DaGwaphics
Member
All complete speculation at this point. We'll see in the spring I guess.
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Report: Sony overhauling PlayStation Plus with new tiers and streaming
All complete speculation at this point. We'll see in the spring I guess.
MasterCornholio
Member
I think of it's the only option then I can see subscription services being bad for the industry. Which isn't the case with these consoles.
As for video game rentals I prefer to own it whether digitally or physically. But that's just me.
As for this becoming a massive success I fail to see that happening if Sony still clings on to not releasing their games day one on the service. I honestly am not sure of they could afford to do that since that revenue from actually from physical/digital copies seems pretty important to them.
I could be wrong and I'll accept that but we have to wait and see what actually happens.
Topher
Gold Member
Me either. Not sure why we have these expectations for Sony to do things exactly how Microsoft has done them. Day one on PC. Day one on subscription. Nah.....Sony makes damn good money on first party and it is good for their platform so I think we will see more of what we have already seen. First party on PC.......eventually. First party on subscription......eventually.
Either way, I don't care as long as they keep churning out the top notch games they have always made.
That is quite the broad generalization, but "people" can be "genuine and true" about in what they have said about subscription services regardless of the success or failure of the services. One has nothing to do with the other.
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StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
Unless one of the tiers has day one first party PS games, it is no Game Pass.
Sounds like a reworking of what they current got in a few options, with the biggest changes maybe being additional PS5 and anime streaming.
Sounds like a reworking of what they current got in a few options, with the biggest changes maybe being additional PS5 and anime streaming.
MasterCornholio
Member
True but I wouldn't doubt Sony looking at different streams of revenue. Of course I'm sure they studied the effects of day one releases versus delaying the release of those titles on the service. It will be interesting to see which option they take.
It's going to be more options for the consumer but I question if what they will offer will be what the consumer wants.
Not really, it was a couple of years ago that sony sent out surveys on different tiers of PlayStation Plus. If all this does is add PS Now and PS Plus together then I don't think this will make much of an impact. The big thing about gamepass was day and date of Xbox Exclusives, I highly doubt sony will do Day and Date because they dont need to. The exclusives generally sale very well.
MasterCornholio
Member
I guess that's the main point of this for me. As long as I have the option to buy high quality games then it really shouldn't affect me if they are offered on a service.
Just looking at gamepass for an example. If I buy Forza Horizon 5 it will be just as good as getting the game off gamepass. As long as the quality isn't affected by being on a service then it really doesn't matter.
I guess looking at Sony if they take Spiderman 2 and cut content out plus add a ton of MTX to fit a subscription service then that would bother me. If they don't do that then I don't have an issue with the game being on a service.
alabtrosMyster
Banned
I'm not gonna act like I'm happy that this kind of service gets more prevalent.
yurinka
Member
No, they are increasing the offering on the PS Now subscription instead by bundling it with more stuff: the third tier os PS Plus would be PS Plus + PS Now, and now PS Now would feature PS5, PS1 and PSP games to PS Now.
The simpler tier would be the current PS Plus, and there would be a Game Pass like intermediate tier that would include PS Plus and download only PS Now version with PS4 and PS5 games with no retro games. I assume that this streaming-less tier (unlike the current PS Now and XCloud) would be available worldwide, so many people would get it.
If these 3 tiers now count as part of the same service, they will count its subscribers together making their streaming service sound stronger, as MS does.
alabtrosMyster
Banned
Microsoft betrayed this with Forza horizon 5 (maybe some other game too) by charging for early access, a good portion of the price too.
Talk about double dipping, you convince people that they get free games on the paid rental service, then you pre-sell them so that some have access to the games on the actual release date (I mean early access)... Slimy at best.
thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Gold Member
You mean like how the Blockbuster model was a real danger to movie studios? 'Ya know what? Some studios WERE against it (and even the VHS format) at first, but then they wised up, embraced it, adapted, and have grown thanks to them.
Equating some of these game streaming services as "renting" is inaccurate because renting implies no full ownership and also a limit on a virtual query WRT number of items that can be simultaneously provided, but at least with things like GP this isn't true because you can buy every game provided and can download (or in some cases, download or stream) as many games your storage can keep and play among them however you want.
Not necessarily sure how the specifics for Sony's restructure of their service will handle those things, but I can only imagine it will be similar. Also TOS apply to any distribution model; we've seen a handful of physical/digital games get censored and/or banned for release on PlayStation (and to a lesser extent, Xbox. To a notably lesser extent, Nintendo) consoles due to rules basically put in place by Sony that they can and do change every so often.
That's without PS+ or PS Now entering the equation btw.
yurinka
Member
The main change is that like in Gamepass, they will have a new subscription with downloadable PS4 and PS5 games. And that they will merge them into a tier system, with the PS Now bundling the previous two tiers as MS does in GP Ultimate. And well, that they will increase their bet stronger on BC too like MS.
Obviously they won't include their games day one because it's a suicide to get attention when you don't sell enough to compete against the others. They have a better performing strategy, so won't break it.
I do agree that Microsoft marketing might influence people's priorities but think it's a cyclical relationship.
I do like the TV show analogy but I am not sure that it works perfectly for gaming sadly. I don't think people are consuming old games any where as much as to how people consume old TV shows (background tv/comfort TV). There will be some that replay games once a year but definitely not to the same level of people watching an old sitcom.
yurinka
Member
We don't know how are they going to name the tiers, maybe the names are:
-PS Plus
-PS Plus Colleciton
-PS Plus Now
Griffon
Member
True... just right now.
But if/when the service has several millions of gamers (who will majorly very rarely try new games outside of the service), this song and dance will be much different, especially for smaller devs who don't have bargaining/marketing powers like Rockstar and co.
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Hawking Radiation
Member
Jason throws 'GamePass' in to his post regarding Sony's plans to unite their PS Now and PS Plus offerings and the Xbox fanboys lose their minds 
. Like moths to a flame.
We don't even know what the final service is or will be offering
This thread is comedy gold
Please warriors, continue...
. Like moths to a flame.We don't even know what the final service is or will be offering
This thread is comedy gold
Please warriors, continue...
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kyliethicc
Member
No. The PS Now name will die. And the Plus Collection is already a thing.
The names will be..
Plus
Plus Premium / Pro / Platinum etc
Plus Ultimate / Max / Diamond / etc
Dumb shit like that.
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Spitfire098
Member
Nothing is preventing day 1 3rd party games from dropping into this program. Bugsnax, Destruction all stars, fall guys, odd world soulstorm, rocket league etc all came to ps plus.
yurinka
Member
Yes. PS Plus and PS Now have been growing and I expect them to grow. With this announcement, they will grow more.
Game Pass didn't grow from January to the end of September, but I think Halo and Forza will help it grow this quarter.
If as I think, the second tier of this PS Plus is basically a PS Now without streaming + PS Plus bundle, no streaming will mean that -like non Ultimate Game Pass- will be available worldwide, so many people more will join it.
Wizz-Art
Member
They said it wasn't sustainable.
They said it will bring the whole industry down and crash and burn. FUD almost 24/7.
They said owning the games for $70 a piece is always way better then renting for $1.
They called us green rats for supporting the service.
Imagine being one of them and changing your tune.
They said it will bring the whole industry down and crash and burn. FUD almost 24/7.
They said owning the games for $70 a piece is always way better then renting for $1.
They called us green rats for supporting the service.
Imagine being one of them and changing your tune.
yurinka
Member
I assume the 2nd tier that seems to be a PS Now without streaming bundled with PS Plus (so a base Game Pass) will be available worldwide. And then the 3rd tier that includes streaming will have the 19 countries, or maybe a few more. XCloud is supported in 26 countries as I remember, so it could be something like that in the near future, since from time to time they keep adding countries to PS Now.
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Clintizzle
Lord of Edge.
I hope they put Goodbye Volcano High on it DAY 1
Bernd Lauert
Banned
There is no subsidizing going on. Gamepass is sustainable, which means it pays for itself.
Agent X
Member
I consider myself a hardcore retro fan, but I'm very skeptical. I suppose it really depends on what the three tiers cost, and what content they offer. On the surface, a collection of retro games just doesn't sound like the type of thing that you would reserve for your highest tier.
It looks a lot like what Nintendo is doing with N64 and Genesis games on their service, and that announcement garnered a lot of ridicule, even from staunch Nintendo fans.
One of the biggest criticisms of Nintendo's service is that they don't offer the N64/Genesis games as purchasable downloads on their online store. You can only access them through the top tier of their online service. Likewise, if Sony does not offer the ability for users to purchase the PS1/PSP games individually through PlayStation Store, then this will be a spectacular failing on their part, considering that hardcore fans have been clamoring for this for several years.
Javthusiast
Banned
Loxus
Member
Their just merging PS+ & PS Now.
What does that have to do with GamePass being sustainable or profitable?
PS+ is running out of good monthly games, so it's best to make streaming apart of the PS+ offerings.
yurinka
Member
PS2 games included in PS Now can be downloaded and played offline in PS4 and PS5. In fact you can buy them in PSN store without having PS Now.
They have a PS2 emulator, so they could do a PS1 and PSP emulator too, and to run them natively offline. Or simply they can follow the easier way: to use the PS1 and PSP emulator that PS3 already, and to keep PSP games for streaming only. They would save the money of making a new emulator, and would find a way to get more revenue for the PS3 servers they have for PS Now. And at the same time, keeping PS1 and PSP tied to their most expensive subscription tier because it's the only one featuring streaming, would act as selling point for some people to upgrade.
No, according to Schreier they won't include their games day one in this new PS Plus.
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Bojanglez
The Amiga Brotherhood
Imagine posting this without sarcasm
No.
Being financially sustainable does not (have to) mean it pays for itself.
If it was profitable they would say. No chance GP is profitable at the moment, too many freebies and discounts. That's expected of sub model at the growth stage, nothing wrong in it not being profitable right now. I've expect the tipping point to be about a year or so away. But MS has plenty of cash in the bank to pay for the losses, and it is sustainable because they will not run out of cash before the growth targets are hit and it becomes self-sustaining.
12Dannu123
Member
The subscriber isn't going to magically bring just because there's a higher tier. Most people are subscribing to the basic tier, Sony will still need to convince people to subscribe to the higher tiers.
FunkMiller
Gold Member
If you read this in epic trailer man voice, it truly comes alive, and the dumb reaches its absolute zenith.
Again I don't see this as a direct competitor to Gamepass and I think the title on the Bloomberg article was put in that way to simply grab more hits.
The title of this thread is way closer to reality.
They're basically mixing their current services Plus and Now introducing tiers in a way that is more interesting and desirable for consumers.
Gamepass is about AAA day one first party releases otherwise it would be pretty much the same of the current PSNow.
In general I think that pricing is the key here.
If they can merge Plus+Now (only download without cloud streaming) at a price that is not much higher than current Plus, they're gonna have a winner.
The top tier subscription with the back catalogue...its success will depend on the improvements they can offer on these old games. Microsoft worked for years to make old games better with significant upgrades in resolution and frame rate.
If Sony simply offers Psone, PSP and PS2 games as they were through streaming the value proposition of the highest tier won't be strong imo.
It's a total wait and see atm although I think this is the way to go to improve their services.
CapnAmaricrunch
Banned
yurinka
Member
Let's say that for PS1 and PSP games they use the emulators they had on PS3, so like PS3 games, PS1 and PSP games would be tied to PS Now, so their most expensive tier. To make it simpler (get X tier if you want retro games) and to give an extra selling point to their most expensive tier, retro games (PS1, PS2, PS3, PSP) would be locked in the top tier.
The intermediate tier seems to be PS Plus + download only/no streaming version of PS Now. So they couldn't include there PS3, PS1 and PSP. Many people would get the intermediate tier because it would have many PS5 (and mostly) PS4 games and specially because since it doesn't have streaming, unlike the top tier pretty likely will be available worldwide.
As of now PS Now is only available in 19 countries, and XCloud in 26 countries because game streaming servers are super expensive and they must be placed relatively close to its customers to have a decent latency.
yurinka
Member
Won't happen, because PS3 games available on PS Now servers are running on PS3 hardware.
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Bernd Lauert
Banned
Phil Spencer went out of his way to point out that Gamepass is not losing money in hope for some future profit, but that it's already sustainable.
And no, MS generally doesn't talk about profits regarding their subdivisions. Has nothing to do with Gamepass.
Bojanglez
The Amiga Brotherhood
Things they might do to differentiate it.
- allow games you own to be streamed (not just those in the catalogue)
- a proper iOS streaming solution, where (maybe a subset of) games at least are each available as individual games but you have to log in to your PS+ account. Thus getting around the current restrictions.
- launch with a supported handheld device or official PS phone grip controller
- trophies and save states for PSOne, PSP games
I hope they also rip off the things other services do well.
- allow games you own to be streamed (not just those in the catalogue)
- a proper iOS streaming solution, where (maybe a subset of) games at least are each available as individual games but you have to log in to your PS+ account. Thus getting around the current restrictions.
- launch with a supported handheld device or official PS phone grip controller
- trophies and save states for PSOne, PSP games
I hope they also rip off the things other services do well.
Topher
Gold Member
Lupin25
Member
This gives PS Plus more competitive pricing, offering it bundled with PS Now is an extremely smart to extract the most they can from these services, especially PS Now.
Hopefully PS players will have access to a lot more downloadable PS1/PS2 content, if we’re given the option to pay more too!
Hopefully PS players will have access to a lot more downloadable PS1/PS2 content, if we’re given the option to pay more too!
yurinka
Member
I see these prices:
-Tier 1 (PS Plus): $59.99/year
-Tier 2 (PS Plus + download only, no retro games PS Now): $79.99/year
-Tier 3 (PS Plus + full PS Now with streaming retro games): $99.99/year
At first it would make more sense to charge more for the top one, but keeping it under the $100 psychological barrier would increase its sales, and would make it easier to jump to a more expensive one when the difference is smaller. Plus not having there day one games, they would fight against MS not only with the way bigger catalog, but also with a way better pricing.
Sosokrates
Report me if I continue to console war
It would be cheaper to put there own games on there rather then day 1 3rd parties.
Remember gamepass games still sell quite well.
yurinka
Member
Phil Spencer didn't say Game Pass is profitable, he said it's sustainable. Which is different.
It can be losing money while being sustainable for them because they have a shit ton of money. Which pretty is the case.
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Chukhopops
Member
That’s complete bullshit, it grew by 37% in a one year period, there’s no way it was 0% growth for 8 months. Quit making things up.
THE DUCK
voted poster of the decade by bots
If they were serious about competing, both of these would have been added years ago......especially zero dawn. And only 3 months for a 18 month old first party title? Wow.
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