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[Moses85]

I saw the RT Effects... so

 

[Kagey K]

I saw the RT Effects... so

That’s RDNA 3 in effect, it’s so advanced, you don’t even notice it’s missing.*

*Unless you have eyes.

 

[Yoboman]

I have asked both authors what's happening and the one that claims there's no raytracing posted the original English transcript of the interview

The original tweet is here

Shame he didn't provide the question asked as well. At a guess I think Gavin is answering why it doesn't have rt in Performance mode? Which is why he goes on to discuss the two modes. Which might help it align better with the other interviews

That or just pure mistranslation issues. I dont understand why he is using an AI translator, did he take the notes in English? If so why does he need an AI translation into Spanish?

 

[Concern]

What a mess, it doesn't feature something most people don't notice to the point they're arguing whether or not it's present.

Yea now it doesn't matter. It did when the narrative was that XSX had no rt. At least be consistent.

 

[Explosive Zombie]

Yea now it doesn't matter. It did when the narrative was that XSX had no rt. At least be consistent.

Who me? Are you going to find posts by my criticizing XSX for missing RTX in their games?

 

[Knitted Knight]

Shame he didn't provide the question asked as well. At a guess I think Gavin is answering why it doesn't have rt in Performance mode? Which is why he goes on to discuss the two modes. Which might help it align better with the other interviews

That or just pure mistranslation issues. I dont understand why he is using an AI translator, did he take the notes in English? If so why does he need an AI translation into Spanish?

Exactly. It just needs a clarification by BluePoint. Simple tweet would do.

 

[Concern]

Who me? Are you going to find posts by my criticizing XSX for missing RTX in their games?

If you want to put yourself in that group, yes. Otherwise don't pretend like that hasn't been the "concern" in the spec thread.

 

[Explosive Zombie]

If you want to put yourself in that group, yes. Otherwise don't pretend like that hasn't been the "concern" in the spec thread.

I'm not sure I'm the representative of a thread I barely post in. Are you saying you're only calling this generation a mess as a reaction to people who attacked XSX for lack of RTX? Because my response to you was based on the idea next-gen is a mess due to lack of RTX, which was in general from what I could tell in your post but you somehow turned it into me being a hypocrite because... I represent a group of posters in a thread I don't really post in much? Like legit, check my post history, I mean... I did tonight but it was just a stupid drunk post.

 

[Bojanglez]

I don't understand what the problem is. The game either looks good or it doesn't, either way that is also a personal opinion.

RT use can be an artistic choice, particularly where lighting is concerned. Also RT is not always just reflections. I have no idea if this game has it or not, either way to me it looks great so

 

[Concern]

I'm not sure I'm the representative of a thread I barely post in. Are you saying you're only calling this generation a mess as a reaction to people who attacked XSX for lack of RTX? Because my response to you was based on the idea next-gen is a mess due to lack of RTX, which was in general from what I could tell in your post but you somehow turned it into me being a hypocrite because... I represent a group of posters in a thread I don't really post in much? Like legit, check my post history, I mean... I did tonight but it was just a stupid drunk post.

Its a mess in general. Weak lineups. Biggest game is a remake. 4k/60fps, no 4k/60fps, upscaled 4k/60fps, rt, no rt, etc etc.

You took exception to the rt comment, not the mess part.

 

[Ryu Kaiba]

What a mess, it doesn't feature something most people don't notice to the point they're arguing whether or not it's present.

This all day. Such an overrated feature.

 

[Explosive Zombie]

Its a mess in general. Weak lineups. Biggest game is a remake. 4k/60fps, no 4k/60fps, upscaled 4k/60fps, rt, no rt, etc etc.

You took exception to the rt comment, not the mess part.

I made fun of you calling things a mess because of a feature being missing that people are still debating whether or not it's actually missing. The feature is so meaningless people can't even figure out if it's there or not.

 

[BaneIsPain]

If it looks this good without RT, I can't wait for the future.
To the PS5 Prooo

 

[Concern]

I made fun of you calling things a mess because of a feature being missing that people are still debating whether or not it's actually missing. The feature is so meaningless people can't even figure out if it's there or not.

First it wasn't the rt comment, now it was. Be consistent with whatever point you're trying to make next time. Clearly you can't make up your mind with what bothered you more. Have a goodnight.

 

[bender]

 

[Explosive Zombie]

First it wasn't the rt comment, now it was. Be consistent with whatever point you're trying to make next time. Clearly you can't make up your mind with what bothered you more. Have a goodnight.

I am consistent, you're not. You also didn't understand my posts if you think I've shifted my point in any way that matters.

 

[DinoD]

No puddles, no money. Pre-order cancelled!

 

[draliko]

The funny thing is watching how you guys try desperately to spin the news as it's a positive thing, for fucks sake you really love your plastic boxes...

 

[Explosive Zombie]

The funny thing is watching how you guys try desperately to spin the news as it's a positive thing, for fucks sake you really love your plastic boxes...

Who made it positive?

 

[draliko]

Who made it positive?

Read the first replyes, in the beginning all the kids were happy because ds was showing how rt should be made, now they simply say it's a waste of resources

 

[Explosive Zombie]

Read the first replyes, in the beginning all the kids were happy because ds was showing how rt should be made, now they simply say it's a waste of resources

This thread feels like flypaper for people to complain about over-arching narratives over the course of this forum's existence that have slighted them somehow.

 

[Jibran#one]

Ray tracing in my humble opinion is the most overrated bs in the history of graphical upgrades, the performance drop-off for what u get on screen is really not worth it , I would love to see ps5 and xbox series stay away from it and give us some juicy 60 fps instead of it

 

[bender]

Blue Point just shot themselves in the foot.
I don't know how much the rest of you know about Ray Tracing culture (I'm an expert), but lighting and shadows are huge parts of it. It's not like it is in RDNA1 where you can become successful by using pre-baked lighting model....

 

[ruvikx]

Ray tracing in my humble opinion is the most overrated bs in the history of graphical upgrades, the performance drop-off for what u get on screen is really not worth it , I would love to see ps5 and xbox series stay away from it and give us some juicy 60 fps instead of it

It's the new nvidia hairworks.

I get the push for photorealism probably requires some ray tracing at some point, but there's a whole load of other areas which can & should be improved before we reach that point. For example it's a bit jarring to see low poly npc's & geometry in video games whilst people scream "look at those beautiful ray traced reflections in those puddles!" whilst the framerate tanks.

Use the power elsewhere & not on marketing gimmicks.

 

[bender]

It's the new nvidia hairworks.

 

[farmerboy]

This game will look soooo good on an inky black oled

 

[DavidGzz]

If someone told me it had full RT I wouldn't know any better lol. Still the best thing I've ever seen. If it does come to PC in a few years, I'll pick it up again. No biggie.

This game will look soooo good on an inky black oled

I'm going to rewatch the second trailer when my CX arrives on Tuesday. Hnnnnng

 

[onesvenus]

Shame he didn't provide the question asked as well. At a guess I think Gavin is answering why it doesn't have rt in Performance mode? Which is why he goes on to discuss the two modes. Which might help it align better with the other interviews

That or just pure mistranslation issues. I dont understand why he is using an AI translator, did he take the notes in English? If so why does he need an AI translation into Spanish?

He was not using an AI translator, he was using a speech to text AI and from there he translated into Spanish

 

[Kumomeme]

probably still could come later by patch, or goty edition.

eitherway the game already look great without raytracing. nothing to worry.

it was a decision they made since it was something that was outside their initial ideal of the project. Also, there is a certain cost to implement it and they preferred to prioritize other elements.

When we started development we didn't know there would be ray tracing in the game, so it wasn't in our original vision.

“It's like any other graphical improvement, there is a cost [to implement raytracing]. If we had implemented ray tracing in the game, that would mean that we would have had to leave something out. There is a limited time in game development.

Perhaps from the sounds of it the features never been implemented in their engine since beginning because not part of their inital plan. Adding later in late of development would affect their scheduled progress timeline.

 

[farmerboy]

If someone told me it had full RT I wouldn't know any better lol. Still the best thing I've ever seen. If it does come to PC in a few years, I'll pick it up again. No biggie.



I'm going to rewatch the second trailer when my CX arrives on Tuesday. Hnnnnng

Please do tell, I'm on the fence between a x900h or LGCX because there is a $2000 difference between the two at 65in here in Oz. I need that extra push to commit the extra money.

 

[Neko Mimi Mode]

I think it looks fantastic and isn't missing anything by not having RT.

Similarly, I think the RT looks significant enough to accept the performance hit on Watch Dogs on XsX.

It's definitely a game-by-game feature for me, but I don't think Demon's Souls needs it to look great at all.

 

[Lethal01]

Read the first replyes, in the beginning all the kids were happy because ds was showing how rt should be made, now they simply say it's a waste of resources

Nah, there were always tons of people saying raytracing is a waste, They are wrong, but at least it's consistent.

 

[Hawking Radiation]

I Don't want native 4K.
If you want native 4K, build a PC.

I Dont want Ray tracing.
If you want Ray tracing, build a PC.

I Don't want 60FPS.
If you want 60FPS, build a fucking PC.

All are huge resource hogs and if all are prioritized, you wont see much in the way of graphical leaps expected from these new consoles.

I have always said, give me upscaled 4K, rock solid 30fps and go to town on the graphics. PS5, Series X/S will never be native 4K machines on next gen exclusive titles so enjoy your first year 4K titles. These cross gen games are small fry. Those resolutions will take a nose dive off a cliff once the 2nd or 3rd wave of next gen titles hit.

 

[GymWolf]

Who gives a fuck?? People was already slapping their dicks when they saw the reflections in the helmet in that famous screenshot, reflections are good enough even without rtx and they saved resources to upgrade other aspects, praise the fake reflecting sun.

 

[Soodanim]

RT has become this abstract concept, exclusively tied to good lighting. Does that mean games can’t have good lighting without it? Fuck no. UE5 demo is one example, and if Demon’s Souls doesn’t have RT then it’s another example.

Judging visuals by existence of RT alone is like judging the gameplay by the programming language used.

What I’m saying, in case anyone missed it, is that it doesn’t matter.

 

[GymWolf]

I mean, it's "not necessary" If you are fine with the game look far worse in comparison.

Lol nah, for a lot of people stuff like rdr2 or tlou2 looks better than control or metro with rtx, it's not a written law that if you don:t have rtx you can't look as good as games with rtx, that's only a pc master race narrative, lights\shadows\reflection are not on the top of the list for every gamer when it comes to graphic.


For every ray of light rendered by control there is a shitty animation or polygonal model or face to counter that.

 

[onesvenus]

Please do tell, I'm on the fence between a x900h or LGCX because there is a $2000 difference between the two at 65in here in Oz. I need that extra push to commit the extra money.

It's amazing. The x900h is also a good buy but oled blacks are amazing.

 

[makaveli60]

Isn't it ridiculous that something like the performance killer almighty raytracing is so indistinguishable from faked cost effective solutions that you have debates like this?

 

[Lethal01]

Lol nah, for a lot of people stuff like rdr2 or tlou2 looks better than control or metro with rtx, it's not a written law that if you don:t have rtx you can't look as good as games with rtx, that's only a pc master race narrative, lights\shadows\reflection are not on the top of the list for every gamer when it comes to graphic.


For every ray of light rendered by control there is a shitty animation or polygonal model or face to counter that.

Nah, for a realistic game turning on raytracing will always make it look better unless you fuck up really hard.

Obviously I can't compared different games.

 

[Calverz]

Tbh i thought it had RT in the first trailer. There is a bit where he runs towards a guy near a flame and there is a puddle on the ground that looks ray traced.

 

[Explosive Zombie]

I Don't want native 4K.
If you want native 4K, build a PC.

I Dont want Ray tracing.
If you want Ray tracing, build a PC.

I Don't want 60FPS.
If you want 60FPS, build a fucking PC.

All are huge resource hogs and if all are prioritized, you wont see much in the way of graphical leaps expected from these new consoles.

I have always said, give me upscaled 4K, rock solid 30fps and go to town on the graphics. PS5, Series X/S will never be native 4K machines on next gen exclusive titles so enjoy your first year 4K titles. These cross gen games are small fry. Those resolutions will take a nose dive off a cliff once the 2nd or 3rd wave of next gen titles hit.

"I don't want games.
If you want games, build a PC."

 

[GymWolf]

Nah, for a realistic game turning on raytracing will always make it look better unless you fuck up really hard.

Obviously I can't compared different games.

I mean, yeah if you add rtx to tlou2 or rdr2 they will look better.

But simulating real life is not only a matter of lights and shadows, people in real life have "great animations" too, real people move more like the characters in tlou2 or rdr2 compared to how people move in metro or control, since when lights and shadows are more important than how characters move and react to simulate real life graphics??

Do you think that in real life you will notice first some incorrect shadows and lights before noticing people moving like fucking robots?! I don't think so.

This is why the brain of many people is more tricked by good animations and details compared to good lights and shadows.

Sorry for the child level of english while explaining my thoughts

 

[Yoboman]

Not sure why people are acting like Ray tracing isn't important in here

Its a great graphical feature and I hope it has it

Of course you can still have great lighting without it, but its even better with ray tracing

 

[Lethal01]

Do you think that in real life you will notice first some incorrect shadows and lights before noticing people moving like fucking robots?! I don't think so.

Yes, anyone who suddenly lived in a world with the lighting of Red Dear Redemption 2 would notice that they aren't in the real world far faster than they would if people were walking strangely.

Lighting/rendering is what make things look like real life. Light is the most important aspect of seeing by default.

 

[sircaw]

i must admit looking at how gorgeous the game is and i can not tell if half the shit is ray traced or not, is ray racing overrated or something.

 

[Elias]

So the devs lied basically, ouch.

 

[GymWolf]

Yes, anyone who suddenly lived in a world with the lighting of Red Dear Redemption 2 would notice that they aren't in the real world far faster than they would if people were walking strangely.

Lighting/rendering is what make things look like real life. Light is the most important aspect of seeing by default.

Not for everyone i guess, until we have completely raytraced games without any form of rasterization, a lot of games need specific places and scene to notice rtx, animations and details are literally all around you every moment you turn the camera and every time you move the characters, for me are far more noticeable than a puddle who badly reflect my chara or an incorrect shadow on a wall.

 

[Thirty7ven]

*fishing*

 

[RoadHazard]

I really don't care about that bullet point being there or not. Does ray tracing make the game look noticeably better (like in Spider-Man with all those reflective buildings)? Then you should probably devote resources to it. If it doesn't, you should probably save those resources for other things that will make the game look noticeably better. Even with RT hardware, RT isn't free, it takes up a significant amount of compute resources.

 

[Endless Fluff]

By the two quotes in OP and what has been said before I get the feeling that the creative director doesn’t know what ray tracing is.

When the game was revealed it was “we have ray traced shadows” now its “we have light in real-time thanks to ray tracing” and then “we have no ray tracing”.

what a mess.