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Days Gone Director John Garvin Says Metacritic Score Is Everything to Sony

sackings

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pretty dangerous standard if u ask me. There is game journos out there now that will dock points now if your game isnt woke enough for them. Could be the best game ever made gameplay wise but if its lacking any kind of societal commentary they wont drop that 10 on you.
 
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Flutta

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death stranding has a metascore of 82 now.
thats why sony and kojima relation have turned cold?

this 'metascore is everything' sony, means we wont get 2nd chance games like nier automata? :messenger_astonished: 🤞
We dont know the ins and outs with whats happening with Koji and Sony.
Im gussing it has nothing to do with the meta but more with how the game performed sales wise. You dont have to be a genius to figure that out.

But hey troll away i guess 😝
 

Dr Kaneda

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They are literally all third person action adventures? Some have open worlds, some don't. Some are more focused on the action, some aren't.

Am I missing some games?
So you believe something like GOW is as similar to TLoU2 as Iron is similar Avengers?

Even in films, the genre "action adventure" encompasses a variety of differing films. For example Avengers is considered and action adventure film but so is something like Dunkirk. Are Dunkirk and Avengers the same type of film? Spacker.

Yeah you're definitely missing something but it's not games, it's a brain.
 
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Dr Kaneda

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death stranding has a metascore of 82 now.
thats why sony and kojima relation have turned cold?

this 'metascore is everything' sony, means we wont get 2nd chance games like nier automata? :messenger_astonished: 🤞
Death Stranding won loads of GOTY awards, the most of any game that year. DS was polarising among big US reviewers (like IGN) but it got loads of 100/100. Days Gone was general outright average across the board. The two aren't the same.
 

yurinka

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According to @davidjaffe DG sold about 5 mil.
At the end of 2019 yes, it was at around 5M PSN users (+/- 10% error margin, also consider it's users and not sales so includes 2nd accounts in the same console, 2nd hand, etc). As of November 2020, when they changed the store for PS5 that number was around 9M PSN users:

https://gamstat.com/games/Days_Gone/

But remember, these are users and not sales. Sales should be smaller.
 
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josephgamer

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Days Gone game director also says don’t complain that the game doesn’t have a sequel if you didn’t support it at release

 
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MrS

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Days Gone game director also says don’t complain that the game doesn’t have a sequel if you didn’t support it at release

Sorry but this guy talks too much shit for having delivered a really mediocre game, one that launched in awful shape. Days Gone got the sales and reception it deserved - it only became worth playing long after launch when they put more work in to it. His game is a textbook example of one you shouldn't buy at launch so I don't think we should put much stock in to what he says. Sounds extremely bitter.
 
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BPX

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The Daily Show Wow GIF by The Daily Show with Trevor Noah
 

assurdum

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Sorry but this guy talks too much shit for having delivered a really mediocre game, one that launched in awful shape. Days Gone got the sales and reception it deserved - it only became worth playing long after launch when they put more work in to it. His game is a textbook example of one you shouldn't buy at launch so I don't think we should but much stock in to what he says. Sounds extremely bitter.
Seriously. I understand the passion around his work but Christ. This game was full of development issues even until the past year, abysmal loading time, glitches which stuck the game progression, but the problem was the players who didn't supported it to launch and the lower metacritic score? For real? Did he has ever played it at least? Because I start to have some doubt.
 
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Durien

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I wish they could make a sequel. I just finished it and plat'd. My FIRST plat and I have been there at the beginning with trophies and just never got into trophy hunting. (I'm silver rank on psn 328 I think for game level) old level was like 20 before the change. I loved this game and found it incredibly much more fun than TLOU2.
 

Derktron

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And this is why we need to hold Sony the same accountability as we do with Nintendo, Microsoft, and the rest of the gaming industry, it's a shame too because this will be forgotten by next week or so.
 
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Derktron

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What’s wrong with having standards? Otherwise your encouraging garbage that’s perfect for cheap rental service.
Let me guess you hate Gamepass and you are scared of it. Your fanboyism is showing. You and the rest of the fools need to hold Sony accountable. Just like you do with Microsoft and Nintendo and the rest of the gaming industry.
 
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And this is why we need to hold Sony the same accountability as we do with Nintendo, Microsoft, and the rest of the gaming industry, it's a shame too because this will be forgotten by next week or so.

Let me guess you hate Gamepass and you are scared of it. Your fanboyism is showing. You and the rest of the fools need to hold Sony accountable. Just like you do with Microsoft and Nintendo and the rest of the gaming industry.
Yes I’m scared of a rental service, I best get me some pills to calm my shakes.
And they will forget about it in weeks but when it comes to Microsoft or Nintendo.

Not the point, but you keep playing dumb and not hold Sony accountable.

Look at this clown. I’ve heard of double posting but quadruple posting to keep saying.. #makesonyaccountable
 

assurdum

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Let me guess you hate Gamepass and you are scared of it. Your fanboyism is showing. You and the rest of the fools need to hold Sony accountable. Just like you do with Microsoft and Nintendo and the rest of the gaming industry.
Speaking for myself, I deeply hate service as gamepass even if Sony was behind it. Is it more fair to name fanboy who hates some business practices or who defends it?
 
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RoyalLaFlame

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Ah yeah, reviewers. Those true objective reviews that in no shape or form are based on political agendas, personal opinions or if the reviewer has hit the pinky toe of his foot on the table when he woke up making him miserable the rest of the day.


Ah yes Sony, that's exactly what you should go after. Not if your fans like the games, not if the game sells well, nah, just the reviewers.
 

KingT731

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Sorry but this guy talks too much shit for having delivered a really mediocre game, one that launched in awful shape. Days Gone got the sales and reception it deserved - it only became worth playing long after launch when they put more work in to it. His game is a textbook example of one you shouldn't buy at launch so I don't think we should put much stock in to what he says. Sounds extremely bitter.
But at the same time he's right (he also was fired 6 days after the game launched not to mention he was the creative director not a "tech" guy). People quote 'Days Gone' selling over 5M but the large majority of those sales were at $30 or less and far after launch. So when someone says "why isn't there a sequel in the works" look no further than when the sales went up. We already see that mentality with games nowadays "Looks interesting but not for $60"
 

Kumomeme

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this is why metacritic rating is bad for industry. there lot of complaint before that publishers even take advantages of this system against devs for example hold bonus if it not reach certain rating although it sell well and stuff.
 

MrSarcastic

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No only SIE, but is a metric that all publishers and movie studios (rotten tomatoes) use to measure the critical reception of something. And you know what? is quite useful and pretty much accurate. Is the only way one can have some kind of grasp of the overall consent of a movie, series, videogame etc... Without falling on extremist and hyperbolic bullshit.
 
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Rumpleforeskin

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His comments are sounding like supreme cope. Look, Days Gone was a decent game - not amazing, but not terrible. However, the game launched in an absolutely miserable state that took multiple patches to get into working order. It's easy to come out years after release, when everyone has forgotten about how broken it was at launch, and paint it as this maligned hidden gem. No. It got the reviews it deserved at the time.

He also mentioned that gamers need to be paying full price more if they want a sequel. So to get all this straight: they released a dookie game knowing full well it needed more time in the oven, it consequently got shitty scores, so people steered clear... and this is somehow our fault? Again, no. The blame is on them for mismanaging it's development.

Any perceived sentiment that people wait too long for a price cut or PS+ is a direct consequence of people continuing to lose faith in this industry's abilities. Want to restore that faith? Make games that release in working order so people don't feel like they can just wait a few months for a complete version that's also 1/3 of the price.
 

MrSarcastic

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this is why metacritic rating is bad for industry. there lot of complaint before that publishers even take advantages of this system against devs for example hold bonus if it not reach certain rating although it sell well and stuff.
Metacritic is the opposite of bad. Did you know that soccer teams get bonuses if they win or get at certain positions? A middle-of-the-road team is not going to be expected to win the championship but at least to be one of two positions better; is an incentive and drives competition. and "competition is always better".

As a consumer is a fast way to see the "quality" of something by itself and not mudded with some drama that only gets exposed and exacerbated through social media, articles of these YouTube videos that have this pity clickbait thumbnails.
 
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The metacritic score is a joke. What about the user score and sales? Games urnalists spend all day sniffing each others butt cracks and looking for stuff that doesn't follow their narrative. I remember when the game came out they complained about a white male protagonist and that all the zombies were white even though there was a reason for it in the narrative. These are the people that decide if we get a sequel. What an F'ing joke!!!
 
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SlimeGooGoo

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Corporations can manipulate that score as they will, not directly but surely indirectly by bribing journous when they think it's convenient.

Does anybody remember when Obsidian would get a bonus from Bethesda if Fallout: New Vegas got a score of 85 or more on Metacritic, and "coincidentally" it never got past 84?


Wake up, people.
 
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Corporations can manipulate that score as they will, not directly but surely indirectly by bribing journous when they think it's convenient.

Does anybody remember when Obsidian would get a bonus from Bethesda if Fallout: New Vegas got a score of 85 or more on Metacritic, and "coincidentally" it never got past 84?


Wake up, people.
Oh please, if Obs had done less on New Vegas and actually fixed the mess they put in at launch, it would easily have made 85. Even I thought the score was generous, considering.

Even the developers admit they were the problem, not Bethesda, and Bethesda didn't even have to put that stupid clause in the contract - even the CEO said Bethesda didn't have to do it, and that clause was something Bethesda offered.

Obsidian certainly didn't work toward it. I mean, all Obsidian had to do was use the same engine with new content, but they fucked that up consistently, even though creating content for someone else's engines was all mostly been doing ever since the Black Isle days (and ironically, Interplay and Black Isle were constantly fucking over BioWare whenever they could, so it feels like poetic justice to get the screws reversed).

Yet, their CEO called the 1% "petty" and completely blamed Bethesda for his own studio's mistakes - while firing a bunch of people at the same time because the studio couldn't land or keep new contracts (that's a CEO job).

Now, of course, the CEO chodes up to Bethesda because they're all Microsoft now, but this isn't a conspiracy. Obsidian should have made a less buggy game, but they can't seem to do even that, at least during their first several titles. Hopefully Microsoft has a better QA department, but that's only half the battle if there's too many bugs and problems created by the developers to even fix in the first place (New Vegas was still being "fixed" months and months after launch).
 
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SlimeGooGoo

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Even the developers admit they were the problem, not Bethesda, and Bethesda didn't even have to put that stupid clause in the contract - even the CEO said Bethesda didn't have to do it, and that clause was something Bethesda offered.
Of course, believe CEOs, they're definitely the good guys.
I'm sure Bethesda did everything they could in their power for Obsidian be successful.

Ironically it's 84 on both PC and Xbox 360.
But sure, believe what you will :pie_eyeroll:
 

killatopak

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Reminder that R6 Siege was ass on release but look at how big it has become.

Sony should give people a chance especially those that redeem them later on like Days Gone and sadly Driveclub.
 
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TheAssist

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I dont see why so many people think that this is a bad thing. Sonys studios are getting way to big for smaller scale projects or just some mildly successful games.

Each studio has hundreds of people working there, plus the running contracts they are on with outside support studios. You cant just make a game that only sells 1 million units. Its why EA or Activision cant make small games. Its not how AAA game production works. When you are at a certain level you need to make every product make hundreds of millions. Otherwise you cant sustain .

Every studio runs on a set timetable and you also cant just take 20 people out of it to make a small experimental game (unless its preproduction for a new AAA game). Making a AA game that sells 500.000 copies for 20 bucks doesnt cover the cost anymore. Because that game doesnt just need to pay for the 20 developers but for all the office space, the human resource department, the whole infrastructure (IT, licenses, support contracts, etc.) and so on.

People have a very simplistic view of how games are being made and thats simply not the reality.

Its muuuuuuuuuuuch easier for Sony to just contract a 3rd party to develop a game like gravity rush or NIER or what have you and put them on as an exclusive. This way they dont have to run a whole developer studio, which comes with a lot of baggage and risk taking in itself.

So in a nutshell:

- Sony does what they do best in the industry right now. Produce AAA single player Blockbuster games without MTX or GAAS elements but with high critical and commercial acclaim that at the same time do not tread on the same playing field as the games of other publishers like Activision, or EA (so no GAAS), because they dont want to oppose them on their own platform (Sony mainly wants to attract 3rd parties to sell products on their store front).

- Contract 3rd parties to develop (timed, console) exclusives for their eco system, so people can play creative, innovative and new games from developers all over the world and give the PS Eco system their own individual and curated touch, without opening their own studios for it. Sony has always done this (think Metal Gear, Silent Hill, Journey, Final Fantasy, NIER, etc.)

This is how I see it and it makes sense. Also Sony has been doing this for decades now. I dont understand how people are so surprised. Its just on a different scale and yes the risk taking has gone down, like in all AAA industries. Doesnt mean creativity is dying out, its just that the risks are taken elsewhere. Maybe Sony goes the same route as some movie and music studios and opens up a indy label at some point.
 

Kumomeme

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Metacritic is the opposite of bad. Did you know that soccer teams get bonuses if they win or get at certain positions? A middle-of-the-road team is not going to be expected to win the championship but at least to be one of two positions better; is an incentive and drives competition. and "competition is always better".

As a consumer is a fast way to see the "quality" of something by itself and not mudded with some drama that only gets exposed and exacerbated through social media, articles of these YouTube videos that have this pity clickbait thumbnails.
soccer team? are you talking about sports? completely different situation here mate
 
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To be fair, not because the game was bad, but because Sony is going full elitist and is sacrficing variety (which has always been a strong point for playstation) for premium quality, as it seems.
So it seems if your game doesn't score high, you lose your job. Lovely place to work
 

DavJay

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Who gives a crap if a game sells well and people enjoy the game? Sony. That’s who.
 

GymWolf

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Whoever think that days gone was more bugged-glitched than ubisoft or bethesda games at launch need to see a terapist or an oculist.

The game was a negative surprise because sony games are usually polished at launch but it was not in a worse state than games with far higher metascores.

The fucking rdr2 had a gigantic bug at launch where some characters weren't in the camp for the first 3 chapters ffs.
 

ZywyPL

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I think Garvin is exaggerating with the metacritic scores, they probably hurt him personally, but at the end of the day for Sony it's all about the sales regardless, because well, it's a business, it's all about the money. If the game would've sold at least 7-8M copies Sony wouldn't even think twice about greenlighting the sequel, no matter the review scores, but it is what it is. To this day we don't have even just an estimation of how much DG sold, supposedly it had a really good launch, but what are the long-term sales, nobody except Sony knows for sure. And again, sales also aren't the whole picture, and Sony is the only one who has all the data regarding how many people played the game, did they completed it, did they replayed it, how far they went etc., everything apparently pointing out that there wouldn't have been many people wanting to put their hands on the sequel. Same for BB if we're at it. For Sony a game selling in just 2, 3, 4MLN copies is like an Avenger movie with just 500M revenue for Marvel, like yeah a profit is there, but not what was expected after putting in all the effort.
 

Thirty7ven

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Sorry but this guy talks too much shit for having delivered a really mediocre game, one that launched in awful shape. Days Gone got the sales and reception it deserved - it only became worth playing long after launch when they put more work in to it. His game is a textbook example of one you shouldn't buy at launch so I don't think we should put much stock in to what he says. Sounds extremely bitter.

Yup. Knowing that they didn’t have pre production pipeline and that Herman was the one making the calls, I gotta side with the guy who became head of WWS due to his success in pivoting Guerilla into higher heights.
 
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Snake29

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Are we going to have threads about all kind of key points someone is saying in some interview? It's not like Sony is different from other game companies...

I don' t know why shit nonsense is getting so much attention?
 

Jooxed

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That’s a shame, playing it now its a great game! Thought every time i finish a side story about 3 more pop up.