable characters.
 

frontovik

Banned
Surprisingly the books are quite forgettable. TV series was entertaining until Battle for Castle Black.

Old fart Martin can procrastinate as much as he wants really.
 

6502

Member
More likely that he will finish the story in a comic series than finish these books.

It wouldn't be so bad if the TV series ending hadn't been such an abortion.
 

Cyberpunkd

Gold Member
Wonder why there has been no publisher supervisor, or at least some form of contract to get the book out in a reasonable time frame?
It all depends on when the contract was concluded - if it was already when he was a huge star (so maybe after the first three books, or after the fourth one) there was probably a lot of competition to sign him for the remaining ones, and thus he could (or rather - his agent could) negotiate little oversight and no penalties for publication.
I see all the books are published by Bantam Spectra, which is a division of Random House - they are probably furious since if they paid him a huge upfront payment it's basically money wasted.
 

Bragr

Member
So apparently Martin has confirmed that he is writing content that is more different from the show than previously thought. It looks more and more likely that the stuff he told the show writers are getting changed.

Too bad he will never finish it.
 

DeepEnigma

Gold Member
So apparently Martin has confirmed that he is writing content that is more different from the show than previously thought. It looks more and more likely that the stuff he told the show writers are getting changed.

Too bad he will never finish it.
I would hope so, the last two seasons were forgettable.
 

Fbh

Gold Member
So apparently Martin has confirmed that he is writing content that is more different from the show than previously thought. It looks more and more likely that the stuff he told the show writers are getting changed.

Too bad he will never finish it.

You telling me he has a better story than that of Bran the broken?

Oh No Omg GIF by WWE
 

Blade2.0

Member
You telling me he has a better story than that of Bran the broken?

Oh No Omg GIF by WWE
i mean, that could have been cool if it was executed better. going form the kid getting pushed out the window to king of all is a pretty sweet come up. again, if the execution wasn't such dog shit.
 

nkarafo

Member
If he wants to finish the book, is he forced to respect the bullshit of season 8? Personally, i declared that season as a non-canon dream or something.
 
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Cyberpunkd

Gold Member
So apparently Martin has confirmed that he is writing content that is more different from the show than previously thought. It looks more and more likely that the stuff he told the show writers are getting changed.
This is and always was the most likely explanation:
The show ending is actually the real ending he had in mind, and the reception to it was... lets say, not great.

He is having to re-think and rewrite the pathways for a huge cast of characters towards a different ending than the show has, because he realised fans didn't like it. It's taking a lot of time.
I wouldn't say it's the case of fans "didn't like it", imagine the shitstorm that will happen if he publishes the book which is EXACTLY like the TV show that ended years ago. It's not that the show was bad (it was), but rather all will see him as a liar telling for years how his books were going to end differently.

If he wants to finish the book, is he forced to respect the bullshit of season 8? Personally, i declared that season as a non-canon dream or something.
The TV series ended exactly as he wanted to end the books, his mistake was that he probably shared it with the writers a few years back thinking he will have the books out first, and not understanding TV series production is a really efficient and fast operation.
 

nkarafo

Member
The TV series ended exactly as he wanted to end the books, his mistake was that he probably shared it with the writers a few years back thinking he will have the books out first, and not understanding TV series production is a really efficient and fast operation.
If that's the case than the books' would also be shit?
 

Kenpachii

Gold Member
Ending of game of thrones was solid.

Main problem the series had was the way they reached the end, they rushed things that shouldn't have been rushed and they gave plot armor to far to many characters. It was just badly done.
 

Kenpachii

Gold Member

Its true, bran was always the best to lead, dude is basically build for it.
The dragon lady was going down in flames anyway, for the simple fact it was foreshadowed already multiple times. She can't rule for shit and everybody hates her at the end.
John snow being the assassin was kinda shit, dude had to die already ages ago but they kept him alive for the simple fact he was populaire. That little assassin god mode chick should have stabbed her at the end pretending to be her brother/father or whatever.
Ice king dying by the assassin chick was also solid, only the way the fight was done and it ended so rapidly instead of dragging it forwards for a season was just stupid. Most of the last seasons was like doing nothing, then fast forwards ultra speed mode, just badly directed and made.

Honestly the end is solid and exactly what u would want it to be. The execution was just garbage.
 

Thaedolus

Gold Member
There's no Night King in the books, so all of that shit won't be in it.
There is a something called a “Great Other” (or something like that, because damn how long has it been since I read these books?) which I thought was sorta supposed to be what the Night King was in the show. But who knows at this point. I’ll probably need to be content to know essentially how everything ends, regardless of how poorly the showrunners rushed the job.

I did see a rumor that Rothfuss was maybe getting close to finishing the final Kingkiller Chronicle but we’ll all probably be dead by then too.
 
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Madflavor

Member
Ending of game of thrones was solid.
I mean you say that but then go on to explain it was both rushed and badly executed. I know you’re saying some of the ideas were good, but they weren’t just badly executed. They were really really really badly executed. Characters behaved monumentally stupid to the point of character assassination, just to rush and move the plot forward.

I disagree about Arya killing the NK. Bad idea and DnD admitted they did it just because it’d be a surprise. As a result Jon Snow, the character who’s been the biggest driving force for the White Walker plot, the one who’s had multiple stare downs with the NK, did basically nothing the entire Battle of Winterfell. That should’ve been Jon’s episode. His whole path had led him to that battle.

Instead the episode focuses so damn much on Arya, and she gets the kill. She also gets the kill in a ridiculous fashion. It was such a disappointment.

Subverting expectations should never take precedence over the natural conclusion to a character’s arc. Because when it does you get Game of Thrones Season Fucking 8.
 

gatti-man

Member
Sounds like he’s probably rewritten large parts of the book and is pretty unhappy with it. I wouldn’t expect to see it until he dies when someone publishes his unfinished works.
 

bender

What time is it?
I read the first three books in 2002. What an amazing experience that was.

Everything related to ASOIAF since then has been miserable. I gave up, switched to the TV show, vented my frustrations during the final two season trainwreck, and moved on.
 

Fools idol

Member
being really honest here, the latest book was actually pretty bad.

Considering how incredibly good the first 3 books in the series were, George really dropped the ball by trying to introduce way too many characters and the whole fucking slog that goes on in the Iron Islands, Jesus Christ. I'd rather garotte myself with cheese wire than read through that shit ever again, it was dull as sewage water.

Winds of Winter has a lot to live up to, and a lot to 'save' in my opinion. I think he realised mid way through writing it that the show and fandom had new expectations heavily pressuring him to hurry the fuck up as well as meet a legion of new fans expectations vs book fans expectations as well.

I personally liked the show, truly, again up until the show surpassed the books. It just felt lost, and the plots all got too messy and rushed.

It's a prime example of when something gets rushed to make more money it is going to ruin everything.
 

Lasha

Member
Is George RR Martin still planning to split the next book into two volumes? I absolutely hated that approach since you can end up reading an entire novel before getting back to the "viewpoint" you want to see. I enjoyed the POV style when the number of characters was fewer. I think its up to like 25+ now and its too unwieldy. Martin's bloated writing style further exacerbates the slog. I want to know how the series ends but I have serious doubts that the books ever get finished.
 

IDKFA

Gold Member
Is George RR Martin still planning to split the next book into two volumes? I absolutely hated that approach since you can end up reading an entire novel before getting back to the "viewpoint" you want to see. I enjoyed the POV style when the number of characters was fewer. I think its up to like 25+ now and its too unwieldy. Martin's bloated writing style further exacerbates the slog. I want to know how the series ends but I have serious doubts that the books ever get finished.

I agree. First three books are some of the greatest fantasy books ever written. Feast was also good, just not on par with the previous three. Dance was a big drop in quality, and I think you nailed the issue being he spilt all the POVs between two books, plus decided to add a load more.

Winds needs to be Storm of Swords level of quality for me to get excited, and by all accounts it absolutely should be. All main POVs will be in this book, plus he's set up some fantastic action set pieces that the show didn't even hint at (Krakens could be making an appearance in a large sea battle).

However, although I'm sure we'll see Winds, we're probably not going to see Dream. He needs to finish Fire and Blood part 2, wants to write more Dunk and Egg novels and also help HBO with their cinematic universe. Not to mention all the other stuff he has on his plate.

ASOIAF should be his main priority. It's his Magnus Opus. His defining work. Everything else should be second place to ASOIAF.
 

Lady Jane

Member
ASOIAF should be his main priority. It's his Magnus Opus. His defining work. Everything else should be second place to ASOIAF.

This is what I don't understand. He's 73. What is more money going to do for him at this point? Why is he accepting all these projects being thrown at him? Every time he makes his yearly excuse, he brings up new projects I haven't heard about yet. He keeps piling it up while at the same time, saying "Don't worry, my focus is on the last two books." It doesn't add up.

I'm not asking for the new books for myself, I'm doing it for him. I want his legacy to be sealed. Series that don't get finished are pushed aside in a couple decades. No one cares about another author doing it and they only read them for closure. When people bring up ASOIAF, they need to say "What a tale that was!" not "Oh that's the series that didn't get finished, right?"

It's going to be telling if Rothfuss finishes the Kingkiller Chronicles (an arguably better written work of medieval fantasy) in the same amount of time it took for GRRM to write one book.
 
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At his health, he has 10 years max.
Get out of here with that nonsense. You don't know the full extent of his medical conditions, so I don't think it appropriate to be giving him a time limit. Now that Game of Thrones has concluded I'm sure he'll worry about these books people are so fond about.
 

Lady Jane

Member
Get out of here with that nonsense. You don't know the full extent of his medical conditions, so I don't think it appropriate to be giving him a time limit.

To be fair, I did edit it out before you posted. Though people at his weight rarely hit 80.

Now that Game of Thrones has concluded I'm sure he'll worry about these books people are so fond about.

I don't understand what you're trying to say here? He's also still working on other shows.
 
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Ending of game of thrones was solid.

Main problem the series had was the way they reached the end, they rushed things that shouldn't have been rushed and they gave plot armor to far to many characters. It was just badly done.

Yep. Dont believe the hype on prophecy so Arya knifing NK was always good to me. The Daenarys turned needed 1 full season to developed.
 
To be fair, I did edit it out before you posted. Though people at his weight rarely hit 80.

I don't understand what you're trying to say here? He's also still working on other shows.
He doesn't seem that obese in comparison to many Americans I've seen. I'm sure a year or two on the SlimFast diet will iron him out. So he's working on House of the Dragon aswell? That's just foolish, why would they need him when I'm sure they have the budget behind it?
 

Lady Jane

Member
He doesn't seem that obese in comparison to many Americans I've seen. I'm sure a year or two on the SlimFast diet will iron him out. So he's working on House of the Dragon aswell? That's just foolish, why would they need him when I'm sure they have the budget behind it?

He's an executive producer & writer for House of the Dragon and two more unannounced TV movies that will be GoT spinoffs. I'm not joking.
 
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winjer

Member
Get out of here with that nonsense. You don't know the full extent of his medical conditions, so I don't think it appropriate to be giving him a time limit. Now that Game of Thrones has concluded I'm sure he'll worry about these books people are so fond about.

The average male life expectancy, in the USA is 74.5 years. He is 73 years old.
And he is not a particularly fit person. Probabilities are not on his side.
 

Raven117

Gold Member
He loves cinema and loves to work alongside it. I think he likes it more than writing Winds of Winter. He wants his world and legacy to be on the screen.

He's 73 years old, and I think the TV show finishing his story before he could do it with the books absolutely destroyed his drive.

I fell in love with the first 3 books, but after the Stark rebellion was done, it never got back to the same highs. I always felt like he should have written the Stark story as the main story and ended the series when it was done. At this point, there are too many characters, too many plot holes, too much to write and consider.
Same thing happened to me. After the third book, I put it all down (everything GoT) and just said, nah. I’m done.

Lots of good stuff to read out there OP.

Maybe they should just get Brandon Sanderson to finish it for him.
 
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Bitmap Frogs

Mr. Community
He got into a huge mess of characters and plots and has no willpower to fix it.

Truth is, a dance of dragons is barely readable, as is.

You just need to surrender yourself to the truth: 3 amazing books, two so-so books and the rest was written by the HBO staff.
 
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