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Anyone else think the "bucktooth" grilles on recent BMWs look shite?

What SAY you?

  • Hot stuff, like it.

  • God awful.

  • Potato!


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Tschumi

Member
I really like the iX in all black. First time I see it in that configuration.

P90446557-low-Res-handing-over-the-bmw.jpg
I'm sorry I'm not trying to just be a joker but are you sure that's not Photoshopped?
 

Liljagare

Member
You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. Did you really just compare BMW to KIA and say that KIA is better? :messenger_tears_of_joy:

tumblr_p9eg2tVbAe1toxy7eo1_400.gifv

giphy.gif


BMW 3-series - US - By year

March
BMW 3-Series 20176.197
BMW 3-Series 20184.845
BMW 3-Series 20194.620
BMW 3-Series 202010.613

Kia Stinger – US – By Year
Yearsold
2017843
201816,806
201913,884
202012,556




It's probarly more likely that BMW drivers haven't driven a modern KIA, and are just stuck. Just like Skoda is getting up there, SEAT is following close by, used to be, cheapo, low priced brands, but, they are all catching up and passing in some cases, the stagnant BMW and Mercedes brands.

Besides, though looks are liked by the beholder:

295.jpg



1920px-BMW_G20_IMG_0167.jpg


One looks like a old ladies car, but, I guess taste is taste.. :p

And, here comes grandpa:

cq5dam.resized.img.585.low.time1627455489202.jpg


Here is a good 'benz comparison.

2022-mercedes-benz-c-class-vs-2022-kia-stinger.jpg


IMHO, you have to get into the Benz, above AMG43 Coupe, to match KIA nowadays. and it's almost twice the price. BMW folks who just keep buying it because it's BMW, are stuck in the past.
 
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Liljagare

Member
Btw, I say this as a owner of theese two cars:

cq5dam.resized.img.1680.large.time1627456771507.jpg


14-2018-kia-stinger-gt-blue-cp.jpg


Even the BMW5 lacks air cooling, over, air cooled breaking system, it's really hilarious. BMW specs for the turbo, don't start if it's -15 C or below, it might cause damage to the system. Kia Stinger, -30, dual turbo, no such issues up here in northern Sweden, and, oh, look, air cooling on the air cooled break pads?

BMW5, needs to stand in a heated garage during winter, Kia Stinger, it pretty much eats the snow, it was designed for harsh climates.
 
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giphy.gif


BMW 3-series - US - By year

March
BMW 3-Series 20176.197
BMW 3-Series 20184.845
BMW 3-Series 20194.620
BMW 3-Series 202010.613

Kia Stinger – US – By Year
Yearsold
2017843
201816,806
201913,884
202012,556




It's probarly more likely that BMW drivers haven't driven a modern KIA, and are just stuck. Just like Skoda is getting up there, SEAT is following close by, used to be, cheapo, low priced brands, but, they are all catching up and passing in some cases, the stagnant BMW and Mercedes brands.

Besides, though looks are liked by the beholder:

295.jpg



1920px-BMW_G20_IMG_0167.jpg


One looks like a old ladies car, but, I guess taste is taste.. :p

And, here comes grandpa:

cq5dam.resized.img.585.low.time1627455489202.jpg


Here is a good 'benz comparison.

2022-mercedes-benz-c-class-vs-2022-kia-stinger.jpg


IMHO, you have to get into the Benz, above AMG43 Coupe, to match KIA nowadays. and it's almost twice the price. BMW folks who just keep buying it because it's BMW, are stuck in the past.
The styling of the Mercedes blows the Kia out the water.
 

TylerD

Member
Laljagare, I think you posted March sales figures for 3 series that show in March 2020, BMW sold ~2000 less in March than Kia did in all of 2020 for Stingers. Stingers don't sell great in the US and there are plenty of deals to be had. The newer Kia's are definitely nicer but they don't really hold up interior quality-wise to the Germans.

I like the Stinger. Test drove the 4 cylinder turbo, and the twin turbo, and Audi A5 sportback when we were looking for a new vehicle. I much preferred the A5 sportback of those, mainly due to styling and interior quality. My now ex-wife and I custom ordered a 2021 Merc GLB 250 instead. The GLB is pretty sharp and she always liked the GLK so that was always her preferred option.
 
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sankt-Antonio

:^)--?-<
Sat in a EQS the other day. Meh. From the outside, the front looks like an A-Class level vehicle.
If I where in a position , I’m not, to spend 100k on a vehicle I would want to have at least some presence on the road. Really don’t get why Merc prioritized range over design / presence.
 

Fools idol

Banned
So I'm a massive BMW fan and have owned just about every model of the M3 at some point.

The only one that has stuck around is my beauty, my baby, the E92 M3. It's imho the best bmw design and engine. As you can see my current drive way is a little nuts (RS7, 458 italia, and the e92)

of all 3 cars the e92 is the least powerful but the most fun to drive. That should probably say a lot for a now 11 year old car :)

v1Gc5v2.png
UZIbMlr.png
 
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Liljagare

Member
The styling of the Mercedes blows the Kia out the water.

The point was missed, the model uses aircooled brakes, without airvents for said breaks.

(tbh, when folks complain about the vents on the stinger hood).

Though for me, the Merc really screams mid 90's sports coupe, that really looks like it's cousins, or the Ford from the same era, or, the Volvo, or, the Saab. Combined with your grandpa's buckteeth and grandma's SAGGING BUTT. :p
 
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Liljagare

Member
Laljagare, I think you posted March sales figures for 3 series that show in March 2020, BMW sold ~2000 less in March than Kia did in all of 2020 for Stingers. Stingers don't sell great in the US and there are plenty of deals to be had. The newer Kia's are definitely nicer but they don't really hold up interior quality-wise to the Germans.

I like the Stinger. Test drove the 4 cylinder turbo, and the twin turbo, and Audi A5 sportback when we were looking for a new vehicle. I much preferred the A5 sportback of those, mainly due to styling and interior quality. My now ex-wife and I custom ordered a 2021 Merc GLB 250 instead. The GLB is pretty sharp and she always liked the GLK so that was always her preferred option.

Fair quote, but, as a owner also of a BMW 5 Touring Bavaria, I simply do not get the "interior quality" complaints. It's the same materials, and the Beamer really rattles and shakes a whole lot more, which is scary, considering the difference on the price tag.

I hope you find your version of the Merc ok, at it's price tag, you can't do much better, albeit, it's slow and boring.. :D
 
Fake grills on EVs is like putting a horse tail on an ICE car. So stupid and ugly.
???

Where do you think these manufacturers hide their array of advanced sensors?

Unless you want to see cars with blank front ends dotted with sensors and two headlights 😂. Surely that would appeal to customers 😂

BMW is better but KIA/Hyundai are stealing their employees
Which is normal. BMW M division head used to be at Audi. People move around all the time.
 
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TylerD

Member
Fair quote, but, as a owner also of a BMW 5 Touring Bavaria, I simply do not get the "interior quality" complaints. It's the same materials, and the Beamer really rattles and shakes a whole lot more, which is scary, considering the difference on the price tag.

I hope you find your version of the Merc ok, at it's price tag, you can't do much better, albeit, it's slow and boring.. :D

5 series touring Bavaria is very sharp!

The Merc is my ex-wife's we had it ordered and then decided a divorce was in order and she ended up taking delivery. It is slow but it was nice and torque-y when we test drove one. The spec we ordered (Galaxy Blue, Parchment interior, LED interior lighting package, park assist, pano moonroof) came out to about $46500 US

My 2017 X3 xdrive 35i is a monster compared to hers and I prefer iDrive over the MBUX
 
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Coolwhhip

Neophyte
???

Where do you think these manufacturers hide their array of advanced sensors?

Unless you want to see cars with blank front ends dotted with sensors and two headlights 😂. Surely that would appeal to customers 😂


Which is normal. BMW M division head used to be at Audi. People move around all the time.

wot

Tesla_Model_Y_front_view_7-19-2020.jpg
 

I wouldn't exactly call ultrasonic sensors advanced since they've been around for since Toyota first released them in 1982 with the Toyota Corona and I even have them on my Lexus IS350 along with radar sensor hidden behind my front Lexus badge. I can fucking buy a 4 pack replacement ultrasonic sensors on Ali-Express for $10.

I did say 'advanced' sensors didn't I?

BMW IX:
We start outside, with the front end of the car. While the kidney grille panel might be controversial looking, it’s very useful. It’s a housing panel for all of the car’s frontal sensors and keeps them hidden from view. So rather than have ugly sensors visible, they’re integrated into the kidney grille.

As more and more advanced sensors get developed, these manufacturers will be looking to hide them in body panels like BMW has done with their kidney grills on their EV's which you should know is a company design element going back decades. You can expect the above Tesla design to change radically as more and more advanced gear is added to these EV's.

Unless you want fucking future Tesla's to look like this, with all this crap hanging off the sides of it:
https%3A%2F%2Fspecials-images.forbesimg.com%2Fimageserve%2F5cbf1f70a7ea436c70f38264%2FWaymo-lidar%2F960x0.jpg%3FcropX1%3D450%26cropX2%3D4050%26cropY1%3D300%26cropY2%3D2700
 
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Coolwhhip

Neophyte
I wouldn't exactly call ultrasonic sensors advanced since they've been around for since Toyota first released them in 1982 with the Toyota Corona and I even have them on my Lexus IS350 along with radar sensor hidden behind my front Lexus badge.

I did say 'advanced' sensors didn't I?

BMW IX:
We start outside, with the front end of the car. While the kidney grille panel might be controversial looking, it’s very useful. It’s a housing panel for all of the car’s frontal sensors and keeps them hidden from view. So rather than have ugly sensors visible, they’re integrated into the kidney grille.

As more and more advanced sensors get developed, these manufacturers will be looking to hide them in body panels like BMW has done with their kidney grills on their EV's which you should know is a company design element going back decades. You can expect the above Tesla design to change radically as more and more advanced gear is added to these EV's.

Unless you want fucking future Tesla's to look like this, with all this crap hanging off the sides of it:
https%3A%2F%2Fspecials-images.forbesimg.com%2Fimageserve%2F5cbf1f70a7ea436c70f38264%2FWaymo-lidar%2F960x0.jpg%3FcropX1%3D450%26cropX2%3D4050%26cropY1%3D300%26cropY2%3D2700

I'm not sure if you're serious. Teslas have all the sensors and cameras they need for full self driving already.
 

Fools idol

Banned
Tesla is going to be the dominant car manufacturer in our lifetimes no question. I was skeptical as a pure petrolhead until I drove the plaid model S and it's absolutely the best car I have ever driven.

They have managed to do what Apple did with mobile phones - and the brand power is incredibly sticky. The same nay sayers exist against Tesla as those against the iPhone and Mac products - yet we all know Apple is a 3T$ company.

It will be funny to see all the legacy car makers scramble to catch up with Elon this next decade - they truly have an unassailable lead. I doubt I will ever personally buy one of the top end models, but even the model Y or 3 is gold standard for EV already and they're barely scratching the surface of cars as a service and autonomy etc. This is a great time to be alive if you love technology.
 

Coolwhhip

Neophyte
Tesla is going to be the dominant car manufacturer in our lifetimes no question. I was skeptical as a pure petrolhead until I drove the plaid model S and it's absolutely the best car I have ever driven.

They have managed to do what Apple did with mobile phones - and the brand power is incredibly sticky. The same nay sayers exist against Tesla as those against the iPhone and Mac products - yet we all know Apple is a 3T$ company.

It will be funny to see all the legacy car makers scramble to catch up with Elon this next decade - they truly have an unassailable lead. I doubt I will ever personally buy one of the top end models, but even the model Y or 3 is gold standard for EV already and they're barely scratching the surface of cars as a service and autonomy etc. This is a great time to be alive if you love technology.

The difference with iPhone vs Nokia back then is that no one can make enough EVs to meet demand due to batteries. Including Tesla. So that leaves a lot more room for other brands to catch up to Tesla. And many have a lot of "good enough" EVs already at this point. To replace the 2 billion+ ICE cars, many brands will be able to flourish.
 

TylerD

Member
The difference with iPhone vs Nokia back then is that no one can make enough EVs to meet demand due to batteries. Including Tesla. So that leaves a lot more room for other brands to catch up to Tesla. And many have a lot of "good enough" EVs already at this point. To replace the 2 billion+ ICE cars, many brands will be able to flourish.

This, I think the brands that have been making cars for 100+ years in some cases are going to be able to create compelling products and really good EVs. I think the Ford F-150 Lightning for example is going to be a HUGE hit and will do a lot for additional adoption of EVs and the building of the infrastructure needed to pave the way for other manufacturers outside of just Tesla to really take off.
 
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sankt-Antonio

:^)--?-<
I'm not sure if you're serious. Teslas have all the sensors and cameras they need for full self driving already.
Nah they don’t. Elon thinks cameras alone are enough. But somehow Merc beat him to the punch as the first manufacturer to have Level 3 features on the road. With a lot of sensors, lidars, cameras etc.
 

Coolwhhip

Neophyte
Nah they don’t. Elon thinks cameras alone are enough. But somehow Merc beat him to the punch as the first manufacturer to have Level 3 features on the road. With a lot of sensors, lidars, cameras etc.

Yeah read that article, they got that permit for very low speeds only. So completely pointless. Cameras make a lot more sense and Tesla is very far ahead with self driving, unless there are some mind blowing top secret Chinese projects but I doubt that.

For example, the Waymo cars have all the sensors too and look like Homers car and they can only drive in small predetermined areas and regularly get stuck in certain spots and need to be rescued, after going at it for 12 years already...
 
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TheMan

Member
The difference with iPhone vs Nokia back then is that no one can make enough EVs to meet demand due to batteries. Including Tesla. So that leaves a lot more room for other brands to catch up to Tesla. And many have a lot of "good enough" EVs already at this point. To replace the 2 billion+ ICE cars, many brands will be able to flourish.
Actually it’s my understanding that there are not enough raw materials on earth to make enough batteries to replace all ICE cars. I guess if there are radical advances in efficiency and materials that could change, but with global warming marching on, I suspect many future humans will have to make due with alternative forms of transport
 

Coolwhhip

Neophyte
Actually it’s my understanding that there are not enough raw materials on earth to make enough batteries to replace all ICE cars. I guess if there are radical advances in efficiency and materials that could change, but with global warming marching on, I suspect many future humans will have to make due with alternative forms of transport

I don't think that's true. Batteries are mainly lithium, which there is more than enough of. Premium batteries have a small amount of cobalt, more rare but still enough. And cheap batteries have lithium and iron. Both abundant. The main problem right now is that the demand for batteries is exploding so there is a shortage.
 

sankt-Antonio

:^)--?-<
Yeah read that article, they got that permit for very low speeds only. So completely pointless. Cameras make a lot more sense and Tesla is very far ahead with self driving, unless there are some mind blowing top secret Chinese projects but I doubt that.

For example, the Waymo cars have all the sensors too and look like Homers car and they can only drive in small predetermined areas and regularly get stuck in certain spots and need to be rescued, after going at it for 12 years already...
They are the first with LvL3, deal with it. Its highway only, up tp 60km/h. While taking full responsibility when a crash does happen! You can legally sleep behind the wheel in traffic on the highway.

This is so much farther than some beta software on Teslas that demands people be alert behind the wheel, and if something happens Tesla is like "Dude you are responsible. look up what Autopilot means on Wikipedia, read the fine print ".

Merc releases Automated Driving on a save and mature level, and takes responsibility for when it's used.
 
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Coolwhhip

Neophyte
They are the first with LvL3, deal with it. Its highway only, up tp 60km/h. While taking full responsibility when a crash does happen! You can legally sleep behind the wheel in traffic on the highway.

This is so much farther than some beta software on Teslas that demands people be alert behind the wheel, and if something happens Tesla is like "Dude you are responsible. look up what Autopilot means on Wikipedia, read the fine print ".

Merc releases Automated Driving on a save and mature level, and takes responsibility for when it's used.

Not really:

Level 3 vehicles have “environmental detection” capabilities and can make informed decisions for themselves, such as accelerating past a slow-moving vehicle. But―they still require human override. The driver must remain alert and ready to take control if the system is unable to execute the task.

 

sankt-Antonio

:^)--?-<
Not really:

Level 3 vehicles have “environmental detection” capabilities and can make informed decisions for themselves, such as accelerating past a slow-moving vehicle. But―they still require human override. The driver must remain alert and ready to take control if the system is unable to execute the task.

"According to Mercedes-Benz, the driver can focus on secondary activities while Drive Pilot Level 3 autonomy is engaged. In other words, you can surf the web, eat a sandwich, or maybe watch a movie while doing so. In case of sudden equipment failure, Drive Pilot has redundant steering, braking, and electrical systems so the driver can still control the car."

Level 3 is the first instance where the car is not assisting, but taking control. Even when this is only true for certain speeds or roads. You can't leave your seat, as you have a certain time where you need to take over. But its a massive leap compared to driver assisted stuff that is Level2/ Level2+ you can find on Teslas. Where you aren't allowed to take your eyes of the road, and need your hands on the wheel.

levels-of-driving-automation-jpg-imgw-850-x.jpg
 
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DeepEnigma

Gold Member
Too bad they are only doing them for this year, and about 2,000 being made.

They even fixed the grill for this special M5CS swansong.
ePbxE8d.jpg
 

MrMephistoX

Member
Agreed like the IX is superior in every way to the i3 but I’d keep mine despite the better mileage because of that dumb buck tooth design. It’s like New Coke don’t mess with a classic like the overall shape of BMWs iconic asthetic.

WczWdU4.png
 

haxan7

Volunteered as Tribute

Thaedolus

Member

The Lexus plug-in hybrid is at the top of my list, haven’t really checked Acura yet. Also XC60 plug-in…I want big enough for us to all fit with two car seats and AWD for snow days but nothing that can tow or anything because I’ve got my truck
 

RoboFu

One of the green rats
Big BMW fan. Currently own a 06 330ci 6MT with ZHP package since 2012 and a 17 X3 xDrive 35i. God their inline 6s are good.

I went with potato! They are taking it too far but It's not terrible when there is a distinct break between the kidneys. When they morph together into a blob in the concept vehicles it doesn't work. What are ugly as shit are the asses of the x4 and x6. The coupe styling and taillights don't work on those AT ALL imo. I think the G20 3 series looks too Lexus like in the taillights. I think older more classic BMW designed cars will carry a premium moving forward. I know my e46 is rising in value quickly.

The production iX isn't that bad IMO. I've watched a lot of reviews and am starting to dig it. The interior design is really neat. Potentially, a future electric BMW could be the most reliable BMW you could buy...

BMW-iX-feature-image-e1632777498117-800x497.jpg

images
 

haxan7

Volunteered as Tribute
The Lexus plug-in hybrid is at the top of my list, haven’t really checked Acura yet. Also XC60 plug-in…I want big enough for us to all fit with two car seats and AWD for snow days but nothing that can tow or anything because I’ve got my truck
I checked out that range of vehicles about a year ago with my ex-gf. We test drove the Acura. It was awesome, but the space inside is lacking. She ended up buying a Honda Pilot. Since you have the truck a Lexus/Acura would probably be a good addition to the stable.
 

TylerD

Member
I need something with functioning blinkers

My BMWs must be defective because my blinkers work fine!

After having some real world experience with seeing the bigger grilled 4 series, it works a lot better with the shape of the convertible but I still don't like it on the coupe or grand coupe shape. The new X7 is a win in my book, the 7 series and i7 not as much. The bigger grills work better on the SAVs in general. Also, should we look back at the 2014 Jeep Cherokee as a low headlight trend setter?

2014 Cherokee
2014-Jeep-Cherokee-Limited-front-three-quarter1.jpg


2023 x7
__Qf2AjLwojIjJCLyojI0JCLiADMwEzLcZDOyATO1MDN3QTMvwFMvwFdi9FcwF2c3VmbvwVbvNmLn1Wa0dmLzdXZul2Lc9CX6MHc0RHaiojIsJye.webp


2023 7 series :/
BMW-i7-14.jpg
 
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