EverydayBeast
thinks Halo Infinite is a new graphical benchmark
Xbox Live led to subscribers yes.
This argument is largely a false cause because the inability to cheat isn't a result of XBL or PS+, it's due to a closed hardware ecosystem. XBL didn't save COD: WaW or GTA V from hackers who modded their Xbox 360's.Hackers/cheaters have taken over and ruined MP gaming on PC. I'm not a fan of paid monthly services either but the fact that cheating is mostly or entirely eliminated depending on the game makes the paid systems a necessary evil if only for their far better security.
Nah, they're very rare unless you're one of those dunning-krueger fools that use mere existance of cheaters as a convenient excuse for their own lack of skill.Hackers/cheaters have taken over and ruined MP gaming on PC.
Imagine being so far into your console Stockholm syndrome as to think that people who pay hundreds of dollars for a custom cheat are actually in any way hindered by a 10 bucks online fee.the paid systems a necessary evil if only for their far better security.
No way. That's on people and the companies, each responsible for what they've decided. I had a X360 and never payed gold, fuck them. People payed Sony because they wanted to, no one forced them to do it. It would be the same as every cellphone company raising prices to have the same margins as Apple and blaming Apple for it.It took Sony more than 7 years of watching MS getting away with this before giving in to the temptation.
They would have never even considered anything like it if the precedent hadn't been set and the practice normalized by Good Guys Microsoft.
I also see that nobody in the thread is calling out Nintendo. They charge for online multiplayer too now, remember? Why is nobody blaming Nintendo?
This.I am not paying to use my console (which I paid for) to play my games (which I paid for) on my internet service (which i pay for).
If idiots hadn't defended and supported this practice from the beginning, it would not have become this widespread.No way. That's on people and the companies, each responsible for what they've decided. I had a X360 and never payed gold, fuck them. People payed Sony because they wanted to, no one forced them to do it. It would be the same as every cellphone company raising prices to have the same margins as Apple and blaming Apple for it.
It just baffles me that people will be intellectually dishonest with human nature because they feel they need to defend corporations that sell them shit.Yeah. Indeed, we called it.
CHOCOLATE MILK!I legit read the title as "Xbox Live screaming at you 15 year olds" when my eyes glanced over it.
Sweet. Remember when they were making Live free according to all those MS “insiders,” only to double the price then back off due to backlash. Good times when consumers speak up.Remember when Sony was never going to charge because they were way too pro consumer and plus their users would never stand for it
I get Gold with GPU. Well worth the price.
Nah fuck it. Nobody forced Sony or their fans to do it either. Stop putting the blame on a single entity. Why didn't the sony fans boycott it? Uh? Was it peer pressure from the MS fans? What's the excuse here?If idiots hadn't defended and supported this practice from the beginning, it would not have become this widespread.
In fact, MS would have eventually stopped charging for online multiplayer.
This simple fact places most of the responsibility on people supporting the company that originally introduced it.
It does cost money to run. And it isn't free no matter what you think. It needs paying for. If that means you paying a sub or paying through game sales - you're paying.Somebody tell Gabe Newell that Steam users should be paying for the priviledge of playing online and all those nice messaging and sharing little hooks. After all, these things cost money, and operating income does not exist! Valve could go bankrupt any day now!
At least that's what some very insightful posters here are making me realize...
It is already being payed through game sales, you say?It does cost money to run. And it isn't free no matter what you think. It needs paying for. If that means you paying a sub or paying through game sales - you're paying.
People saying in a "just" world it would be free is just entitled bullshit.
I'm not putting it in a boxing ring with anything, nor Sony with Ms. You don’t make sense. And you clearly have no idea about the importance and dimension of K2 and 3 multiplayer in Playstation ecossistem. I played K2 multiplayer until k3 came out, and when i say played it, i mean every day as my only game and full time member of a competitive clan... have you ever been this involved in Killzone through the years? Where does your knowledge of its user base and loyal fanbase comes from? Your own experience with the game or ear say?Killzone might not exactly be the best example to put Sony together in a boxing ring with Microsoft; in fact it's so unpopular that there are no remasters and it never arrived on PC since there's no interest in this to begin with. It's like Sony even wants to forget about its failures.
I do remember that. I said all along that the absolute best they'd do is roll Gold into basic GamePass. Anyone expecting them to pass on so much easy money is crazy.Sweet. Remember when they were making Live free according to all those MS “insiders,” only to double the price then back off due to backlash. Good times when consumers speak up.
This argument is largely a false cause because the inability to cheat isn't a result of XBL or PS+, it's due to a closed hardware ecosystem. XBL didn't save COD: WaW or GTA V from hackers who modded their Xbox 360's.
Also every MP experience is different, and not only is cheating not exclusive to PC, the ability to do so is also becoming ever-more diminished, demonstrated by the fact that more and more games are now becoming cross-platform MP. Is it easier to cheat on PC? Sure, but just because a seven year-old game like GTA V can't get their lobbies under control, it does not mean COD Cold War is unplayable by extension.
Nah, they're very rare unless you're one of those dunning-krueger fools that use mere existance of cheaters as a convenient excuse for their own lack of skill.
Imagine being so far into your console Stockholm syndrome as to think that people who pay hundreds of dollars for a custom cheat are actually in any way hindered by a 10 bucks online fee.
You know what's actually a nuisance for them?
2-factor authentication.
Community tools. (votekicking, demo recording, overwatch)
You know, shit that is free, and is up to developers to implement if they see cheating as a serious issue.
The market has spoken. People are paying for it, so why should it be free? The corps would just be throwing money away.
Imagine being so far up your own ass you can't admit reality.
Firstly, I said a "closed hardware ecosystem". Secondly, unless you expect me to be a mind-reader, don't suggest that something might not have been clear, while saying it should have been obvious.And although I may not have been clear in my original post, my point should've been obvious that a closed ecosystem is largely responsible for increased security.
If this was true, PC gaming would most likely be on a decline. Yet, the data suggests otherwise.MP gaming on PC has been ruined in large part by cheaters.
"I'm not a fan of paid monthly services either but the fact that cheating is mostly or entirely eliminated depending on the game makes the paid systems a necessary evil if only for their far better security."it is most definitely not a "false cause" as you put it. I couldn't give two shits WHY there is less cheating bullshit on console.
Firstly, I said a "closed hardware ecosystem". Secondly, unless you expect me to be a mind-reader, don't suggest that something might not have been clear, while saying it should have been obvious.
If this was true, PC gaming would most likely be on a decline. Yet, the data suggests otherwise.
Since 2012, PC gaming sales have been growing at a faster rate than console at +3.1%. And according to Steam statistics, 21.4% new games were purchased, and 50.7% more hours were played YoY in 2020. If console were such a viable alternative, you can't reasonably conclude that PC gaming has been "ruined" by something.
"I'm not a fan of paid monthly services either but the fact that cheating is mostly or entirely eliminated depending on the game makes the paid systems a necessary evil if only for their far better security."
Your words, not mine. XBL and PS+ are not responsible for less cheating. Asking "why" is what establishes causation, rather than correlation.
They would have never even considered anything like it if the precedent hadn't been set and the practice normalized by Good Guys Microsoft.
So you're out, then.Anyone with the ability to be honest and impartially analyze a given scenario rather than letting an ideological stance influence their opinions on issues
datas are bitch for from the assclaims. Of course you will get ad hominem or other syllogism of the kind to an argument like this one.Firstly, I said a "closed hardware ecosystem". Secondly, unless you expect me to be a mind-reader, don't suggest that something might not have been clear, while saying it should have been obvious.
If this was true, PC gaming would most likely be on a decline. Yet, the data suggests otherwise.
Since 2012, PC gaming sales have been growing at a faster rate than console at +3.1%. And according to Steam statistics, 21.4% new games were purchased, and 50.7% more hours were played YoY in 2020. If console were such a viable alternative, you can't reasonably conclude that PC gaming has been "ruined" by something.
"I'm not a fan of paid monthly services either but the fact that cheating is mostly or entirely eliminated depending on the game makes the paid systems a necessary evil if only for their far better security."
Your words, not mine. XBL and PS+ are not responsible for less cheating. Asking "why" is what establishes causation, rather than correlation.
it's why the "it's fanboy fault of the other brand i pay online" is funny...those people should really look at mirror stand for their opinion and act accordly (stop paying for ps+ because it's what most people with that narrative do) or at least stop the victicmism that is their own weakness fault.Lol, in capitalism it's not about if it's fair or unfair for something to cost money, if there is a market and people are willing to pay then they will charge you (xbox live) now if they just don't see it viable to charge money then they will make it free and get their revenues through other ways (steam). Different business strategies.
Actually nothing is free, an online service costs money to mantain, Steam fuckin wish they could charge to play online, they just can't because everybody would migrate.
Sometimes it's too much fun, though.datas are bitch for from the assclaims. Of course you will get ad hominem or other syllogism of the kind to an argument like this one.
So you're out, then.
Nobody argues that it's not more common on PC. But pretending that it's some infestation of biblical proportions is asinine.I work in IT and I can assure you PC/server related hacks are more common than specific devices like a media player, or gaming console.
MAC and HWID bans are a thing on PC too, IT guy.Warzone is the big one, it's harder to hack on consoles as if you are caught they can ban your console.
Nobody argues that it's not more common on PC. But pretending that it's some infestation of biblical proportions is asinine.
I do play a bunch of competitive FPS on PC at fairly high skill brackets. I also do my due diligence to report any hacker I come across through appropriate channels, which includes recording video evidence on my end. Which allows me to tell you exactly how often I come across confirmed cheaters.
The most recent one I came across was this month, on the 3rd in Apex. "Wow, that's very recent, hackers are rampant on PC!"
The one before that? Warzone, June 13th, 2020.
Yep, totally rampant.
MAC and HWID bans are a thing on PC too, IT guy.
Throw phone bans on top of it for games that do 2-factor auth for matchmaking.
Getting rid of hackers isn't the problem. Detecting them is. On PC they build tools for that. On consoles nobody bothers.
Cuz they're hacker-free, amirite?
And then there are cretins that claim that a $10 montly fee stop these people.
In a F2P game.
That doesn't require that $10 fee to play.![]()
The cheating software is not hosted on the console unit itself, IT guy.Hacking on console happens on a OS level that is done by the user
But please do carry on firing off irrelevant internet traffic trivia.You have no clue what your talking about.
And it absolutely is.If it's a scam, then Nvidia selling you 1500 dollars GPU with a huge profit margin is even more of a scam...
The cheating software is not hosted on the console unit itself, IT guy.
You appear to know very little about this topic for saying such inflammatory words:
But please do carry on firing off irrelevant internet traffic trivia.
Riveting stuff.
Before you think of using the hypocrisy card.it's why the "it's fanboy fault of the other brand i pay online" is funny...those people should really look at mirror stand for their opinion and act accordly (stop paying for ps+ because it's what most people with that narrative do) or at least stop the victicmism that is their own weakness fault.
Others are dumb ? be better. don't play victim as an excuse to be as dumb...