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[APZonerunner]

Every time I see a regenration a question pops in my head and yet nobody gave me a good explanation for it.

The whole Gallifrey blowing up thing .... why did the Time Lords vanished ?

Didn't the planet blowing up would only kill then once and then they would regenerate ?

The way regeneration works is that it's a process you have to actually activate. So you have to survive long enough to activate. The Doctor has 'died' from falls (4), various types of poisoning (5, 9, 10), a bang on the head (6) and even a shooting (7), but all of these were things that meant he had time to 'activate' the regenerative process. If the Doctor was shot in the head, he'd be dead instantly. If a Time Lord is killed in, say, an explosion, they'd be dead instantly. You have to actually have time to start the process. Even when the 10th Doctor gets show by the Dalek in Series 4, they were very careful to even make that effect a 'glancing' shot, it doesn't hit him full on as that'd kill him dead. They make a point of this in Night of the Doctor, as well, as the 8th Doctor actually dies instantly when the ship crashes but is then revived by the sisterhood so he can regenerate.

Bonus weird lore fact: A Time Lord can activate regeneration manually even when not injured, refuse to activate it, or even activate regeneration when they've no regenerations left to cause a failed regeneration and thus commit suicide.

 

[Fiktion]

Bonus weird lore fact: A Time Lord can activate regeneration manually even when not injured, refuse to activate it, or even activate regeneration when they've no regenerations left to cause a failed regeneration and thus commit suicide.

Huh, when did that last one happen?

 

[xandaca]

The reason I believe they didn't come back is that

Spoiler

they realize its not safe for them to return. Half of the universe doesn't want them back and if they did come back it would just restart the time war. So they gave him the power to regenerate in hope that he can one day make the universe welcome them back in peace

That would make sense, but

Spoiler

we never see anyone tell the Timelords what's happening on the other side of the crack - even Clara just says the Doctor needs help, but doesn't specify it's a danger so great the entire Time Lord race wouldn't be able to sort it fairly easily.

While this could have happened off-screen, it seems kind of unlikely as

Spoiler

no-one else is seen at any point even thinking about talking through the crack, let alone doing so

. But yes, if I'm trying to rationalise that particular lapse, that explanation is the one which fits.

Huh, when did that last one happen?

The Master refused to regenerate after being shot by Lucy Saxon; Romana I willingly regenerated into Romana II without sustaining any injury (and changed form several times during the same regeneration). Don't remember anything about suicide by failed regeneration though, surely it just wouldn't work and said Time Lord would have to live out the rest of their natural life?

 

[APZonerunner]

Huh, when did that last one happen?

I forget the story, but it's in an old Who story. T. Baker era, I think. A Time Lord friend of the Doctor's has no regenerations left and despite there being nothing wrong with him triggers the process in order to kill himself in a natural manner. It happens in one of the 8th Doctor novels as well, I believe.

 

[Future Foundation]

Third break, I'm still liking it, but I don't quite know about the makeup.

 

[Fiktion]

I forget the story, but it's in an old Who story. T. Baker era, I think. A Time Lord friend of the Doctor's has no regenerations left and despite there being nothing wrong with him triggers the process in order to kill himself in a natural manner. It happens in one of the 8th Doctor novels as well, I believe.

Ah, I don't know anything about the expanded universe material.

 

[maharg]

That would make sense, but

Spoiler

we never see anyone tell the Timelords what's happening on the other side of the crack - even Clara just says the Doctor needs help, but doesn't specify it's a danger so great the entire Time Lord race wouldn't be able to sort it fairly easily.

While this could have happened off-screen, it seems kind of unlikely as

Spoiler

no-one else is seen at any point even thinking about talking through the crack, let alone doing so

. But yes, if I'm trying to rationalise that particular lapse, that explanation is the one which fits.

If they just intended to come back no matter what they'd just do it. They're waiting for the Doctor to say it's safe in a way that no one else could trick them with, by saying his very-secret-for-whatever-reason name. So they're not going to come back until he does that, and Clara didn't do it for him -- she just told them he needed help. If the Doctor dies they will never know it's safe, so they had to help him.

If there's a problem with all this it's that it's not clear when the Time Lords got all reasonable since the last, in their chronology, we saw of them was them having plans to destroy the universe. I guess we're to assume that after bumping into the other universe they threw Rassilon under a bus.

 

[APZonerunner]

Ah, I don't know anything about the expanded universe material.

In terms of TV I just looked it up, it's in The Twin Dilemma, so it's a C. Baker story. 1984. Knew it was a Baker! A Time Lord in that story is possessed and forces himself to die (thus killing the being possessing him) by triggering one last regeneration.

 

[M.Bluth]

Think the accent might indeed cause a problem for some in the US, but they'll get used to it, I'm sure.

Thank you for the lines!

As for the accent, the audio was messed up for me the moment he regenerated, actually, till just before his last line. I was fine with his accent in The Thick of It.
But, yeah, depending on how it turns out in the series, you're right.

I'm biased towards Capaldi, but I found his expressions and the way he moved was very likable. Can't wait for series 8

 

[xandaca]

If they just intended to come back no matter what they'd just do it. They're waiting for the Doctor to say it's safe in a way that no one else could trick them with, by saying his very-secret-for-whatever-reason name. So they're not going to come back until he does that, and Clara didn't do it for him -- she just told them he needed help. If the Doctor dies they will never know it's safe, so they had to help him.

That's pretty good, hadn't thought of it like that.

And yes, I assume Rassilon was thrown under the bus after TEOT. The Bus Of Rassilon.

In terms of TV I just looked it up, it's in The Twin Dilemma, so it's a C. Baker story. 1984. Knew it was a Baker! A Time Lord in that story is possessed and forces himself to die (thus killing the being possessing him) by triggering one last regeneration.

Oh Christ, Twin Dilemma, no wonder I didn't remember it. Not sure I even managed to watch that one all the way through. Vengeance On Varos was supposedly the best of the Colin Baker era and that was a serious slog... I've seen quite a chunk of Trial Of A Time Lord, but have never found anything enjoyable about C. Baker's era (no reflection on the actor himself, who was handed horrific material).

 

[Fiktion]

In terms of TV I just looked it up, it's in The Twin Dilemma, so it's a C. Baker story. 1984. Knew it was a Baker! A Time Lord in that story is possessed and forces himself to die (thus killing the being possessing him) by triggering one last regeneration.

That's fascinating. I thought I'd read up on regeneration but I had no idea about that detail.

 

[APZonerunner]

That's fascinating. I thought I'd read up on regeneration but I had no idea about that detail.

It's just the same as the Doctor threatening to burn away Mr. Clever in Nightmare in Silver, really. He threatened to do it even though he had no regenerations left, but perhaps we now know why he didn't - not because he didn't want to lose that face, but because doing so would've killed 'em both.

Though the mystery of him healing River's hand is now a bit of a question mark.

Also assume Moffat changed his mind about the Dalek memory wipe...

 

[Future Foundation]

Handles

 

[xandaca]

It's just the same as the Doctor threatening to burn away Mr. Clever in Nightmare in Silver, really. He threatened to do it even though he had no regenerations left, but perhaps we now know why he didn't - not because he didn't want to lose that face, but because doing so would've killed 'em both.

Though the mystery of him healing River's hand is now a bit of a question mark.

Also assume Moffat changed his mind about the Dalek memory wipe...

The Daleks said they'd acquired their info on the Doctor when

Spoiler

they 'assimilated' Tasha.

EDIT: Sorry, keep forgetting to spoiler tag. Has this finished airing in the States yet?

 

[fluffydelusions]

Liked the final with Tennant better

 

[Future Foundation]

Fuck me, was that Amy In The TARDIS playing?

 

[Clegg]

I think a bit of Rings of Akhaten was played when Amy was walking down the stairs too.

 

[Goldrush]

Loves the episode, even if it's a greatest hit first and an actual story second. Actually surprised by how much got tied up. Thought that Moffat will bring strands over to tie his entire run together, but it looks like he want to start with a blank slate. Also extremely interesting that the last line hints that he'll be doing the opposite of what he did with Matt. Rather than an old man in a young body, it's a young man in an old body. If true, though, it'll make 11's final sentences heartbreaking.

 

[APZonerunner]

The Daleks said they'd acquired their info on the Doctor when

Spoiler

they 'assimilated' Tasha.

EDIT: Sorry, keep forgetting to spoiler tag. Has this finished airing in the States yet?

Well, sure they did, but that's what I mean. It appeared to be a massive plot point a year ago, and a big deal, but it was handwaved away (presumably forever) tonight. I can only guess he had a greater idea and binned it, which is fair enough.

 

[bengraven]

If people are handing out lines, what does Clara say to the Doctor when he goes off to talk to Tasha?

She says "get a room" and then he says something and what she says I cannot get.

 

[APZonerunner]

If people are handing out lines, what does Clara say to the Doctor when he goes off to talk to Tasha?

She says "get a room" and then he says something and what she says I cannot get.

It's something like "Queen of the psycho space nuns. That's very you." And he says "Yes. What? No." Something along those lines, can't remember exactly.

 

[The Real Abed]

Liked the final with Tennant better

I don't want to go!

Actually, I completely forget what Smith said before he went. I mean it's easy to remember Tennant and even Eccleston. "You were fantastic. And you know what? So was I!" That's just classic. Guess I'll have to rewatch it.

 

[maharg]

The Daleks said they'd acquired their info on the Doctor when

Spoiler

they 'assimilated' Tasha.

EDIT: Sorry, keep forgetting to spoiler tag. Has this finished airing in the States yet?

General rule is it's fair game when it airs in its home country. Doesn't matter if it's done in the US.

I don't want to go!

Actually, I completely forget what Smith said before he went. I mean it's easy to remember Tennant and even Eccleston. "You were fantastic. And you know what? So was I!" That's just classic. Guess I'll have to rewatch it.

I kind of like that I wasn't far off joking that he should do Roy Batty's speech from Bladerunner. This one was kind of reminiscent of that, especially for the first couple of lines. It's definitely not as quotable but I like the sentiment so much better than Tennant's, to the point where I feel like it was a bit of a rebuke of Ten's attitude to regeneration (especially coupled with the earlier line about having a vanity problem).

 

[Box of Bunnies]

Though the mystery of him healing River's hand is now a bit of a question mark.

Running on fumes. He's out of regenerations, but had enough energy in the tank to fix a broken wrist.

Or whatever.

 

[ElRenoRaven]

General rule is it's fair game when it airs in its home country. Doesn't matter if it's done in the US.

Exactly. It's still on here for about another 15 minutes or so. It's fair game though. Everyone else has to deal with it when shit airs here first. So turn about is fair play. So don't worry about it.

 

[xandaca]

I don't want to go!

Actually, I completely forget what Smith said before he went. I mean it's easy to remember Tennant and even Eccleston. "You were fantastic. And you know what? So was I!" That's just classic. Guess I'll have to rewatch it.

He said "I'll never forget the time the Doctor was me", or something close. Not great, but the

Spoiler

Amy/bow-tie removal

made up for it. And Clara's massive, super-adorable eyes at the sudden change to Capaldi.

 

[bengraven]

 

[Clegg]

I thought Smith's little speech was much better than Tennent's "I don't wanna go". 11's was sad, but there was a note of optimism and hope in it. Like he was saying no matter who he'd become in the future he'd always remember who he used to be and he was grateful for that.

10 was just whiny.

 

[twobear]

OKAY, I thought about it more,

Spoiler

although I'm still not convinced by the thermonuclear detonation regeneration, I am happy that Eleven went out on a bittersweet note. It wouldn't have been right if he got all mournful and mopey at the end, like Ten.

 

[Future Foundation]

Well...they weren't kidding about the "bang".

 

[twobear]

I also liked that

Spoiler

he said his last line about remembering who he was to the camera. A bit naff but that got me.

 

[xandaca]

OKAY, I thought about it more,

Spoiler

although I'm still not convinced by the thermonuclear detonation regeneration, I am happy that Eleven went out on a bittersweet note. It wouldn't have been right if he got all mournful and mopey at the end, like Ten.

Well Ten's whole character arc was about the battle between his ego and his empathy, concluding with him making the ultimate sacrifice to save a kind old man for no recognition or reward. He was mopey at the end because his ego was still a defining part of him, just one he knew he could suppress to do the right thing. Moffat's messy character writing means it's more difficult to identify a clear arc for Eleven, but he's generally been more of an amazing older brother than grand universal protector, prone to moments of melancholy but ultimately at his best when optimistic for the future and passing on wisdom (which is one of the reasons why he was always so great with children). He was the one who chose to forget rather than regret, after all.

 

[Platy]

The way regeneration works is that it's a process you have to actually activate. So you have to survive long enough to activate. The Doctor has 'died' from falls (4), various types of poisoning (5, 9, 10), a bang on the head (6) and even a shooting (7), but all of these were things that meant he had time to 'activate' the regenerative process. If the Doctor was shot in the head, he'd be dead instantly. If a Time Lord is killed in, say, an explosion, they'd be dead instantly. You have to actually have time to start the process. Even when the 10th Doctor gets show by the Dalek in Series 4, they were very careful to even make that effect a 'glancing' shot, it doesn't hit him full on as that'd kill him dead. They make a point of this in Night of the Doctor, as well, as the 8th Doctor actually dies instantly when the ship crashes but is then revived by the sisterhood so he can regenerate.

Bonus weird lore fact: A Time Lord can activate regeneration manually even when not injured, refuse to activate it, or even activate regeneration when they've no regenerations left to cause a failed regeneration and thus commit suicide.

Thanks !
Finaly something that makes sense =3

 

[DrForester]

The Daleks said they'd acquired their info on the Doctor when

Spoiler

they 'assimilated' Tasha.

EDIT: Sorry, keep forgetting to spoiler tag. Has this finished airing in the States yet?

People watching the BBA broadcast know well enough to steer clear of this thread till after it airs there.

 

[Big Papa Husker]

Uhh, pretty abrupt end on BBC America. He just said "do you know how to fly this thing" and the screen just faded to black. Did BBC America cut stuff out for commercials?

 

[wwm0nkey]

That ending speech

 

[twilitesparklemotion]

Moffat could have just said "hold on everyone, I'm stalling for the fiftieth." This was perfect.

 

[WyndhamPrice]

I really didn't think I was going to be that upset but as soon as Karen Gillan showed up the waterworks started. I didn't even like that character that much but that moment just hit me like a ton of bricks.

 

[aHebrewMenagerie]

Uhh, pretty abrupt end on BBC America. He just said "do you know how to fly this thing" and the screen just faded to black. Did BBC America cut stuff out for commercials?

That was the end haha

 

[Quick]

RIP HANDLES

 

[neojubei]

I miss Amy

 

[ElRenoRaven]

Well I enjoyed the hell out of it. Course I've enjoyed every damn episode of every damn season though. So I'm a freak.

 

[BattleMonkey]

Such a boring episode. The whole Christmas town story just felt so awkwardly put together.

 

[twilitesparklemotion]

Doctor Who Series 8 |OT| The oldest question in the universe: do you know how to fly this thing?

 

[Future Foundation]

Done. I really liked it, that end sequence was really good. It was so good seeing Capaldi (well, other than his eyes) as the Doctor, and Clara's mood whiplash - from despondent to flabbergasted - was awesome, aided by the Doctor giving her the Malcolm Tucker WTF look.

 

[Effect]

I really like this regeneration a LOT more then 10 into 11. Then again I've grown to like 11 a LOT more then 10. Really bittersweet but at the same time optimistic. I enjoyed his speech about never forgetting who he was. Having him see

Spoiler

Amy both as an little girl and adult was a nice touch.

Also that he could change at any moment once the process started and for them to follow up on that by

Spoiler

having him change at such a random moment

. At the same time it took Clara by surprise it took me by surprise as well. If that is what they were going for then great job. The ending on BBCA did seem to end very abruptly. Want to watch the reairing to see if that is handled differently.

 

[Kemal86]

Probably in the minority here but I would have liked for him to hallucinate River along with Amy. She wouldn't even have to talk - just walk down the stairs holding Amy's hand. The mother and her daughter, the wife. The two most important women in his life there to say goodbye.

Just my wishful thinking though, I loved it overall.

 

[Tucah]

RIP HANDLES

I would have watched a season of a severed, talking Cyberman head and Capaldi.

 

[Beowulf28]

Loved the regeneration scene. All in all way better than the way Tennent went out.

 

[thefil]

Well I enjoyed the hell out of it. Course I've enjoyed every damn episode of every damn season though. So I'm a freak.

Here here. I come to this show with a naively uncritical mind.