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[Bo_Hazem]

I feel like NeoGAF really knows me, I don't miss my stealth edit at all.

I only edited some spelling.

 

[Romulus]

From what I've seen it's not great.

 

[Belthazar]

Honest question here:

How are people now feeling about Bethesda's ability to deliver Elder Scrolls 6?

Will it be a radical departure / re-invention, or will it simply be a prettier version of Skyrim? (maybe it will feature flying mounts..?)

It'll be the latter, obviously.

 

[DonkeyPunchJr]

Really well written review, you explain and validate your points very well. I've held off buying Starfield until I narrow my backlog, but I've read some of your sentiments echoed before, and that is quite concerning. I'll eventually play it, but probably on sale. A huge selling point for me with Starfield wasn't the exploration, it was the exploration complimented by the world building, lore, and characters. If it has bad writing, the overall experience for me will inevitably be shit. Also, you should post impressions more often EviLore .

The writing was awful but I thought the lore and world building were really good. There’s still a lot to like here. The Vanguard faction quest line was legit awesome and had some big twists with major ties to the overall world and plot.

 

[Outlier]

Good writing in an RPG means different things to different people. You might appreciate meaningful choices. You might appreciate deep conversations with realistic characters. You might appreciate an epic adventure full of memorable twists and turns. You might appreciate years spent on developing the worldbuilding for an interesting universe full of diverse characters, races, species, backgrounds, and ideas.

Well, Starfield fails at RPG writing on every level. This doesn’t mean it’s a worthless failure of a game overall. The core mechanics of exploring, shooting, and looting can hold your attention, just as they may have in Bethesda’s previous open world RPGs. But at every turn the writing slaps you in the face.

Let’s start with the companions. Dear god. All of them are Lawful Good wet blankets who criticize you every roughly 15 seconds. Inventory over the minuscule weight limit? “Have you considered NOT picking up everything you can find?” every time you pick up an item. Stealing something, including from villains? “Wow, I didn’t realize I was hanging out with a CRIMINAL” every time you pick up an item. Get into a fight that you could have conceivably avoided via dialogue options? They will sometimes leave your party and brand you irredeemable, even if the only way to avoid the enemies attacking you was through a persuasion check that you failed, leaving you with no choice but to defend yourself. You’ll still be met with the companion leaving your party and refusing to talk to you. Unless every step you take is within their exacting moral expectations you will be reprimanded or dumped.

There are also story beats with bizarre turns. During one of the main faction quests, you are given one of your few pseudo-consequential player choices. Basically, you can choose a risky scientific option that unleashes genetically engineered microbes onto humanity to solve the problem, or a less risky naturalistic option where you breed an animal that will take care of the problem. If you choose the sensible naturalistic option with what is essentially a guaranteed good outcome based on the evidence presented to you, your companions will condemn you as a mouth-breathing moron. If you choose the risky scientific option that explicitly has a chance of wiping out humanity by mutating in unknown ways, your companions will laud you for “Trusting the Science" (actual quote), in what is a bizarre, warped take on recent events political messaging, considering how risky the in-game choice is.

Not only that, but if you have a companion in your party, good luck picking any of the rare Han Solo style dialogue options. In a mission where Andreja is your forced companion, you dock with a ship with the intention of stealing an item from the owner. This a morally gray mission where you’re expected to con the owner, burglarize him, or kill him in order to retrieve the item. When you enter the ship, you’re met with one of the owner’s employees, and he asks you why you’re there. You only have two dialogue options: one, be an imbecile and tell him exactly why you’re there, or two, you can reply facetiously that you heard there was a big party on the ship and you’re here to party. If you say the latter, Andreja, who is literally there to help you steal the item by any means necessary, will respond by Disliking your comment and interjecting flatly that she “has no interest in partying.”

It's a problem endemic to all the characters in Starfield. It was marketed as a Han Solo simulator, but you are constantly badgered and browbeaten by catty, humorless women for anything you do. I won’t dwell too much on the ideological choices made to satisfy the current year climate but suffice to say that roughly 90% of the leaders in Starfield are women. And they are one-dimensional, deeply unlikeable charisma black holes who will talk to you with utter contempt most of the time. Of the remaining 10%, most of the men are presented as incompetent or evil. It’s a galaxy ruled by Karens. And the Karens are also your party members and love interests. I have never experienced a more unlikeable cast of characters in an RPG.

Let’s also consider the dreaded romance options. The first romanceable companion you encounter is Sarah. Sarah is a middle-aged ex-military leader who runs the organization you join. She’s quick to criticize you and expects you to do the conventional and lawful thing at all times. If you romance her, by choosing options like Trusting the Science and by praising her awkwardly at every opportunity in a way that would be creepy and weird to any actual human being, she will eventually begin to trust you and open up. Now, by opening up I mean she will reveal herself to be a giant ball of insecure, wallowing baggage that you are expected to comfort with dialogue options that reduce her to the emotional maturity of a small child. “Wow, you’re so strong, Sarah! Good job staving off that nervous breakdown over nothing, Sarah!” Then, inexplicably, you will end these conversations about her baggage with a “Flirt” option if you want to pursue her romantically. She will rebuff your advances awkwardly and end the conversation every time. Do this on around a dozen separate occasions, with no actual romance or flirtation between you two, only rejections at the end of your impromptu therapy sessions, and she will trust you enough to take you on her loyalty mission, which is literally to confront her emotional baggage. Complete that and she will decide that she can get involved with you romantically. Without any intimate moments, explicitly or implicitly, she will then decide that she has fallen in love with you and want to get married. Handle her baggage for her --> let’s get married. That’s how it works for humans, right? Right?

I’m genuinely horrified by the writing in this game, and I pity the people who conjured up these character interactions. They must live some of the dullest and most dysfunctional lives imaginable.

Starfield displays time and time again, without fail, that it fundamentally lacks understanding of the human condition. You land on worlds with the premise of a dystopian cyberpunk society where hard drugs are legal and everything is available for a price. When you arrive, though, all you’ll find is some tepid fully clothed dancing at a bland nightclub and a few people talking about how cu-raaazy everything is. It’s a game unwilling to explore humanity’s faults and genuine human drama on any level. At the futuristic fashionista clothing stores your only options are literally unisex tarps. Everyone is of varied ethnicity but there is no ethnic culture whatsoever. Women are purely masculine, leaving no one left to be feminine. This is not a demand for T&A by any means. In the real world, men and women don’t wear tarps and talk in monotone at a safe distance, defined purely by their profession. Life is messy and dramatic, desires and egos clash, stars rise and fall, people love and lust and hate and trust and betray. But not in Starfield, a corporate-sanitized ideological bog too afraid to include one iota of humanity in its storytelling.

RPGs are doing so much more elsewhere, from Baldur's Gate 3 to Cyberpunk 2077, but even looking back at Bethesda's own games, this one is a step backwards. The Elder Scrolls games incorporate different ethnic backgrounds and intense religious beliefs, ugly racial prejudice and morally gray deities. Starfield reeks of design by committee resulting in a product too afraid to take any storytelling risks. Nothing can ever be well-written when it is this extraordinarily conformist and risk-averse, particularly when the expectations for political correctness are so narrow in 2023.

You can do better.

Great. So I'm expecting a game full of what I've already experience within a few hours of play.
A game created by tired/sad millennial and gen-x idealists.
It is very off putting seeing the women playing so many masculine roles as if the children are mostly born in tube farms and raised by equity committees (rather than parents) even though I'm not attracted to females/women.
Don't get me wrong. BG3 is full of minor woke catering, but it's strengths far outweigh them.
Bethesda seem to be losing their luster for bringing brilliance into gaming.

 

[LordOfChaos]

I was hyped for it. I really, really wanted to like it.

It feels like a 12 year old game. Why does opening any door, riding a train, taking an elevator cause a loading screen with Xbox SSDs? The conversations with the head on shots that just hard cut to other people head on if there's more than one person in a conversation feel archaic, and the controls are clunky, say aiming at your ship to fast travel there it doesn't just magnet on to a point of interest, it takes extra time aligning the pixels, same with aiming at a planet etc

Seems like PC is probably the place to play though, I enjoyed Skyrim a lot more those 12 years ago due to Nexus Mod Manager

 

[SeasonedInTheAbyss]

Will the witness please point out on the doll where Bethesda touched you?

 

[skyfall]

Nah. Hard disagree. I personally enjoy the dialogue in this game.

No, you didn't

 

[Tal Shiar Agent]

Honest to god (in its current state) Fallout 76 is an all around better RPG than Starfield.

I just rushed the main story in Starfield because right away I could tell that the writing was crap and the entire game is obtuse as fuck. Menus upon menus upon menus, its not intuitive like the PipBoy and the HUD is awful too.

 

[SmokedMeat]

Being criticized by my fellow companions on their moral high horse is a big turn off. I wouldn’t tolerate it at work from coworkers, and sure as hell don’t want it in a game.

Can you leave them stranded on a desolate planet?

 

[Roberts]

If it has good writing, please tell us and back it up with evidence. Even the intro has terrible writing. Hey your this random miner, oh touch this piece of rock. Oh you're the chosen one you must go now. Straight out of a 16bit era rpg.

First of all, Starfield has a very gamey writing. It's gamey just like Japanese game writing is gamey or, for example, Insomniac's, just different in its own ways. It is actually not that different from how their previous games were written. Their writers are not trying to be the next Dickens, David Foster Wallace and so on. It's written so that the player doesn't have to read walls of text so all the information is delivered in compact form. After playing the game for nearly 100 hours I really appreciate that, because I am not the one to skip dialogue.

The good news is that it never feels like one person wrote all the characters and made them talk the same. They might not be super deep characters but everybody has their own delivery, attitude and background. Also, in your travels you meet some random characters that have nothing to do with the main story or even faction quests and in a matter of a few sentences the game makes these characters feel like living beings going on about their business. You know, like a stranded field trip spaceship with a frustrated teacher and tons of kids making her already shitty day even worse. Yeah, there is a lot of detail and rich lore and that is great.

Finally, just like in their previous games, Starfield has tons of under-appreciated humour - Andreja's super dry remarks are never not funny. There is a lot of absurdist humour. There is satirical humour. And then there is plain weird and I love all that. Even at its most corny, the game is obviously self-aware. I can name shit ton of highly regarded games that have way worse comic writing and delivery than Starfield.

It's not hard to appreciate what they have done with the game if you can tune in on their wavelength. I don't think it is a badly written game at all.

 

[Robbinhood]

Sounds like the Ree of games.

 

[Drizzlehell]

In a world where RPGs like Holy Magic Century (no story), FFXIII (endless bullshit), and Ephemeral Phantasia (WTF?) exists, I'd find it hard to declare Starfield as one of the worst written of all time. Heck, it's not even Bethesda's worst written RPG; Fallout 4 isn't very good at all.

Personally, I find Starfield's particular brand of sanitised sci-fi kind of a nice break from the drudgery of the storytelling I feel submerged in these days. Instead of an endless stream of ham-fisted one-note social commentary (read: west coast American leftist ideology) or clueless wanna-bes trying to make "universal statements about the human condition" and instead just making misery porn, Starfield smooshes together pulp sci-fi with its NASA-punk grounding into something else entirely. It checks a lot of bullshit at the door, and instead of trying to setup real world metaphors and analogies to "say something", it really just tries to straight up entertain. Given the modern landscape of storytelling, I find its approach a welcome and refreshing change of pace. Strangely, I liken the world's tone and atmosphere to that of Bungie's Halo trilogy and vanilla Destiny 1. It captures a sense of scale and wonder that few games can. Despite the endless nightmares that the world seemingly presents, we're allowed to observe it through a perspective of awe, and, dare I say, hope. This is a combination of the writing, which never get dark and gritty, and the musical score serving as its underscore. From that perspective, I've found a lot of the side content to be pretty entertaining. They're simple stories, true, but I don't really consider that a negative given the game's context.

In terms of companions, this is Bethesda's second attempt at romanceable companions, and its fair criticism that they lack, well, romance. You don't need sex or lust to sell romance, you just need a human connection, and Bethesda's writers clearly struggle with that. I don't hate any of the characters so far, but putting it up against the companions in, say, Cyberpunk 2077, and the gulf is as wide as the solar system. No one's going to bat for Sarah the same way they'll go to bat for Panam. Hopefully Bethesda work on it and take the feedback on board.

As for their being too many women in positions of power, or too many unlikebale women, I don't really see that pattern myself. I find the characters in Starfield to land across the spectrum; men and women can both be enjoyable and terrible, funny and annoying. Science fiction has a long, storied tradition of putting female characters front and centre, perhaps the pattern you're seeing in simply the writers emulating the stories they used as inspiration? For me, I don't find there to be anything particularly bad enough to be noteworthy; Starfield doesn't have the best written characters in the industry, but it's not actively offensive or repulsive. I've found myself chuckling, rolling my eyes, and smiling; that's more than can be said for a few RPGs were the only emotions they illicit were boredom and frustration.

What draws me in to Starfield, I suppose, is the writing serving its purpose to stimulate the imagination. I can imagine myself in the game's disconnected stories, travelling the systems, exploring, and adventuring. I've always been a bit of a dreamer, and Starfield scratches that itch better than a lot of RPGs I've played. While it would've been better if the characters I met along the way were perhaps more memorable or well rounded, I'm happy enough with what's there to continue trekking across the stars, seeing what else lies in store. I suppose it's not for everyone.

Well said. When I play this game, the main impression that I'm getting is that Tood & co. primarily wanted to make a game that would instill that sense of wonder and discovery that always drew me to the topic of space exploration and astrophysics. I don't feel like this game is supposed to be a sweeping space opera with tall tales of heroes and villains and sinister plots to destroy the universe (although there are still some things at stake here, obviously). Instead, Bethesda simply uses the gameplay and the writing to put you in the mindset of a space explorer of the distant but plausible future. There's a clear desire here to make the kind of game that the likes of Carl Sagan or Arthur C. Clarke would've been proud of. The type of fiction that takes artistic liberties with certain aspects of science but still tries to keep things grounded, plausible, and yeah - kinda hopeful too.

I generally agree that there are some annoyances, especially when it comes to plot-critical characters. For example, the fact that you can't just put a bullet in their head and make the story play out differently based on that choice, or how your companions will constantly nag you about some shit (Vasco is the best companion because of that). I also find it a bit disappointing that, in a lot of story or faction-related quests, I can't just pull a gun and shoot some annoying asshole in the face or have more dialogue options to mouth off or provoke them instead of having to take their shit like a docile pet. Basically, I would like to be able to shoot more people in the face when they piss me off, and not have them get back up 10 seconds later.

But overall, do those annoyances weigh so heavily upon the rest of the experience to ruin the whole thing for me? Eh, not really. These are the kind of things that don't bother me too much because again, the story is just an excuse for me to role-play as an ass-kicking Snake Plissken type of guy who roams the galaxy and makes a name for himself by picking up random, unrelated contracts.

 

[P:axMagellanic]

Something catastrophic happened during this games development. Howard's an old giga nerd, I don't believe for a second this is what he envisioned his elite/pulpy space game to be.

I couldn't roll my eyes far enough back into my head when I came across as the space cowboys being a main faction, and that we're chasing down Thu'um and Word Walls as our main quest. Pagliarulo really is a cunt.

I Finished Paradiso last night and again... Literally nothing there outside of cynicism and snark... I mean really, that's the extent to that story, that's what you're going for? Arguably one of the biggest discoveries this settings humanity has made since the exodus from earth?

 

[Topher]

how is travel a slog when you can pretty much fast travel anywhere?

It is a slog when you have no other choice but to go 800m or so to some far off destination on foot. Weird, because I keep looking back at my space ship and wondering "why am I walking this far?"

 

[TheUsual]

Yeah, the more I've played this past week, the more I'm enjoying not bringing any companions along with me. I just leave them on the ship.

The exploration has its grips in me fully.

 

[Last Hearth]

So, basically good RPG’s now have to come from outside the US cuz it’s just lost at this point. Sad.

It’s not even about the US as much as a mega corp like Microsoft, who will never produce anything other than the most bland politically correct stuff possible.

 

[Northeastmonk]

The part about The Elder Scrolls is on point. They’ve got different races clashing against each other and different religious beliefs. I didn’t get Starfield, but from what I’ve seen it looks like it plays it safe. The more they represent humans, the safer they become, so the whole experience has to be boring, respectable, and equality has to shine through and through. Which is crazy, you have to create high fantasy with dragons and elves before touching upon any serious issues. Which doesn’t represent real life at all. The only thing they can represent is gun violence. All the Karen’s at Bethesda must be proud.

 

[Grildon Tundy]

I wonder if Microsoft had anything to do with the lack of dismemberment in this game. The engine can simulate the physics of 10,000 potatoes so it doesn't seem performance related, and Bethesda's prior games had it.

 

[rofif]

I've played first hour or two and it makes no sense whatsoever.
Oh hey, you a miner now
Oh wow, that was strange lol you had a vision? no matter, get back to work
wowowow what's that ship?!
Lol hey Ima Berret, I will mine in your place, you take the ship dog lol
Warning, you've been attacked! Do not run. Go to their hideout and murderer everyone.
After killing everyone, try negotiating with the pirate Captain... at the end of the dugeon when you killed everyone.
you are a miner after all

 

[AtomicStarving]

I think my biggest issue with Bethesda games is the lack of human interaction. Like wtf are you doing, putting all these people that can't hug, kiss or have sex. There's none of that in Bethesda games to this day (npcs doing it, or even in cutscenes), and my innocence thought this was because the "lack of power", but the true is... they are really incompetent in making rpgs, imo. As always modders will do the work for them.

 

[Dream-Knife]

I've learned to just skip western RPGs.

 

[arkhamguy123]

I post a long thought out thesis on why this game is disappointing and neogaf goes

“BAAAAAAAAIT! TROLL! WHAT A FUCKIN LOSER GET THIS DELETED MODS” and I have my thread immediately moved and buried in the review thread.

This guy says it sports some of the worst writing of any rpg ever (which is true) and gets 300 comments of agreement and insightful discussion and respectful disagreements and debates.

Alrighty

 

[Kacho]

You summed up my feelings exactly. The universe is toothless. Nothing feels real or genuine. It’s generically diverse to a fault and all the characters are some level of good which makes role playing dull. There’s nothing thought provoking. Nothing compelling.

Take the ruthless space pirates for example, who take diversity quotas VERY seriously.. The Crimson Fleet is supposedly feared. No one wants to cross paths with them. But when you meet them they’re exactly like any other group in that universe. They aren’t truly villains. When you compare that faction to the Legion in Fallout New Vegas it’s easy to see how far we’ve declined.

 

[BigLee74]

Lol herp derp don't critique my starfield.

But on a serious note the OP wrote and in-depth reason why the game has awful writing citing many examples.

For you and all the starfield Stan's and shameless excuses used for a game with bad reviews.

Can any of you give a coherent reason why the game has GOOD writing, other than 'despites it's flaws, I'm having fun'.

If it has good writing, please tell us and back it up with evidence. Even the intro has terrible writing. Hey your this random miner, oh touch this piece of rock. Oh you're the chosen one you must go now. Straight out of a 16bit era rpg.

You seem confused. I don’t think any single person is saying the game has GOOD writing, so who exactly needs to be giving coherent reasons?

And people can and are having fun despite this, and have given good reasons why.

 

[ungalo]

Critics are valid and yet i don't think it's one of the worst written RPGs of all time (but i don't know how far we reach with this term).

A game that didn't make any sense to me was Fallout 4. The lore was well written but anything else (dialog, factions etc) was pure garbage, i think Starfield is solid in comparison.

 

[Jigsaah]

I didn't read the whole thing cuz I'm still playing and probably a few spoilers in there but I tend to agree with the premise.

I don't care about anybody in this game. The companions are boring as hell. The story so far, is dull. How do you make space exploration boring? In the past decade RPGs have grown up and it feels like Bethesda played it super safe. Some side stories are more interesting than what I've seen in the main story. That shouldn't be the case.

I'm coming off playing through most of Baldurs Gate 3 and a 3rd playthrough of Cyberpunk. There's just no comparison.

Starfield shines in other ways. The ship building is genius. I love building my own outposts and creating an interstellar pipeline. I appreciate how far Bethesda has come in some aspects since Skyrim. But the story and its presentation is stuck in 2013.

 

[Last Hearth]

I think my biggest issue with Bethesda games is the lack of human interaction. Like wtf are you doing, putting all these people that can't hug, kiss or have sex. There's none of that in Bethesda games to this day (npcs doing it, or even in cutscenes), and my innocence thought this was because the "lack of power", but the true is... they are really incompetent in making rpgs, imo. As always modders will do the work for them.

But is this Bethesda or just the current Western game development environment? Because CP2077 was also bland as hell on that front. It’s inconceivable that it was made by the se company that made the Witcher. So I assume it’s not because they are a company of asexual employees.

 

[Del_X]

Main Quest is boring garbage. Side quests are good but you kinda need to get far into the main quest before the universe and your abilities become interesting.

There’s a mission on earth where you find the origin of the grav drives and that feels like the best spot to just ignore constellation.

 

[Topher]

The writing was awful but I thought the lore and world building were really good. There’s still a lot to like here. The Vanguard faction quest line was legit awesome and had some big twists with major ties to the overall world and plot.

I don't think the writing is "awful", but I just don't find it very memorable. Most times I find myself reading the dialogue and clicking to skip to the next. I just want to get the gist and move on. But sometimes the writing can be pretty good. The Crimson Fleet faction quest, I thought, was excellent. There is mystery to be solved and the resolution to the tale was satisfying. I enjoyed the Vanguard quest as well. On the other hand, the Rangers was just ok. Ryujin was ridiculous.

To your point, I agree that the lore provided a nice back drop to rest of the story. However, I feel the main story quest was a major disappointment after finishing. And I feel sorry for those who were told to rush to NG+ because I think that was probably the worst advice anyone could have given. I think doing that would have ruined the game entirely for me.

I agree there is a ton to like here. It is just that the story definitely isn't among the game's brightest moments. Going to disagree with EviLore that it is the worst written RPG of "all-time" as I have definitely seen much worse (although I suspect there is some intentional hyperbole at play here). Now if we are talking about Starfield's direct peers such a Mass Effect, Dragon Age, prior Bethesda games, etc. then I can probably get on board with that and I agree with much of what he says about the issues with companions. I think among the biggest sins for any story is characters who don't stay in character. That's the case here, unfortunately. But I enjoyed my initial 140+ hours in the game and I'll be back for more at some point.

 

[Alebrije]

Honest to god (in its current state) Fallout 76 is an all around better RPG than Starfield.

I just rushed the main story in Starfield because right away I could tell that the writing was crap and the entire game is obtuse as fuck. Menus upon menus upon menus, its not intuitive like the PipBoy and the HUD is awful too.

Fallout 76 is better in the sence you can do more stuff on a best map/world. On both games the writting is bland but at least on 76 the focus is exploration and team work and not story focus.

The last good RPG was New Vegas , since then all thier games have bad writting and behave more like shooters than RPGs

 

[ungalo]

Although there are also things i don't really understand, why would we expect the Starfield universe to have racial prejudice because TES has ?

Bethesda are also allowed to engage in the themes they want, that's why they made a new IP in the first place and frankly this game looks like a liberation for them on many levels. And i also disagree with this analysis of "it's for gen Z". Most of what the game talks about is boomer stuff, it's not some ostentatious post modern apocalyptic vision that's a complete shitshow, most of the stories they want to tell are either about very universal, hopeful and modern stuff (human progress, the place of Man in the universe, religion as a truth seeking experience and not some existential crutch...) or very down to earth but interesting things (like work environment, science etc).

So yes it's not going to engage in some subject with a lot of intensity, and it stays very neutral on a lot of things (but i'd say the apparent neutrality was always part of their game, i'm not saying Starfield is not perhaps more politically correct than before, like most games, but it's really not something striking compared to even Skyrim in my opinion).

 

[XOMTOR]

Maybe AI wrote it. If not, they should have gotten AI to write it.

 

[Raven117]

It really is disappointing. It is absolutely not compelling at all.

(It does kinda feel like Outer Worlds, a game I thought that was completely toothless in its writing and humor).

Just jacking around in Cyberpunk 2.0 waiting for the expansion, it’s clear just how far Bethesda has fallen back in writing compelling games.

I know video games as a medium is still relatively young and writing is hard. Making things worse, you have the “marvel” effect of stripping out complexity and dynamic characters to make everything fit inside certain expectations…. But anyone who plays these or watches this know that something doesn’t ring true, and thus, not compelling.

All writers (well, and their bosses) need to again analyze what makes compelling characters to begin with. They are failing so hard and everything sucks. (Counterpoint, watch the Bear, that’s a character driven show. Complex, layered, you love and hate everyone… like life).

 

[rofif]

I post a long thought out thesis on why this game is disappointing and neogaf goes

“BAAAAAAAAIT! TROLL! WHAT A FUCKIN LOSER GET THIS DELETED MODS” and I have my thread immediately moved and buried in the review thread.

This guy says it sports some of the worst writing of any rpg ever (which is true) and gets 300 comments of agreement and insightful discussion and respectful disagreements and debates.

Alrighty

This guy owns the site, so obviously
Maybe you were too aggressive or something?

 

[arkhamguy123]

This guy owns the site, so obviously
Maybe you were too aggressive or something?

Nah man. Check my post history. It was a very calm post

But yeah fair enough I guess he does

 

[sendit]

Honest question here:

How are people now feeling about Bethesda's ability to deliver Elder Scrolls 6?

Will it be a radical departure / re-invention, or will it simply be a prettier version of Skyrim? (maybe it will feature flying mounts..?)

If they somehow manage to incorporate loading screen in 2028, I will quit gaming.

 

[Filben]

That's what happens when game designers and developers are not working together with the authors. I mean, in one quest a doctor from the Well laments about a new stomach bug making children sick by the numbers. When I was there there wasn't a single child around. Where were all these sick children she was talking dramatically about?

I've said it elsewhere and I'm still thinking this is not an RPG. It's explorational action adventure with a perk system and extensive crafting. So maybe.. a 2X Action Adventure game, as in Explore and Exterminate? It's neither a sim because you can't even fly off planet or land on them manually. And there's no real economy effected by your actions.

It's a fun game for me, but I'm not considering it an RPG.

 

[Raven117]

I post a long thought out thesis on why this game is disappointing and neogaf goes

“BAAAAAAAAIT! TROLL! WHAT A FUCKIN LOSER GET THIS DELETED MODS” and I have my thread immediately moved and buried in the review thread.

This guy says it sports some of the worst writing of any rpg ever (which is true) and gets 300 comments of agreement and insightful discussion and respectful disagreements and debates.

Alrighty

lol.

 

[DeaDPo0L84]

I don't play a ton of games each year, with that said this is the most disappointing one I've personally played this year. It somehow managed to push Diablo 4 out of that spot. It doesnt do even one thing that is spectacular, everything it attempts to do is average at best.

People saying it's their favorite game of the year or even ever, I have serious questions as to what videogames they have played in the past.

 

[near]

The writing was awful but I thought the lore and world building were really good. There’s still a lot to like here. The Vanguard faction quest line was legit awesome and had some big twists with major ties to the overall world and plot.

How so? How well written is the lore, so like how is the backstory and history delivered in terms of exposition. Is there depth there? World building is part of the writing process, so what makes it good? How is the overall tone of the story, its themes, and does it feel seamless with the characters that inhabit it? How is all of that still digestible in a meaningful way if the companion and interactable cast dialogue is ass?

 

[Boots_the_God]

The characters were fine to me. They are who they are. Pretty in line with any group of companions you find in other games of the sort.

 

[JayK47]

I'm still playing it, but I agree the writing and characters are pretty bland. Sarah really is awful. Bisexual of course, yet straight to marriage. Wha? Yeah, the nightclub on Neon is absolute shit. Clothing options are shit. The game desperately needs mods to fix the clothing issues and hopefully the relationship issues. That is assuming woke ass Nexus mods allows it. I blame Microsoft honestly. Being immediately greeted by needing to enter your pronouns set the stage for disappointment by committee. I am sure Microsoft made the decision to include pronouns and fill the game with bland dressed girl bosses.

 

[Saber]

If theres something I can't stand in any game is fucking annoying characters. You spend a whole game interacting with them, why they should be that way? I honestly blame people who have fetish for realism in games...

Well at least they implemented pronoums, amiright

 

[rofif]

Mass Effect 2 is in another universe of writing. Great and memorable party members, compelling stakes, many difficult morally gray choices to make with consequential outcomes, great worldbuilding that fleshes out the different factions, worlds, conflicts. If only we still had pre-castration Bioware around.


The Outer Worlds suffers from a lot of the same issues with its ideological slant undermining the storytelling and character writing. Helping an asexual mechanic woman with her personal "romance" problems is not my idea of escapist sci-fi adventure. But the writing is more complex than anything on offer in Starfield, and the game had an emphasis on choice and consequence. Starfield mainly benefits from being much grander in scope, with lots of cities to wander around and major faction questlines bouncing you around the galaxy.

Morrowind remains something special.

Mass Effect 1 and 2 are incredible. The characters and story are so good. ME2 might be the best game ever

 

[YeulEmeralda]

I wager the sheer scale of truth and facts displayed here will make for a short lived topic.

Although I really want to see someone try and spin this into nothingness.

Allow me: nobody plays Bethesda games for the story or characters. So I don't think people really care.

 

[Topher]

Well at least they implemented pronoums, amiright

10/10

 

[MrA]

Pffft clearly people have forgotten/repressed Ultima "stealing is wrong" ix, but seriously the "twust teh Sciencez" is so stupid as "the science", literally destroyed the earth

 

[DonkeyPunchJr]

I think my biggest issue with Bethesda games is the lack of human interaction. Like wtf are you doing, putting all these people that can't hug, kiss or have sex. There's none of that in Bethesda games to this day (npcs doing it, or even in cutscenes), and my innocence thought this was because the "lack of power", but the true is... they are really incompetent in making rpgs, imo. As always modders will do the work for them.

The funny thing is in New Atlantis there’s a same-sex couple watching their kid play at the playground.

Like they portrayed this world where none of the hundreds of people you interact with has a happy romantic relationship/family, or shows the slightest interest in pursuing such a thing. But someone still went out of their way to put a happy gay couple on display.

 

[Fredrik]

baffling how certain scores can be handed out so easily. The sum of the parts isn't enough to make up for the archaic decisions.

Yes. They simply need to do better. They're fortunate the game has some marketing and hype or else this would be universally panned if it not a Bethesda game.

It's a mediocre 6/10.

A game can still be fun and worthy of a high score for someone even if flawed. Is Zelda TOTK a perfect game? Definitely not. People just have different taste in games. Halo Infinite was a 7/10 for me but GAF thought it was the GOTY. And Starfield is a 9/10 for me and on my top 3 this year but for you it’s a 6/10. Big deal.

And it’s not like people in the OT are playing the game for 100 hours because of hype or marketing or it being a Bethesda game. The game simply has something that is appealing in the game loop, look at a Steam most played chart, there are still more people playing Starfield weeks after launch than the top concurrent player count on any Elder Scrolls or Witcher or Assassin’s Creed game, etc. Quite impressive for a ”mediocre” game.