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[ReBurn]

I had this issue.
Didn't get many callbacks for a long time.

Then I made one change in my resume,
and the calls started coming.

Put that I was fluent in English,
and that it was my primary language.

Listed all the other languages I could speak after.

As much as it sucks to have to do it, this is something that everyone should put on their CV/resume. Communication skill is one of the most important things organizations look for, hands down. Soft skills are important, and they're one thing everyone judges based on arbitrary factors.

Everyone has preconceived notions like this and makes judgments about people based on our preconceptions. Everyone. Even those of us who believe we don't have any. HR professionals are doing things like stripping names and gender references from information sent to hiring managers so that they are only looking at a person's background during the screening process.

Also, stop putting things like your address on your resume. Employers see that and make judgments based on where you live. It's also a risk to your identity as having your name and address shotgunned across the Internet can facilitate identity theft.

 

[sooperkool]

I'm always so amazed that someone could leave all they know behind to come here that I feel like I should be helpful. Never understood being hard on those trying to better themselves. Not really germane to this conversation, I know.

 

[Gully State]

As much as it sucks to have to do it, this is something that everyone should put on their CV/resume. Communication skill is one of the most important things organizations look for, hands down. Soft skills are important, and they're one thing everyone judges based on arbitrary factors.

Everyone has preconceived notions like this and makes judgments about people based on our preconceptions. Everyone. Even those of us who believe we don't have any. HR professionals are doing things like stripping names and gender references from information sent to hiring managers so that they are only looking at a person's background during the screening process.

Also, stop putting things like your address on your resume. Employers see that and make judgments based on where you live. It's also a risk to your identity as having your name and address shotgunned across the Internet can facilitate identity theft.

I swear I'm losing my mind. In reading this thread, I went from "Why the fuck should I put English is my native language on my resume" to "maybe it's not such a bad idea and I should actually do it." So I go to update my CV from like months ago and realize that I had already put it on there. I used to think I had a great working memory but these last 6 months man...I can't remember names of people I just met and I completely forget about things I had already done....

 

[TheRagnCajun]

People are trying to glean too much from this study. Concerns over Fluency in English could be a primary factor in not getting job interviews.

 

[ActStriker]

People are trying to glean too much from this study. Concerns over Fluency in English could be a primary factor in not getting job interviews.

What does that have to do with having an Asian name?

Furthermore, how do you know if they're fluent or not if you don't interview them

 

[DarthMasta]

What does that have to do with having an Asian name?

Furthermore, how do you know if they're fluent or not if you don't interview them

Fuckall to do, but if you already have "enough" candidates, to the disregard pile the CV goes...

 

[TheRagnCajun]

What does that have to do with having an Asian name?

Furthermore, how do you know if they're fluent or not if you don't interview them

That's for another study I guess. They only controlled the study so far as to ensure the qualifications were the same.

I'm just saying the only logical conclusion we can draw from this study is: People with Asian names are less likely to get job interviews. Trying to say why that happens, and blaming it on systemic racism in Canada is not something that can be gleaned from this study.

 

[Sarcastic Poster]

Shouldn't be a shock. A lot of people are inherently a little bit racist.

On a side-note, has there been any studies done on the opposite end? Like a European name in an Asian country? Would be interesting to see the results.

 

[Kite]

Asian people we tried to warn you. Black people have long since realized this was the case, but some of you took the whole model minority thing as a compliment or something

What the fuck is this and how did I miss this thread lolol Apparently we are too busy brow nosing that we needed random gaf poster unemployedvillian to show us the light pppffffftt

I got our version of The Talk when I was a kid, that I needed to work twice as hard to get the same job opportunities as a white person and that it didn't matter if I was born in the US and spoke perfect English. One look at my face and my last name and people will always view me as an outsider since I'm not white or black.

And none of this changes the fact that I need a job and I need to make money, being a punk bitch and taking myself out of the game, whining and complaining about how unfair life is and sneering at "bootstraps" blah blah Being asian in America is like dating and automatically having a -3 handicap. You have to work harder for lesser results and the ceiling to what you can achieve is real unless you are really lucky. But it is still possible to achieve some success as long as you don't go in with a loser's mentality and your eyes open (teehee) to the reality of your situation.

tl;dr No shit, OP.

 

[ccbfan]

No shit Sherlock.

A vast majority of Asian know there's racism against them, we've been trying to tell you that for years. It's just the vast majority of other races that try to ignore it. (Hell look at almost every GAF topic about Asians)

Also Asian don't succeed to get a pat in the back from Whites. We succeed cause it make our live better. Its the hand that we're dealt. We know we need to work harder, have better grades, be more polite to succeed. Do we like it? No, but its better than the alternative.

 

[SoRuffShoNuff]

Remove names, addresses and educational institutions from resumes during the initial screening process.

Ummm no. I absolutely want to know where someone obtained their degree. Schools vary greatly in their rigor and that can explain why one candidate has a 3.8 GPA and another has a 3.1. Once you get to know the schools you know which school will provide you with candidates that are ready to work with minimum training and which students education was 100% theoretical and they know nothing of real world applications.

 

[Dongs Macabre]

People are trying to glean too much from this study. Concerns over Fluency in English could be a primary factor in not getting job interviews.

Nah, that's still a pretty racist assumption to make.

 

[Rush_Khan]

Yep, I definitely notice this. While I can't hide my Asian last name on applications, I almost NEVER give my Asian middle name on job applications. (My first name is kind of English.) More often than not, I tend to get interviews for applications without my middle name.

And this is in the UK, so probably not just the case with Canada.

 

[Escargo]

If english fluency is such a problem, why don't they just look at your transcript to see if you've taken post-secondary english courses?

 

[Zoe]

If english fluency is such a problem, why don't they just look at your transcript to see if you've taken post-secondary english courses?

Why would Asian Americans need to take post-secondary English courses?

 

[NandoGip]

How do you go about changing your name? I mean, obviously you can go and legally change it, but what about just putting a fake name on the resume? I can see problems arising, so what would be the ideal way to do it?

My name is really ethnic so I'm wondering if I would have more luck getting call backs with a white name...

edit: also these studies are always hilarious. White people (not all obv) gasp and raise their hands to their mouths in surprise that the struggles ALL minorities go through weren't lies.

 

[UnemployedVillain]

If english fluency is such a problem, why don't they just look at your transcript to see if you've taken post-secondary english courses?

How about they don't assume you can't speak english just because you have a foreign-sounding last name? I'm assuming most places do telephone interviews before on-site, and that's an easy way to determine english proficiency

 

[Jeels]

I wonder how it breaks down across specific regionalities: Chinese vs Pakistani vs Indian.

I'd be willing to bet that "Katsumoto" and "Yang" gets called more than "Balachandran" or "Bhatia".

I honestly have no idea. I am willing to bet that if someone is disgusting enough to deny an applicant with the name Bhatia they are just as disgusting to deny a Yang. There could be variance between regions/ethnicities, but I'm sure none of them are on par with the average Caucasian.

 

[Cimarron]

I'm a minority, but I have pretty much the whitest first and last name. I had a person tell me, I wasn't what they expected when I showed up for an interview.

Lol! Me too. I have very Irish name and I applied to a company that was Irish owned. My cousinwas working there and he said he overheard my future boss reviewing my resume and saying how it would be nice to have more Irish folk in the office. The secretary told him that I wasn't Irish and mention that I was related to my cousin and he jumped up out of his chair was like 'HE'S BLACK!!!'' Lol! I got the job regardless. I am Jamaican btw.

 

[mckmas8808]

For those of you who recognize Chloe Bennet from Agents of SHIELD: she actually had to change her last name from Wang to Bennet in order to get auditions

Man this is freaking sad.

 

[nel e nel]

Why educational institutions?

Ummm no. I absolutely want to know where someone obtained their degree. Schools vary greatly in their rigor and that can explain why one candidate has a 3.8 GPA and another has a 3.1. Once you get to know the schools you know which school will provide you with candidates that are ready to work with minimum training and which students education was 100% theoretical and they know nothing of real world applications.

Because a Harvard degree doesn't necessarily mean that someone is more qualified than someone who went to a local state school, just that they spent more money. This is a well known dirty secret in academia that doesn't get talked about much. Maybe the person who got a 3.1 is not a good tester, but they have a better grasp of the course material. A GPA and a brand name institution on a resume won't tell you that.

Google Ventures put out a great bias training video where they explicitly call this practice out, where when the company was young they had a bias towards people that graduated from Stanford because Sergey and Larry graduated from there.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLjFTHTgEVU

 

[UnemployedVillain]

Because a Harvard degree doesn't necessarily mean that someone is more qualified than someone who went to a local state school, just that they spent more money. This is a well known dirty secret in academia that doesn't get talked about much. Maybe the person who got a 3.1 is not a good tester, but they have a better grasp of the course material. A GPA and a brand name institution on a resume won't tell you that.

Google Ventures put out a great bias training video where they explicitly call this practice out, where when the company was young they had a bias towards people that graduated from Stanford because Sergey and Larry graduated from there.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLjFTHTgEVU

And a Harvard degree doesn't mean they spent more money. This is a well known dirty Ivy League stereotype, despite the fact that they usually have among the most generous financial aid programs of any schools

 

[nel e nel]

And a Harvard degree doesn't mean they spent more money. This is a well known dirty Ivy League stereotype, despite the fact that they usually have among the most generous financial aid programs of any schools

Sure, that's also true, but generally speaking people assume that graduates from those 'brand name' institutions are smarter/more qualified than everyone else, and that is not always the case.

 

[suzu]

That's for another study I guess. They only controlled the study so far as to ensure the qualifications were the same.

I'm just saying the only logical conclusion we can draw from this study is: People with Asian names are less likely to get job interviews. Trying to say why that happens, and blaming it on systemic racism in Canada is not something that can be gleaned from this study.

So why do you think it happens then if not that?

 

[Kuro Madoushi]

If english fluency is such a problem, why don't they just look at your transcript to see if you've taken post-secondary english courses?

It's not a problem. There's a prejudice that if you have a foreign name, your English isn't going to be fluent. Thats the whole point - why should a person with a "white" sounding name be assumed to be fluent but a person with an Asian name have to take a class to prove fluency? I did take English, but I was also born in Canada and have lived here for over 30 years. An HR person isn't going to know that without asking me, but I won't even get the chance if they see my name and throw my resume in the trash cause my "name is too hard to pronounce".

 

[Septimus Prime]

That's for another study I guess. They only controlled the study so far as to ensure the qualifications were the same.

I'm just saying the only logical conclusion we can draw from this study is: People with Asian names are less likely to get job interviews. Trying to say why that happens, and blaming it on systemic racism in Canada is not something that can be gleaned from this study.

Did you miss this part?

Reitz said that when researchers of the studies cited above asked employers to explain why they called fewer Asian applicants, they usually received a response along the lines of, "Well, you see an Asian name and you know that language problems are going to be there."

It's the best part.