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Can I be honest here...I don’t think the Xbox Series S is going to last very long into the generation.

dcmk7

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So much wisdom in this post. I was just thinking the same thing the PS1 launched at $299 and not one person complained about its capabilities. I'm positive the XSS is more powerful than the PS1 and is at the same price point as a console back in 1995. Not one hater can prove that the XSS is missing any current gen features any other current gen console has.

:messenger_tears_of_joy:

What on earth are you on about? At least try and make your point coherent. SMH.
 

Zeroing

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Once the devs start taking too much time trying to optimize for that console... some will abandon it unless it’s selling like the switch. No incentive whatsoever

Then, if Sony launches a pro and Xbox also launches a pro console we will have 3 consoles on the Xbox side alone, that is crazy!

Why people need to defend this console while they talked crap about the “underpowered” switch is beyond me.

some are starting to sound like the Apple fanboys giving “reasons” why that thing exists and why is a good thing.
 

Jigsaah

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Why? It has the same CPU as the XSX (which is faster than the PS5s) and the same SSD. The only limiting factor is resolution and the console was never meant to be a 4K machine. Again, the console isn't targeted to anyone here who has a fancy 4K TV.
I mean you're right, no doubt. As games get more advanced throughout the gen, would 1080p be a struggle for this system you think?
 

Kuranghi

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The only real issue I can see with it down the line is that a game (multiplatform or just Xbox) will try to push visuals in some way that means even the XSX version will be running at 1080p (internally) and the XSS might need to go to 720p or below and thats might be a bit muddy even on 1080p panels.

There's only so much you can do with reconstruction when the source res is that low. Thats literally just a tiny exception though, so probably pointless to even worry about it. When some games are already 900p on XSS that doesn't seem unrealistic to me. I guess a counter might be that if a game is doing something crazy with visuals, but can look great at lower resolutions, it will probably be stylised anyway and even a res that low won't matter as much as it would in say a realistic looking game.

I'm not concerned, I really don't care to be honest because this won't affect me.
 

SirTerry-T

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"I feel like Xbox doesn't give it enough attention that it needs and it's not entirely Xbox who I feel like they don't give it enough attention, it's also the devs, they sometimes leave of the Series S and sometimes treat it like it's a second class device that doesn't matter, and that is where I understand that the console can do so much but I feel like they need to do more, for an instant, the big upgrade Xbox released for the 120hz (120 fps) upgrade."
Phew...that's quite the sentence there, pal.

In answer to the question, I think the series S will be fine. The first couple of Christmas's with all the bundles and discounts will make or break it I suppose.
I don't think it's quite the afterthought that a lot of self-appointed tech and business gurus of Neogaf land would like us to imagine it is.
 

bbeach123

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They will squeeze the game into the XSS , one way or another . It will not be easy at the end of the generation ,when game are cross gen (ps5/ps6 ) .But they'll try , be it 900p 20fps (cyberpunk 2088 ?) .
 
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Rien

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Three

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Okay before I begin let me start off with the usual assumptions that people will probably have

1. I already know it’s a $300 system that is only capable of doing so much.
2. The system already uses the same CPU as the Xbox Series X
3. The console will be fine. Why are you so worried
4. I’m sure I missed some things.

Okay I understand what everyone is going to say and I 100% agree, but as an owner who is lucky enough to even have a next-generation system like Series S, I'm grateful for that because of how hard it is to get a PS5 or Series S/X. But I feel like Xbox doesn't give it enough attention that it needs and it's not entirely Xbox who I feel like they don't give it enough attention, it's also the devs, they sometimes leave of the Series S and sometimes treat it like it's a second class device that doesn't matter, and that is where I understand that the console can do so much but I feel like they need to do more, for an instant, the big upgrade Xbox released for the 120hz (120 fps) upgrade.

That to me feels unfair because they should have also focused on people who still have a 60hz screen and done both, do the upgrade for 120hz, but also do fps boost for those who have a 60hz screen, just like they did for the first fps boost, where I can play a smooth 60fps when playing games like Skyrim or Fallout 76. Make games that are 30fps to 60fps then jump to 120fps for those who have the capable device and yeah you can argue that some games already hit 60fps but in reality sometimes it is not the case, it's achievable on PS5 and Series X but it sure doesn't feel that way on Series S, it might be 60fps but you can see the dips and hardly ever notice it.

Another is the resolution to performance on the Series S, some games are achievable to a full 4K but to me, that should not be the main focus on the Series S when it won't hit 60fps like on the PS5 and Series X. To me, they should focus more on 1080p, and 1440p to achieve 60fps, and if they can achieve a full 4K and somehow achieve 60fps then fuck it, good for them and I'll celebrate with a bottle of beer and dance around my Xbox Series S.

I don't maybe I'm overreacting and being dumb in my assumptions, but I feel like the Series S will not last very far into the generation where I feel like they might make a Series S 2.0 in the future. (I would love to be proved wrong and would be happy to be proved wrong on ALL my assumptions I just made)
Thoughts?
It will just like the original VCR xbox one did. It's meant to be MS' main console this gen. They forcast it selling more than the series X
 
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justiceiro

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Is not obvious for everyone that series s is a console for people that just want to keep playing the next gen games, performance be damned?
 

cireza

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Okay before I begin let me start off with the usual assumptions that people will probably have

1. I already know it’s a $300 system that is only capable of doing so much.
2. The system already uses the same CPU as the Xbox Series X
3. The console will be fine. Why are you so worried
4. I’m sure I missed some things.

Okay I understand what everyone is going to say and I 100% agree, but as an owner who is lucky enough to even have a next-generation system like Series S, I'm grateful for that because of how hard it is to get a PS5 or Series S/X. But I feel like Xbox doesn't give it enough attention that it needs and it's not entirely Xbox who I feel like they don't give it enough attention, it's also the devs, they sometimes leave of the Series S and sometimes treat it like it's a second class device that doesn't matter, and that is where I understand that the console can do so much but I feel like they need to do more, for an instant, the big upgrade Xbox released for the 120hz (120 fps) upgrade.

That to me feels unfair because they should have also focused on people who still have a 60hz screen and done both, do the upgrade for 120hz, but also do fps boost for those who have a 60hz screen, just like they did for the first fps boost, where I can play a smooth 60fps when playing games like Skyrim or Fallout 76. Make games that are 30fps to 60fps then jump to 120fps for those who have the capable device and yeah you can argue that some games already hit 60fps but in reality sometimes it is not the case, it's achievable on PS5 and Series X but it sure doesn't feel that way on Series S, it might be 60fps but you can see the dips and hardly ever notice it.

Another is the resolution to performance on the Series S, some games are achievable to a full 4K but to me, that should not be the main focus on the Series S when it won't hit 60fps like on the PS5 and Series X. To me, they should focus more on 1080p, and 1440p to achieve 60fps, and if they can achieve a full 4K and somehow achieve 60fps then fuck it, good for them and I'll celebrate with a bottle of beer and dance around my Xbox Series S.

I don't maybe I'm overreacting and being dumb in my assumptions, but I feel like the Series S will not last very far into the generation where I feel like they might make a Series S 2.0 in the future. (I would love to be proved wrong and would be happy to be proved wrong on ALL my assumptions I just made)
Thoughts?
As always, First Party efforts will take into account the system and make it shine. You can be sure that Microsoft's Studios will offer great games on Series S throughout the generation.

Third Parties always do whatever they want, and if they don't want to make any effort, Microsoft cannot force them to. However, we have already seen some instances of the community stating how low efforts from some devs were unacceptable, and the devs in question releasing a patch to offer better performance on Series S. The console was designed to lower the resolution and effects, and maintain the framerate. Yet we still see devs not even trying, and forcing a 4K output at 30fps on the console while it should actually be 1080@60fps. The console does not have the graphical pipeline required for 4K, it was not built for this.

This console is a great opportunity for many to enjoy the new generation at a lower price, with a lower resolution. It will not be abandoned by Microsoft.

There are also people who like to have a device that is not huge and does look like a video-game console, as well as not being absurdly power hungry. The Series S is a good fit for them.
 
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Nubulax

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$299 is the reason. $299 is the magic number for any console. That's why the PSX launching for $299 in 1995 was such a huge deal, likewise with almost any console after that.

You know why there were slim versions of the 360, PS3, and PS4? It wasn't for aesthetic reasons. It was to get down to $299 as fast as possible.

MS is already there with the Series S. The console isn't targeted at those who spend $1500 on a OLED 4K TV. It's targeted at those who go to Target or Walmart and buy a $400 Roku TV.

I would say thats a bit different scenario though right? Like the slim versions of a PS3 or PS4 were STILL a PS3 or PS4, the Series S is fundamentally a weaker machine than the X, its not just a "slim" x and its ALSO all digital if that matters to someone. Having said that I can see myself buying an S if its hit $200-$250 during a sale AND there are games that play pretty decently that I can only get through an Xbox Console in the future. I have always viewed it more as a cheap secondary console choice. If I was only buying one console and wanted an Xbox I would get an X over an S though
 
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Series S is gonna be fine. Scalability is being used as a meme, but it’s a real thing.

Sure, the most demanding games might have to run back at 30fps with settings turned down, but it will still offer a viable gaming platform for those on a budget, especially when it hits 250 bucks or lower down the road

Future Series S revisions need more SSD space, tho
 
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What were Microsoft thinking when they decided to go ahead with this console? Its already barely hitting 1080p with cross gen games, so hows it gonna fare ahead? I can see games eventually being completely butchered on it. Were Microsoft just hoping it would help their marketshare against Sony with it's cheap price? Maybe they were expecting it to perform much better than it is?
 

Reckheim

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MS made the decision to make it and they will have to support it for the rest of the generation; Series S2 wont change that. Series S will always hold back any of the series xboxes. They can only do so much with the limitations they set for them selfs.

It was a stupid idea.
 
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Plantoid

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This is a enthusiast forum, not a console for us, it's a console for people that want to game, to give it to their grandchildren... It's a cheap plastic that plays games + gamepass, sell it and buy a xsx If it's not that good for you
 
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I think PS5 will have an advantage with exclusive games being designed for it that don't need to prioritize Series S in development.

How much thats gonna impact the visuals i can't be sure, we barely seen any game designed for next gen consoles only

But 5GB of RAM plus 3 or 4 TF have to account for something

I predict PS5's Demon's Souls visuals will not be matched by any Xbox first party game until the end of the gen, maybe 3-4 years time.
 

M1chl

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I think we need to wait for engines, which is designed to new consoles specifically. But yeah sure, I dislike Series S, but I also recognise that in lower income region such console is good idea, coupled with GamePass or as a complimentary device to PS5. As a main console in the central Europe > West not at all.
 
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MS ain't stupid they know what the plan is for the console today and 5, 6, 7 years down the line. If they didn't think it'd last to the end of the generation then they'd not have released it.

we haven't really got any games yet that take full advantage of these consoles. sure, some games might have PATCHES to improve stuff but not many games if any have been designed "from the ground up" to run on these consoles. Demons Souls on PS5 maybe is the only one to come to mind. it'll take 2-3 years for games to get the most out of PS5/Xbox hardware. if Series S can't keep up then we'll find out in 2022/2023 and by which time the generation will be "mature" and it won't really matter much any more. if the Series S can last until mid gen then it'll be fine.

worst case scenario MS will end up marketing it as a budget console for backwards compatability and for playing xCloud. worst worst case scenario they scrap it. i don't see that being likely.
 
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SenjutsuSage

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It's impossible that it won't cause it will always be able to run next gen games at 1080p/1440p. It has all that it needs to just do things at a lesser level than the Series X. What it can't do will simply be left out, which is to be expected of a weaker edition of a product.
 

Spokker

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If the Series S ran the Xbox One X version of Xbox One games, I'd probably pick one up to replace the One S in the bedroom. Microsoft's backwards compatibility push has been mostly positive, but this is one missed opportunity.
 

Schmick

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Okay before I begin let me start off with the usual assumptions that people will probably have

1. I already know it’s a $300 system that is only capable of doing so much.
2. The system already uses the same CPU as the Xbox Series X
3. The console will be fine. Why are you so worried
4. I’m sure I missed some things.

Okay I understand what everyone is going to say and I 100% agree, but as an owner who is lucky enough to even have a next-generation system like Series S, I'm grateful for that because of how hard it is to get a PS5 or Series S/X. But I feel like Xbox doesn't give it enough attention that it needs and it's not entirely Xbox who I feel like they don't give it enough attention, it's also the devs, they sometimes leave of the Series S and sometimes treat it like it's a second class device that doesn't matter, and that is where I understand that the console can do so much but I feel like they need to do more, for an instant, the big upgrade Xbox released for the 120hz (120 fps) upgrade.

That to me feels unfair because they should have also focused on people who still have a 60hz screen and done both, do the upgrade for 120hz, but also do fps boost for those who have a 60hz screen, just like they did for the first fps boost, where I can play a smooth 60fps when playing games like Skyrim or Fallout 76. Make games that are 30fps to 60fps then jump to 120fps for those who have the capable device and yeah you can argue that some games already hit 60fps but in reality sometimes it is not the case, it's achievable on PS5 and Series X but it sure doesn't feel that way on Series S, it might be 60fps but you can see the dips and hardly ever notice it.

Another is the resolution to performance on the Series S, some games are achievable to a full 4K but to me, that should not be the main focus on the Series S when it won't hit 60fps like on the PS5 and Series X. To me, they should focus more on 1080p, and 1440p to achieve 60fps, and if they can achieve a full 4K and somehow achieve 60fps then fuck it, good for them and I'll celebrate with a bottle of beer and dance around my Xbox Series S.

I don't maybe I'm overreacting and being dumb in my assumptions, but I feel like the Series S will not last very far into the generation where I feel like they might make a Series S 2.0 in the future. (I would love to be proved wrong and would be happy to be proved wrong on ALL my assumptions I just made)
Thoughts?
This applies to the countless comparison threads.... don't make any judgement until the specific hardware used in the next gen consoles is utilised.

ML alone will improve performance on all consoles.
 

RCU005

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You’ll see much better looking exclusive games on PS5 than on XSX, because of the series S. That’s going to Vite Microsoft in the ass in the future. They think that people will only care about 60 FPS, but when Sony begins to bring their stunning exclusives, even if they are 30 FPS, people will love them like they did with PS4.

Of course XSX is capable of much more, but Microsoft will not be able to utilize it the way they should, and will never be able to get a game like Sony will. You already see this with how they are struggling with Halo Infinite, and this is just the very beginning.
 

Nubulax

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What were Microsoft thinking when they decided to go ahead with this console? Its already barely hitting 1080p with cross gen games, so hows it gonna fare ahead? I can see games eventually being completely butchered on it. Were Microsoft just hoping it would help their marketshare against Sony with it's cheap price? Maybe they were expecting it to perform much better than it is?

I feel like this thing was made just so they could claim they have the cheapest "Next Gen" console and also the "most powerful" with the X which they have backtracked on. I really hope this doesnt now become a norm where there are different models of "NEXT GEN" consoles going forward, its already bad enough there was a mid generation hardware upgrade in PS4 Pro and Xbox one X
 

ManaByte

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I would say thats a bit different scenario though right? Like the slim versions of a PS3 or PS4 were STILL a PS3 or PS4, the Series S is fundamentally a weaker machine than the X, its not just a "slim" x and its ALSO all digital if that matters to someone. Having said that I can see myself buying an S if its hit $200-$250 during a sale AND there are games that play pretty decently that I can only get through an Xbox Console in the future. I have always viewed it more as a cheap secondary console choice. If I was only buying one console and wanted an Xbox I would get an X over an S though

It's not fundamentally weaker though. it still has the exact same CPU as the XSX and the same SSD. The only difference is the GPU (still RDNA2 though) and RAM as it's specced as a 1080/1440p machine and not a 4K machine. This isn't even remotely close to the previous gen where the consoles had shit Jaguar CPUs from day 1 that limited them for the entire generation. I don't get how that's hard for people to grasp.
 
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Ezquimacore

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Gpu scaling and fidelityfx are the saviors of the series s, the games will look amazing even running at 720p
 
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Why? It has the same CPU as the XSX (which is faster than the PS5s) and the same SSD. The only limiting factor is resolution and the console was never meant to be a 4K machine. Again, the console isn't targeted to anyone here who has a fancy 4K TV.
You aren't wrong but the thing is it's nearly impossible to find a non-4K tv these days and literally impossible to find any new 1080p set that has any sort of quality to it so we are now limited to people who have no want/need to upgrade or use monitors which is a very small part of the console population.

I think the truth is that the Series S exists only to undercut Sony on the price. They are a business and are there to make money. They didn't create the Series S to give people a cheap way into next gen to save people money or to cater to people using TVs from a decade ago. They did it to have a new console they can market as next gen at a lower price then Sony could.
 

ManaByte

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You aren't wrong but the thing is it's nearly impossible to find a non-4K tv these days and literally impossible to find any new 1080p set that has any sort of quality to it so we are now limited to people who have no want/need to upgrade or use monitors which is a very small part of the console population.

I think the truth is that the Series S exists only to undercut Sony on the price. They are a business and are there to make money. They didn't create the Series S to give people a cheap way into next gen to save people money or to cater to people using TVs from a decade ago. They did it to have a new console they can market as next gen at a lower price then Sony could.

Those 4K TVs people buy for $400 can barely be considered 4K. They're shit. Those are the people the S is targeted to.

I mean how dare MS try to target non-enthusiasts with a $300 console. Like, fuck Nintendo for selling 100+M Wiis by hooking granny on Wii bowling.
 
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Nubulax

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You need to watch the video.

About 9 seconds in...
I stand corrected. I had just skipped towards the mid. I still think its hard to compare a flight sim to other conventional games though even though it looks pretty dang good. Would be one of the games on my "sit and chill and relax" list if I had an X or a better PC.
 

Tutomos

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It will get discontinued in a couple of years.

  • Retail will not want to push this thing since it got no disc drive unless All Access takes off
  • PS5/Series X is the base, series s will always look gimped.
 

Schmick

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Get anywhere close to those buildings and the textures are fucking awful and thats not to even mention thats running on a PC.
Firstly its a flight simulator.... i believe this has been mentioned before about this game and even the title is a big give away to that fact... but


Looks pretty darn good to me.

I'm sorry but I couldn't disagree with you more over your statement that no Xbox first party game will look better than Demon Soul's until the end of the gen or in 3-4 years.... more like 3-4 months.
 
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It's not fundamentally weaker though. it still has the exact same CPU as the XSX and the same SSD. The only difference is the GPU (still RDNA2 though) and RAM as it's specced as a 1080/1440p machine and not a 4K machine. This isn't even remotely close to the previous gen where the consoles had shit Jaguar CPUs from day 1 that limited them for the entire generation. I don't get how that's hard for people to grasp.
You can't talk about it's GPU, and still say it's not fundamentally weaker. That's literally fundamentally weaker whether it targets the same resolution or not.
Those 4K TVs people buy for $400 can barely be considered 4K. They're shit. Those are the people the S is targeted to.

I mean how dare MS try to target non-enthusiasts with a $300 console. Like, fuck Nintendo for selling 100+M Wiis by hooking granny on Wii bowling.
Lol okay so now 4K isn't 4K because it doesn't fit your argument? Cheap 1080 TVs were still 1080P TVs. Cheap 4K tvs are still 4K and when somebody upgrades their tv (and guess what more people buy cheap sets then expensive sets which have better scalers) then the Series S is going to look even worse.

I'm not saying that the Series S shouldn't exist. I bought one and returned it. I'm saying that targeting a market that is increasingly smaller and smaller every single day is done purely from a competition aspect. They simply want a cheap box to undercut Sony and to have something that people will use Game Pass on.
 
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Schmick

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I stand corrected. I had just skipped towards the mid. I still think its hard to compare a flight sim to other conventional games though even though it looks pretty dang good. Would be one of the games on my "sit and chill and relax" list if I had an X or a better PC.
I have a feeling that FS2020 is more technically intensive then Demon Soul's.
 

DarkMage619

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:messenger_tears_of_joy:

What on earth are you on about? At least try and make your point coherent. SMH.
The price for performance on XSS is better than what the PS1 was doing when it came out so long ago. You are getting a better value today. I am talking about total functionality not graphics. Accounting for inflation the XSS is actually cheaper seeing how $299 today doesn't go as far as $299 did back in 1995. How can the XSS be overpriced when you can't get a more capable device for less money? Do you guys know what overpriced even means? This doesn't even account for the Xbox All Access program that allows you to buy the console on a payment plan and get Game pass too.

Care to address the actual topic about the XSS or do you prefer to talk about me? You guys are so weird to be fixated on me and not the topic. Why not refute my point with actual evidence? Show that the game I posted the video of wasn't really running on the XSS. Explain, in detail, what features features it lacks that prove it is not going to be able to produce games that will be out this generation. I showed yet another game running with raytracing on the XSS. It is claimed to be holding back the generation. It gets compared to the Switch. Things are supposed to be getting worse. It should be so easy to prove yet all we have is ad hominems and laugh emojis. It's almost like the criticisms... aren't... really sincere... You have to look at the people making the claims to judge who is making a legitimate point and the clowns who are just trash-talking.
 

ManaByte

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I'm not saying that the Series S shouldn't exist. I bought one and returned it. I'm saying that targeting a market that is increasingly smaller and smaller every single day is done purely from a competition aspect. They simply want a cheap box to undercut Sony and to have something that people will use Game Pass on.

There's simply a large portion of the MASS MARKET that won't purchase a console until it's under $300. That's why Sony is still supporting the PS4 and why $299 is such an important price to hit for every manufacturer. The Switch was a huge success right out the gate because they managed to launch at $299.

The mass market is the goal with every console. Enthusiasts just there to pay the R&D costs due to being early adopters.
 
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Foorbits

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Series S is just the beginning of them tinkering with Xbox hardware, not the end.