Support NeoGAF

[Ezekiel_]

Fortnite Video Game Maker Epic Games to Pay More Than Half a Billion Dollars over FTC Allegations of Privacy Violations and Unwanted Charges

Epic will pay a $275 million penalty for violating children’s privacy law, change default privacy settings, and pay $245 million in refunds for tricking users into making unwanted charges

The Federal Trade Commission has secured agreements requiring Epic Games, Inc., creator of the popular video game Fortnite, to pay a total of $520 million in relief over allegations the company violated the Children’s Online Privacy Protection Act (COPPA) and deployed design tricks, known as dark patterns, to dupe millions of players into making unintentional purchases.

The FTC’s action against Epic involves two separate record-breaking settlements. As part of a proposed federal court order filed by the Department of Justice on behalf of the FTC, Epic will pay a $275 million monetary penalty for violating the COPPA Rule—the largest penalty ever obtained for violating an FTC rule. Additionally, in a first-of-its-kind provision, Epic will be required to adopt strong privacy default settings for children and teens, ensuring that voice and text communications are turned off by default. Under a separate proposed administrative order, Epic will pay $245 million to refund consumers for its dark patterns and billing practices, which is the FTC’s largest refund amount in a gaming case, and its largest administrative order in history. [...]

 

[adamsapple]

and deployed dark patterns to dupe millions of players into making unintentional purchases:

They saw Fifa's Ultimate Team and thought .. why not ..

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

I like how their fines are basically the equivalent of 3 AAA game budgets. Epic stay winning.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

So...wich is worse....MTXs vs cinematic games?......

 

[Nvzman]

That's honestly kind of bizarre to me considering Fortnite has probably some of the most pro-consumer practices in its genre. Despite being free-to-play, you earn vbucks for free in free tiers, you can refund purchases in the store, both of vbucks and actual cosmetics I believe, and the pricing in general isn't very expensive. It's better and more forgiving than most $60/$70 paid games with battle pass + point store shit. I wonder if this is because of its rating, because if CoD was rated T or E I think it would definitely deserve this degree of scrutiny more, that game is significantly more predatory in its attempts to get you to buy shit, even down to its matchmaking algorithm.

 

[adamsapple]

So...wich is worse....MTXs vs cinematic games?......

What kind of a comparison is that lol

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

What kind of a comparison is that lol

Exactly!!!???!

 

[Gamer_By_Proxy]

Dang! They might actually notice that leave their bank account.

 

[adamsapple]

Exactly!!!???!

Then why make it in a thread not about cinematic games at all ?

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Then why make it in a thread not about cinematic games at all ?

Oh. Because of the other thread...some dumb-dumb said cinematic games are more hurtful to the industry

When clearly MTXs/Gaas, and the normalization of realising unfinished, unpolished games is actually a fucking problem.

 

[Pejo]

Maybe that's one less timed exclusivity deal they can afford.

 

[Dr.Morris79]

Another scummy company, whats new.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

What's "dark patterns"?

 

[Banjo64]

What's "dark patterns"?

Fuck knows but as someone who had a 10 year old who was obsessed at the time alongside all of his friends and cousins, there was definitely something cult like about the need for them to constantly consume the latest skins (yes I did just say no). Fuck knows what they did.

 

[dem]

That's honestly kind of bizarre to me considering Fortnite has probably some of the most pro-consumer practices in its genre. Despite being free-to-play, you earn vbucks for free in free tiers, you can refund purchases in the store, both of vbucks and actual cosmetics I believe, and the pricing in general isn't very expensive. It's better and more forgiving than most $60/$70 paid games with battle pass + point store shit. I wonder if this is because of its rating, because if CoD was rated T or E I think it would definitely deserve this degree of scrutiny more, that game is significantly more predatory in its attempts to get you to buy shit, even down to its matchmaking algorithm.

This.

My kid has mistakenly bought things in fortnite and the return was a breeze. Its built into the game.

 

[Ezekiel_]

What's "dark patterns"?

From the link :

Illegal Dark Patterns
In a separate administrative complaint, the FTC alleged that Epic used dark patterns to trick players into making unwanted purchases and let children rack up unauthorized charges without any parental involvement. The complaint alleged that Epic:

Used dark patterns to trick users into making purchases: The company has deployed a variety of dark patterns aimed at getting consumers of all ages to make unintended in-game purchases. Fortnite’s counterintuitive, inconsistent, and confusing button configuration led players to incur unwanted charges based on the press of a single button. For example, players could be charged while attempting to wake the game from sleep mode, while the game was in a loading screen, or by pressing an adjacent button while attempting simply to preview an item. These tactics led to hundreds of millions of dollars in unauthorized charges for consumers.

Charged account holders without authorization: Children and other users who play Fortnite can purchase in-game content such as cosmetics and battle passes using Fortnite’s V-Bucks. Up until 2018, Epic allowed children to purchase V-Bucks by simply pressing buttons without requiring any parental or card holder action or consent. Some parents complained that their children had racked up hundreds of dollars in charges before they realized Epic had charged their credit card without their consent. The FTC has brought similar claims against companies such as Amazon, Apple, and Google for billing consumers millions of dollars for in-app purchases made by children while playing mobile app games without obtaining their parents’ consent.

Blocked access to purchased content: The FTC alleged that Epic locked the accounts of customers who disputed unauthorized charges with their credit card companies. Consumers whose accounts have been locked lose access to all the content they have purchased, which can total thousands of dollars. Even when Epic agreed to unlock an account, consumers were warned that they could be banned for life if they disputed any future charges.

Epic ignored more than one million user complaints and repeated employee concerns that “huge” numbers of users were being wrongfully charged. In fact, Epic’s changes only made the problem worse, the FTC alleged. Using internal testing, Epic purposefully obscured cancel and refund features to make them more difficult to find.

As part of the proposed administrative order with the FTC over the company’s unlawful billing practices, Epic must pay $245 million, which will be used to provide refunds to consumers. In addition, the order prohibits Epic from charging consumers through the use of dark patterns or from otherwise charging consumers without obtaining their affirmative consent. The order also bars Epic from blocking consumers from accessing their accounts for disputing unauthorized charges.

 

[Wildebeest]

That's at least ten times more than they have spent on their free game giveaways.

 

[AlteredForms]

Hopefully they'll start concentrating on Unreal Tournament now. A man can dream!

 

[StreetsofBeige]

From the link :

Thanks.

Never played Fortnite. Even if I did, thank god I dont do mtx nor have my CC on file. What a scummy game. For all the self serving PR Tim Sweeney does trying to make it sound like Epic is the most consumer friendly game company out there, you sure wont see Tim Sweeney's face responding to this in a video.

 

[Lupin3]

This.

My kid has mistakenly bought things in fortnite and the return was a breeze. Its built into the game.

Did they change anything? My son did purchase stuff by mistake early on, and if you didn't stay on the same page you couldn't return the item unless you spent 1 of 3 (per year) allocated return tokens. I remember you bought stuff instantly by pressing a button. No "are you sure", no "press and hold to buy". Though you did have to press and hold to return said item. Those were some shitty practices.

 

[kikkis]

Why not go after MS and Sony for their store refund policies? Compared to refunding in fortnite, MS/Sony stores are like sith level dark patterns.

 

[Holammer]

full twitter thread

Epic signed a settlement with the FTC covering their concerns with Fortnite item shop features, refunds, and parental permissions. Here's detail on how we've been evolving Fortnite since 2017, as well as thoughts all game developers should consider.
Developers should dig into the topic, as this settlement reflects state of the art American regulatory practice, for example now applying principles similar to the UK Age-Appropriate Design Code to voice chat defaults.
In-app purchasing is also a hot topic, with rigorous expectations of "Affirmative Express Consent" for purchases made both in real money and paid virtual currency.

Great to see deceptive business practices like dark patterns getting talked about. We've all run into them at some point, like when you try to unsubscribe from a paid subscription.
Some asshole made the process difficult on purpose in a way only Douglas Adams could have dreamt up. When you finally figure it out, "we're sad to see you go", offer a questionnaire and a discount on your next subscription.

 

[dem]

I found Microsoft far more scummy with gamepass removals.

My kid unknowingly bought games that we had installed from gamepass, and then got removed from the service. I emailed Microsoft for a refund and they refused.

I've since removed my credit card from my microsoft account.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

It is a two way street.

Companies can be scummy for allowing purchase be made too easy by kids.

But also its the parents responsibility to not have a credit card linked to an account for easy buying. It doesn't matter if its one click or 3 clicks to buy mtx. Dont have your CC online, or do what every site does not saving credentials, it asks for a password etc.... I dont even have my CC info saved on websites. For me I just dont want it there in case my account gets hacked. So if I can do it, so can any parents with kids with itchy trigger fingers. There's way to prevent kids from doing this. Now if your kid is that dickish going into your wallet when you're not looking and inputting your CC info manually to buy something that's another level of idiocy. But for a lot of these mass spending sprees by kids it seems the parent left their CC info on file with no parental controls.

 

[drotahorror]

Why not go after MS and Sony for their store refund policies? Compared to refunding in fortnite, MS/Sony stores are like sith level dark patterns.

cuz Fuck Epic

 

[tusharngf]

275 million is like nothing for EPIC.. couple months of MTX

 

[flying_sq]

That's it? At least make it a billion.

 

[Heisenberg007]

But FTC has no authority?

Good to see regulators in action and doing their job -- regulating stuff.

 

[64bitmodels]

fines towards these companies should be larger. epic is a very valuable company, fining them 500 million is nothing. for a corproation at their stature they should be paying 50 billion

 

[Fuz]

fines towards these companies should be larger. epic is a very valuable company, fining them 500 million is nothing. for a corproation at their stature they should be paying 50 billion

 

[nikolino840]

How the software knows who's playing? I think very few games chat is off by default...but i think you can set directly with the console idk

 

[DeepEnigma]

Oh. Because of the other thread...some dumb-dumb said cinematic games are more hurtful to the industry

Give me a link so I can laugh at the possible shill plant retard.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

Give me a link so I can laugh at the possible shill plant retard.

If anything Sony is doing more damage to the medium with how much it pushed the cinematic linear approach through the past decade.

 

[Dick Jones]

The real question is why would a Sony subsidiary go after Epic?

We need proper regulation and guidance for developers on mtx. Nintendo, Sony, Microsoft and Valve need to agree to a standard that self regulates until governments catch up.

 

[jakinov]

Thanks.

Never played Fortnite. Even if I did, thank god I dont do mtx nor have my CC on file. What a scummy game. For all the self serving PR Tim Sweeney does trying to make it sound like Epic is the most consumer friendly game company out there, you sure wont see Tim Sweeney's face responding to this in a video.

They’ve actually already addressed many of these issues months back. I’m unsure if they knew this would happen back then or not.

https://www.epicgames.com/fortnite/...ite-purchase-cancellation-and-social-settings

 

[DeepEnigma]

So, does the money go to the people they suckered and impacted, or more in the bureaucratic pockets?

 

[LordCBH]

What do they mean by dark patterns?

 

[Ezekiel_]

So, does the money go to the people they suckered and impacted, or more in the bureaucratic pockets?

245$ million to consumers : https://www.ftc.gov/fortnite

 

[DeepEnigma]

245$ million to consumers : https://www.ftc.gov/fortnite

It should all go to the consumers. Not less than half.

 

[DonkeyPunchJr]

Uh oh Epic, time for some virtue signaling to distract people away from this negative PR:

 

[Reizo Ryuu]

dark patterns sounds like some Cthulhu shit

 

[jakinov]

It should all go to the consumers. Not less than half.

The half that goes to consumers goes to refunds related to the “dark patterns”. The other half is fined for violating COPPA. They are being fined for two separate things. One is like give back the money you owe, the other is here’s some punishment for not following government rules.

 

[DeepEnigma]

The half that goes to consumers goes to refunds related to the “dark patterns”. The other half is fined for violating COPPA. They are being fined for two separate things. One is like give back the money you owe, the other is here’s some punishment for not following government rules.

I understand that, what I don't agree with is the palms that will be getting greased. Never have and never will.

 

[demigod]

Apple and Google are the bad guys remember? Tim Swiney would never trick kids.

 

[vpance]

FTC so good at protecting children. Maybe the FBI should hire them for some tips.

 

[Spukc]

Uh oh Epic, time for some virtue signaling to distract people away from this negative PR:

i would fuck that kankle from that yellow top like there is no tomorrow
maybe ask miss wheels for a tug during cool down.

 

[lh032]

small changes for EPIC lol

 

[Barakov]

Pocket change given how much Epic rakes in on the regular from Fortnite.

 

[lukilladog]

Make it exemplary, 2 billion.

 

[buenoblue]

I always wonder where the money from these "fines" go?