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Nintendo has officially made more profits with Nintendo Switch(2017-2020) than Sony Gaming division with Playstation 4(2013-2020)

So many salty people here, those that list the amount of new IP's sony made, how many has reached to the levels of profit and mainstream success that is Nintendo?
They don't need to be as successful as Breath of the Wild to be considered successful.

If you have 30 million dollars and I have 10 million dollars, am I poor?
 

Kataploom

Gold Member
I don’t know for profits and sales etc bull...but there is no way to play games like Ghosts of Tsushima, Death Stranding, TLOU2 and the list goes on. Switch is something my Sister, Gf, mother or anyone can play. It’s accessible and the games are just fun and relaxing, I grew up with Nintendo games and have great memories. But I don’t see a reason to celebrate this.
Dude, I get stressed by playing Mario Kart... Any of them, let alone Smash... Fire Emblem makes me yell every ## of chapters whenever a unit dies, and what can I tell you abotut DK? So relaxing when watching at it but shit takes the worst out of me for 1 min sometimes... Don't believe what you just said :(
 

Heisenberg007

Gold Journalism
Would you really want that though outside of maybe a separate mobile gaming device?:
  1. Underpowered hardware which is overpriced for what it offers technologically
  2. Games which never go on sale or push the boundaries of what technology offers
  3. Constant remakes/ports of beloved classics
  4. Less third-party support
Say what you what want about PS5 (or Series X) but you're getting cutting-edge tech sold to you at loss.

Nintendo's doing its thing which is working for it and you have the option of buying into it if you want. But do you really want the whole gaming industry going down that route?

Not at all. That's why I mentioned that none of these options are the ones I'd prefer.

But it'd be nice to talk about what options Sony -- as a company -- could explore to increase their profits and what other people on this forum think they could do (not that they should do).
 
Nintendo stood still with their business policy of first party titles are everything and sold most of them at the full price while Sony and Microsoft were selling their 1st party games at much lower price point right after the launch of those games.
 

Same ol G

Member
Nintendo is not a competitor to Sony, despite how weird that sounds. They don’t overlap anywhere in terms of demographics and game design. Switch’s main forte is portability just like with many previous Nintendo handhelds that solidified that image. That’s why Vita never took off, that space and mind share is firmly in Nintendo’s hands.

Nintendo is in its own category. They recycle same franchises for thirty years that have widespread recognition but don’t push this medium forward in terms of audiovisual and gameplay mechanics system. They’re closer to Lego than to Sony Interactive Entertainment or Xbox game division.

But if you’re Sony, it can be demoralizing (IDK how could it be not) to see someone with so little effort, minimal workforce and just lazy work outsell you so much when you poured heart and soul working 12 hours a day for years to create something like Uncharted 4, Spiderman, GoW or TLOU 2.
Dude you sound really salty.
 

Eanox

Member
Not at all. That's why I mentioned that none of these options are the ones I'd prefer.

But it'd be nice to talk about what options Sony -- as a company -- could explore to increase their profits and what other people on this forum think they could do (not that they should do).
They don’t need to do anything or react to Nintendo.

one word / revenue

Revenue = PSplus, 3rd party sales, 1st party sales, hardware, accessories and etc.

Profit isn’t everything. Revenue is as important as profit. Without revenue you don’t have profits.
This is a company we are talking about and not just a small time business where profit is everything. They see revenue 1st because that will pay your operations.

Higher revenue with large profit= to healthy company.

Sony as company will be willing to spend money to gain more revenue for long term gains.
You can see it on their 1st party games. They are willing to spend, market, reduce the price, bundle it so they can have more sales in the future.

PS devs is also expanding. They are hiring and also rumored in creating a new dev team.
We might see acquisitions as well. Bluepoint, housemarque, or even other publishers.
They also spend in exclusive deals which is not cheap as well.

This will affect their bottomline which is profit.
Just like someone already point out this not a zero sum game.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
They don’t need to do anything or react to Nintendo.

one word / revenue

Revenue = PSplus, 3rd party sales, 1st party sales, hardware, accessories and etc.

Profit isn’t everything. Revenue is as important as profit. Without revenue you don’t have profits.
This is a company we are talking about and not just a small time business where profit is everything. They see revenue 1st because that will pay your operations.

Higher revenue with large profit= to healthy company.

Sony as company will be willing to spend money to gain more revenue for long term gains.
You can see it on their 1st party games. They are willing to spend, market, reduce the price, bundle it so they can have more sales in the future.

PS devs is also expanding. They are hiring and also rumored in creating a new dev team.
We might see acquisitions as well. Bluepoint, housemarque, or even other publishers.
They also spend in exclusive deals which is not cheap as well.

This will affect their bottomline which is profit.
Just like someone already point out this not a zero sum game.
It'd actually the opposite. Bigger margins keep the company afloat and high margins companies will always skew to higher market caps.

All that humongous Sony revenue and fanbase got beat by Nintendo's profits despite having a smaller user base, less microtrans and sub fees and much less third party digital royalty cuts. And PS4 had double the length of time vs. Switch.

These are trailing 12 months data so a little outdated as some of them reported data lately, but close enough. From Yahoo Finance.

- MS Corporation = about $153 billion US sales = $51 billion sales = 33% margin = $1.8 trillion market cap
- Sony Corporation = about $82 billion US sales = $9 billion profits = 11% margin = $122 billion market cap
- Nintendo Corporation = about $16 billion US sales = $4 billion profits = 25% margin = $75 billion market cap

MS has less than double the sales of Sony, but with triple the margin has a market cap about 14x Sony.
Sony has 5x the sales of Nintendo, but with much less margin is less than double Nintendo.

Here's a good one to show how important profits are. Adobe.

- Adobe Corporation = about $13 billion US sales = $5 billion profits = 38% margin = $224 billion market cap

Adobe is worth more than Sony and Nintendo combined with only $13 billion sales.
 
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b6a6es

Banned
Zelda BOTW gameplay system alone is more complex than all of those Sony games combined.
Having complex mechanics ≠ Great gameplay

Death Stranding (a Sony game) had the most complex gameplay structure ive ever seen in a video game in the last 22 years (way more than BOTW) yet it was so bad (and barely broke even financially) simply because it wasn’t fun or entertaining as BOTW, Mario Odyssey or most Highly acclaimed Sony games (GoW4-U4-GoT-TLOU2)
 
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It'd actually the opposite. Bigger margins keep the company afloat and high margins companies will always skew to higher market caps.

All that humongous Sony revenue and fanbase got beat by Nintendo's profits despite having a smaller user base, less microtrans and sub fees and much less third party digital royalty cuts. And PS4 had double the length of time vs. Switch.

These are trailing 12 months data so a little outdated as some of them reported data lately, but close enough. From Yahoo Finance.

- MS Corporation = about $153 billion US sales = $51 billion sales = 33% margin = $1.8 trillion market cap
- Sony Corporation = about $82 billion US sales = $9 billion profits = 11% margin = $122 billion market cap
- Nintendo Corporation = about $16 billion US sales = $4 billion profits = 25% margin = $75 billion market cap

MS has less than double the sales of Sony, but with triple the margin has a market cap about 14x Sony.
Sony has 5x the sales of Nintendo, but with much less margin is less than double Nintendo.

Here's a good one to show how important profits are. Adobe.

- Adobe Corporation = about $13 billion US sales = $5 billion profits = 38% margin = $224 billion market cap

Adobe is worth more than Sony and Nintendo combined with only $13 billion sales.

It's not really that simple though.
Sony has a much more diversified revenue pool. If people suddenly up and stop playing video games for whatever reason, Nintendo will suffer massively. Perhaps their merchandise will keep them afloat, but it will be a major hit to them. Microsoft won't bat an eyelid over the death of Xbox. Sony will be very sad losing a large chunk of their profit source in PlayStation, but it certainly won't be the be the end of them. Kaz Hirai's greatest achievement was recentering the company around his key pillars, which of course included gaming, but it also included a number of other business units which were turned around from loss making to profitable.

Nintendo have struck a gold mine here with the switch, absolutely. A gold mine that has proven just as rich as the Wii was a little over a decade ago - perhaps even moreso. The switch as a concept is just much better than the Wii and Wii U ever were. And that's great for them and us. But let's not pretend that Nintendo being highly profitable will make them bigger than Sony as a whole.

Bigger than Xbox? Pretty much for certain. Bigger than PlayStation? Debatable. They're more profitable for sure. But PlayStation has a much larger and wider revenue pool for now (we'll see how the PS5 develops).

If Nintendo's revenues and profits start to eclipse Sony's, then the story is different of course.
 

Sony4theWin

Neo Member
While Nintendo's evergreen titles are selling at near full price even since 2017, Sony's 1st party games run out of steam quickly thus requiring massive bargain bin discounts less than a year since their release to maintain sales legs. Spider-Man for PS4 became free in a bundle less than 2 months after its release and it is one of Sony's biggest system seller AAA exclusives, while God of War dropped down to bargain bin sales less than a year after its release. Destruction All-Stars went from $70 to being a throwaway PS+ title. Knack has been exceptionally controversial. Miles Morales, essentially a DLC Expansion pack sold at a near full price of a game, didn't seem to gain much attention compared to the PS4 version. This all shows the massive difference in value between Nintendo and Sony's 1st party titles, which is why Nintendo is gaining such delectable profits compared to Sony.

Congratulations Nintendo on such excellent profits. Nintendo will continue to leverage their releases effectively to maximize Nintendo Switch sales and expand the Switch's lifespan. 2021 could be even more profitable than 2020.
 

MrA

Banned
While Nintendo's evergreen titles are selling at near full price even since 2017, Sony's 1st party games run out of steam quickly thus requiring massive bargain bin discounts less than a year since their release to maintain sales legs. Spider-Man for PS4 became free in a bundle less than 2 months after its release and it is one of Sony's biggest system seller AAA exclusives, while God of War dropped down to bargain bin sales less than a year after its release. Destruction All-Stars went from $70 to being a throwaway PS+ title. Knack has been exceptionally controversial. Miles Morales, essentially a DLC Expansion pack sold at a near full price of a game, didn't seem to gain much attention compared to the PS4 version. This all shows the massive difference in value between Nintendo and Sony's 1st party titles, which is why Nintendo is gaining such delectable profits compared to Sony.

Congratulations Nintendo on such excellent profits. Nintendo will continue to leverage their releases effectively to maximize Nintendo Switch sales and expand the Switch's lifespan. 2021 could be even more profitable than 2020.
ghost of tsushima seems to be holding value pretty well, though it seems to be something special in the playstation's library, plus sucker punch is clearly delivering way more than they needed to with that game,
 

KungFucius

King Snowflake
Shure, porting 5 years old WiiU games on a brand new hardware with no BC to sell them 60€ is not costing. Still, it works!
This is just inane. WiiU sold about 20% what the Switch has sold so far. Why wouldn't they port some of those games? And to suggest that this is all they have done is silly fanboy denialism. They sell cheaper hardware at relatively high margins and develop games that are not even at the level of PS4 games technically. They do that successfully and make money because people genuinely enjoy their games. You are right that they do everything cheaper but to claim that is is just WiiU ports is taking it too far.

Nintendo has been doing cheaper gaming since the Wii. It worked for that system, eventually worked for the 3DS, and now works for the Swtich. It's good business and they show that a lot of people, maybe skewing towards parents, like the type of games they can get on the Switch regardless of the fact that they are technically limited. They really have shown that they don't need to compete on specs to make money. I am not sure why people are expecting a 4K Switch Pro, I am not even sure the Switch 2 will be 4K. For me it just needs to be a system than can play the next Mario and Zelda games that the kids can fight over. 1080 60FPS with upscaling will be fine.
 

Bodomism

Banned
1612164468995.png
Insanity
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
This is just inane. WiiU sold about 20% what the Switch has sold so far. Why wouldn't they port some of those games? And to suggest that this is all they have done is silly fanboy denialism. They sell cheaper hardware at relatively high margins and develop games that are not even at the level of PS4 games technically. They do that successfully and make money because people genuinely enjoy their games. You are right that they do everything cheaper but to claim that is is just WiiU ports is taking it too far.

Nintendo has been doing cheaper gaming since the Wii. It worked for that system, eventually worked for the 3DS, and now works for the Swtich. It's good business and they show that a lot of people, maybe skewing towards parents, like the type of games they can get on the Switch regardless of the fact that they are technically limited. They really have shown that they don't need to compete on specs to make money. I am not sure why people are expecting a 4K Switch Pro, I am not even sure the Switch 2 will be 4K. For me it just needs to be a system than can play the next Mario and Zelda games that the kids can fight over. 1080 60FPS with upscaling will be fine.
Well said.

This is a game board so people will skew heavy to the latest and greatest. Go to a car buff forum and people will chat the latest gear. A sports forum and they'll talk the latest trades, Sabermetrics, and contracts. These people know the industry more and are willing to pay more for better gear, better tickets and better cars.

The average person who just wants a game system, baseball tix, and a car will skew to something affordable, not the latest tech, and they don't care about talking about their Nissan Sentra on a racing forum.

I've never had a receiver before as I just hooked everything up into my home theatre hub which has limited numbers of ports and is old and doesn't even do 4k or the latest Dolby shit. If I get one (I think about it now and then), the cheapest ones go for $200, they move on up to about $600, then you get into "home theatre class" receivers which cost $1,000s.

All I want is is one that has lots of ports, 4k, some recent Dolby support and that's good enough. Could probably get that out of a $300 model. If someone is an expert A/V guru they'll probably skew to $600 or those $1,000+ models.
 

Bryank75

Banned
Both are doing well.

I think PlayStation need to just stop this pursuit of cloud gaming.... cloud gaming is a failure and nobody wants it over a console. Big waste of money.

I'm not going to look forward to saying to my son 'I paid your streaming bill for the year' instead of watching him open a new console and see his eyes go wide with joy....

Streaming is such a dull way to game and only really benefits the corporations.

Also PS is just one division.... just the last year and a half of Sony is more than Nintendos 3 years.
 
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Both are doing well.

I think PlayStation need to just stop this pursuit of cloud gaming.... cloud gaming is a failure and nobody wants it over a console. Big waste of money.

I'm not going to look forward to saying to my son 'I paid your streaming bill for the year' instead of watching him open a new console and see his eyes go wide with joy....

Streaming is such a dull way to game and only really benefits the corporations.

Also PS is just one division.... just the last year and a half of Sony is more than Nintendos 3 years.

I agree with you, but I think streaming is inevitable in the end. ☹️
 

phil_t98

#SonyToo
funny thing I see is that Nintendo recycled games from the Wii U but one thing for sure is Nintendo make games that appeal to a wider audience than Sony or Microsoft with the number that Nintendo sell
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
funny thing I see is that Nintendo recycled games from the Wii U but one thing for sure is Nintendo make games that appeal to a wider audience than Sony or Microsoft with the number that Nintendo sell
Totally. And at full price too most of the time.

It goes to show the gaming nerd forums we're on mean little. Some of the games people talk about being so beloved on forums like Bloodborne and cute RPG Ni No Kuri sold crap.

It's like what I said above about the common person. You can have people talking sports cars and which model has the highest HP. Yet the most popular vehicles are Civics, Accords and F-150s which nobody talks about on the car forum.

Even if you exclude the big name games which people don't talk about anymore on forums because they are so so samey every year (COD and FIFA), some hugely popular games you don't see talked about..... F2P Genshin Impact (I think thats what it's called), Switch first party games that all seem to sell 10M+ games, etc.... get nobody talking.

They're playing, but not going on forums talking.
 
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Alebrije

Member
Since Nintendo never sell at loss their hardware not shoked about this news.

They moved a lot of consoles and games those years ...deserved. A Nintendo in good shape is always good for the industry.
 
Animal Crossing sure did a lot to gain those Profits in the last year and sadly...thanks to COVID.

Still, very impressive for both to make that much money.

Hudo Hudo Wish I could give you the LOL and Muscle Reactions as it's funny you say that but so true.
 
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BootsLoader

Banned
Dude, I get stressed by playing Mario Kart... Any of them, let alone Smash... Fire Emblem makes me yell every ## of chapters whenever a unit dies, and what can I tell you abotut DK? So relaxing when watching at it but shit takes the worst out of me for 1 min sometimes... Don't believe what you just said :(
Ok boomer 👌
 
Switch is a monster.

But when looking at big tech...Oof. Likes like MS, Amazon, Apple make more profits per quarter.
 
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The_Mike

I cry about SonyGaf from my chair in Redmond, WA
Isn't it odd that a porting machine with lower hardware specs, sold at an inflated price is more lucrative?

Genius move Nintendo, after the "timed availability Mario ports", you have proven that your user base will eat shit from you and be happy about it.

It's fun how people point fingers at others while forgetting three fingers points against them.

I'm pretty sure Nintendo doesn't have the most hardcore loyal fanbase.

To be honest, I rarely hear Nintendo players brags or talk shit about anything compared to people on other platforms.
 

Banjo64

cumsessed
These are very "Nintendo" games /s
91XE-EMDJaL._SL1500_.jpg
910eMi3mDKL._AC_SY500_.jpg
Off topic, but Rise has become easily my most anticipated game of the year. I feel sorry for the fanboys in this thread who won’t get to experience it.

Square Enix and Atlus are beloved devs, especially in respect of PS, but there’s people posting in here who’ve never heard of Octopath Traveller or Shin Megami Tensei. Strange state of affairs.
 

devilNprada

Member
It goes to show the gaming nerd forums we're on mean little. Some of the games people talk about being so beloved on forums like Bloodborne and cute RPG Ni No Kuri sold crap.

It keeps being put out there on polls and such, that the majority gamers and average ages are adults.

I really think it's BS, not sure where they get there info or who they are polling.. But i am pretty sure kids (or parents purchasing for kids) is and always has been the largest primary market.
 
They don’t need to do anything or react to Nintendo.

one word / revenue

Revenue = PSplus, 3rd party sales, 1st party sales, hardware, accessories and etc.

Profit isn’t everything. Revenue is as important as profit. Without revenue you don’t have profits.
This is a company we are talking about and not just a small time business where profit is everything. They see revenue 1st because that will pay your operations.

Higher revenue with large profit= to healthy company.

Sony as company will be willing to spend money to gain more revenue for long term gains.
You can see it on their 1st party games. They are willing to spend, market, reduce the price, bundle it so they can have more sales in the future.

PS devs is also expanding. They are hiring and also rumored in creating a new dev team.
We might see acquisitions as well. Bluepoint, housemarque, or even other publishers.
They also spend in exclusive deals which is not cheap as well.

This will affect their bottomline which is profit.
Just like someone already point out this not a zero sum game.
Revenue - costs = profit.

Lower costs mean higher profit, diminishing returns with higher costs, yada yada
 

Eanox

Member
It'd actually the opposite. Bigger margins keep the company afloat and high margins companies will always skew to higher market caps.

All that humongous Sony revenue and fanbase got beat by Nintendo's profits despite having a smaller user base, less microtrans and sub fees and much less third party digital royalty cuts. And PS4 had double the length of time vs. Switch.

These are trailing 12 months data so a little outdated as some of them reported data lately, but close enough. From Yahoo Finance.

- MS Corporation = about $153 billion US sales = $51 billion sales = 33% margin = $1.8 trillion market cap
- Sony Corporation = about $82 billion US sales = $9 billion profits = 11% margin = $122 billion market cap
- Nintendo Corporation = about $16 billion US sales = $4 billion profits = 25% margin = $75 billion market cap

MS has less than double the sales of Sony, but with triple the margin has a market cap about 14x Sony.
Sony has 5x the sales of Nintendo, but with much less margin is less than double Nintendo.

Here's a good one to show how important profits are. Adobe.

- Adobe Corporation = about $13 billion US sales = $5 billion profits = 38% margin = $224 billion market cap

Adobe is worth more than Sony and Nintendo combined with only $13 billion sales.
I never said that profit is not important. I said profit isn’t everything.
They need revenue/sales to gain profit. Yes, having a high revenue doesn’t mean anything if you are always losing money.
If you are selling and still gaining a profit considering all the expenses you have.
I see that as a healthy company that has a lot of room for growth that will be potentially increase their market cap and their profits


It’s not black and white.
We don’t know the specific expenses for both and that will not show in their reports.
We can only assume and guess on what are those.
Sony is a multi-media company that has a lot of sectors and those have high operating cost. Some doesn’t make any profit.

Same goes for SIE not all there games turn into profit.

This is the first time Sony will have profits entering new generation. This is because of the PS4. If they will have the same monstrous revenue for PS5. Expect Sony’s profit to be better than PS4.

Revenue dictates your growth not profits. The more items you sell the more profits you will gain in the future.
Business model of Sony is very different from the business model of Nintendo.
Nintendo maximize their profit thru their software.
Sony is willing to cut their price to have more sales for long term gains.
It’s not a zero sum game both are successful.
 
I never said that profit is not important. I said profit isn’t everything.
They need revenue/sales to gain profit. Yes, having a high revenue doesn’t mean anything if you are always losing money.
If you are selling and still gaining a profit considering all the expenses you have.
I see that as a healthy company that has a lot of room for growth that will be potentially increase their market cap and their profits


It’s not black and white.
We don’t know the specific expenses for both and that will not show in their reports.
We can only assume and guess on what are those.
Sony is a multi-media company that has a lot of sectors and those have high operating cost. Some doesn’t make any profit.

Same goes for SIE not all there games turn into profit.

This is the first time Sony will have profits entering new generation. This is because of the PS4. If they will have the same monstrous revenue for PS5. Expect Sony’s profit to be better than PS4.

Revenue dictates your growth not profits. The more items you sell the more profits you will gain in the future.
Business model of Sony is very different from the business model of Nintendo.
Nintendo maximize their profit thru their software.
Sony is willing to cut their price to have more sales for long term gains.
It’s not a zero sum game both are successful.
Profit is the most important aspect in any business goals.
 
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