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[FunkMiller]

More Cherno:

Is this a MOBILE game?? - Dirt 5 on Xbox Series X // Game Engine Developer Reacts

 

[LiquidRex]

So with regards the PS5 this is what we don't know...

1. UI (how it looks & what are the features, e.g Suspend & Resume?)
2. 16GB GDDR6 (How much is available for Devs)
3. Is there additional RAM other than GDDR6
4. Is there an Infinity Cache to compensate for the RAM bandwidth
5. RDNA 2 (what features are present, ML, VRS?)
6. what additional RDNA features are present if any... e.g features that may appear in RDNA 3... etc.

Feel free to correct and add anything I've missed.

 

[Setsuna Mudou]

Damn, he even took some shots at the infamous Halo Infinite video from DF: "I watched that video, I disagreed with about half of it because some of the stuff they explained doesn't technically make any sense and it's just not really correct in some places".
But he said what everyone has been saying, it's not a good representation of the XSX. He even wondered if he was being trolled by PS fans and they sent him some bad footage just to make him hate on Xbox, but yeah, his reaction is pretty much what has been said by everyone.

Not to throw anyone under the bus, but I couldn't believe when these videos came out we had a few users in this thread were writing comments as if we were seeing something impressive.

I thought I was in bizarro world for a while

edit: and he even didn't mention the screen tearing, that for me was the most jarring thing... absolutely horrible

 

[cudiye]

So with regards the PS5 this is what we don't know...

1. UI (how it looks & what are the features, e.g Suspend & Resume?)
2. 16GB GDDR6 (How much is available for Devs)
3. Is there additional RAM other than GDDR6
4. Is there an Infinity Cache to compensate for the RAM bandwidth
5. RDNA 2 (what features are present, ML, VRS?)
6. what additional RDNA features are present if any... e.g features that may appear in RDNA 3... etc.

Feel free to correct and add anything I've missed.

All I really want and care about is the U.I. Once that’s been disclosed, I reckon it’s time to close this thread.

 

[Thirty7ven]

People can complain about the IGN video all they want, but the game doesn't look great in any video released so far. Digital Foundry did a whole lot of pandering based on the mere fact that the lead engine guy extended them an hand.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

This is something I hate with a passion for many games.
BoTW is a perfect example. Love it to death, 11/10. But I want games to challenge me more the more I play.

That said you can make BoTW not totally fall apart if you avoid the obvious ways to make it easier like food.

Well, I couldn't kill more than 3 Valkyries, and there are some massive challenges optionally. It doesn't become easy, but you get more perks so you can manage. Try them out.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

The new one? You are in for a ride then : D

It's looking pretty good, and I trust Sony's quality control. Just look at the massively talented Evolution Studios guys and what happened to them with Drit 5:





It became literally car racing Craig. But some people don't see a massive problem in that game.

 

[FranXico]

still remember when we all thought "Sony is just holding back because of their PS4 games like TLOU2 and Ghost. Just wait for July, after the Ghost release Sony will put all spotlights on the PS5 and will start talking like a waterfall"

Those were the times...

And they are delivering very good games for their launch window.

 

[LivingD3AD]

So with regards the PS5 this is what we don't know...

1. UI (how it looks & what are the features, e.g Suspend & Resume?)
2. 16GB GDDR6 (How much is available for Devs)
3. Is there additional RAM other than GDDR6
4. Is there an Infinity Cache to compensate for the RAM bandwidth
5. RDNA 2 (what features are present, ML, VRS?)
6. what additional RDNA features are present if any... e.g features that may appear in RDNA 3... etc.

Feel free to correct and add anything I've missed.

1. We shall see (TODAY!)
2. 2GB reserved for the OS and 14GB available to devs
3. Yup, 2GB DDR4 SRam for the SSD Cache and OS functions
4. There is good chance for infinite cache in the GPU, based on the rumors around BIG NAVI
5. All the features have already been announced like VRS, ML, HW RayTracing and more
6. There definitely are a bunch of highly customized features in partnership between sony and AMD that will be in AMD’s future Roadmaps (RDNA3), things like Geometry Engine cerny has talked about during Road to PS5

theyre all my harvests based on the most credible rumors thus far!

 

[LiquidRex]

All I really want and care about is the U.I. Once that’s been disclosed, I reckon it’s time to close this thread.

But just as the thread is about to close, Pro Console Github leaks will pull you back in.

 

[ArcaneNLSC]

More Cherno:

Is this a MOBILE game?? - Dirt 5 on Xbox Series X // Game Engine Developer Reacts

He couldn't take anymore of the disappointment at 5 and 7 seconds in to watching the video daaaaamn that is crazy (Not trying to troll)

 

[MastaKiiLA]

People can complain about the IGN video all they want, but the game doesn't look great in any video released so far. Digital Foundry did a whole lot of pandering based on the mere fact that the lead engine guy extended them an hand.

I'm not sure if some of his complaints are due to the engine, or to the shitty capture. DF's captures are generally top-notch. To his credit, he points out that he's going into these blind, and just giving his off-the-cuff commentary, and he's not committing any time to the research. He was given the IGN link, so that's what he used. He even used the "corrected" capture. So I can't fault him. But that IGN capture is garbage. The game doesn't look great. No denying that, but I wish he'd used better source material, in order to avoid some of the fanboy blowback he's going to end up getting.

 

[Thirty7ven]

I'm not sure if some of his complaints are due to the engine, or to the shitty capture. DF's captures are generally top-notch. To his credit, he points out that he's going into these blind, and just giving his off-the-cuff commentary, and he's not committing any time to the research. He was given the IGN link, so that's what he used. He even used the "corrected" capture. So I can't fault him. But that IGN capture is garbage. The game doesn't look great. No denying that, but I wish he'd used better source material, in order to avoid some of the fanboy blowback he's going to end up getting.

Aside from quality of the capture, the game still looks bad in the DF video, which was funny because the guy in it was trying to convince me my eyes weren’t working, basically.

Xbox fans will react badly anyway because the game is being promoted as a Xbox game first and foremost. Party lines and all that.

 

[sandkiller]

1. We shall see (TODAY!)
(...)

theyre all my harvests based on the most credible rumors thus far!

Which rumor is that?

 

[LivingD3AD]

Which rumor is that?

Burger King ad with the startup sound had today’s date

 

[Loxus]

This is just non sense there’s no secret ram or secret gpu or unlock cpu that will make PS5 more powerful technically then series x. Right now Sony has the upper hand in the category that matters most they have the better launch games and first party titles and the development pipeline has been great that developers were able to implement things such as ray tracing and in more of their games on their platform then Microsoft even with the better hardware something that Microsoft needs to address.

Who said anything about more powerful?
The post was simply saying that it could possible be ram for the OS, giving full use off the 16GB.
It could be possible both the SSD and OS use the same RAM pool the same way the CPU and GPU does.

Stop letting your preferred platform cloud your judgment.

 

[LiquidRex]

Pro Console Github leaks show up.

Just as the thread is about to close.
Probably.

 

[hemo memo]

I'm not sure if some of his complaints are due to the engine, or to the shitty capture. DF's captures are generally top-notch. To his credit, he points out that he's going into these blind, and just giving his off-the-cuff commentary, and he's not committing any time to the research. He was given the IGN link, so that's what he used. He even used the "corrected" capture. So I can't fault him. But that IGN capture is garbage. The game doesn't look great. No denying that, but I wish he'd used better source material, in order to avoid some of the fanboy blowback he's going to end up getting.

Well, “MOBILE game” is a stupid thing to say doing research or watching a shitty capture or not. If a GAF poster said it they’ll be banned for trolling. I don’t have to be an “Game Engine Developer” to see that. C’mon. It is ridiculous and click-baity. I don’t plan to buy an XSX at launch and I have PS5 pre-ordered. I just hate spreading stupidity and this guy is supposed to be an “expert”.

 

[SlimySnake]

That's not the new miles Spiderman doofus. It's from the old game.

 

[Dibils2k]

It's looking pretty good, and I trust Sony's quality control. Just look at the massively talented Evolution Studios guys and what happened to them with Drit 5:





It became literally car racing Craig. But some people don't see a massive problem in that game.

what i have a problem with is people treating the game like a 1st party big budget game... as a fan of the DIRT series this makes me sad, the hate the company is getting for something they cant really control

its mostly MSs fault though as this game seems to have been put in the spot Halo was supposed to be in lol as the flagship for Series X, which it never should be

 

[Jaxx_377]

All I really want and care about is the U.I. Once that’s been disclosed, I reckon it’s time to close this thread.

I would like to know what the future of PS Now is and what improvements they will be implementing going forward and also if they will be making any changes to PS Plus

 

[Three Jackdaws]

Pro Console Github leaks show up.

Just as the thread is about to close.
Probably.

?

 

[Bo_Hazem]

Finally, thanks to HeisenbergFX4 ! Full 48Gbps bandwidth.

 

[Codexer]

 

[ToadMan]

Well, “MOBILE game” is a stupid thing to say doing research or watching a shitty capture or not. If a GAF poster said it they’ll be banned for trolling. I don’t have to be an “Game Engine Developer” to see that. C’mon. It is ridiculous and click-baity. I don’t plan to buy an XSX at launch and I have PS5 pre-ordered. I just hate spreading stupidity and this guy is supposed to be an “expert”.

Well he has experience with mobile games - in fact there's a clip in the vid of one such game he worked on. So I think he says it looks mobile with more credibility than most.

 

[mancs]

Forza looks better on current gen ,compared to dirt?? .
Microsoft are.... Crazy as Corona

 

[Three Jackdaws]

I remember him saying Series X was 64 ROPS for a long time now and a lot of people thought it was 80.

 

[jasondefaoite]

what i have a problem with is people treating the game like a 1st party big budget game... as a fan of the DIRT series this makes me sad, the hate the company is getting for something they cant really control

its mostly MSs fault though as this game seems to have been put in the spot Halo was supposed to be in lol as the flagship for Series X, which it never should be

There are issues with the XSX box in terms of VRR currently, which didn't help. And I agree with you to some extent about the spotlight being on them due to the 343 mess up. So, while MS has some fault, I personally believe it is mostly Codemasters. Why does Dirt Rally and Dirt 4 look better than Dirt 5? That's on Codemasters not Microsoft.

 

[Dibils2k]

There are issues with the XSX box in terms of VRR currently, which didn't help. And I agree with you to some extent about the spotlight being on them due to the 343 mess up. So, while MS has some fault, I personally believe it is mostly Codemasters. Why does Dirt Rally and Dirt 4 look better than Dirt 5? That's on Codemasters not Microsoft.

as someone who played Dirt 4, i do not agree that Dirt 4 looks better

 

[husomc]

More Cherno:

Is this a MOBILE game?? - Dirt 5 on Xbox Series X // Game Engine Developer Reacts

I haven't laughed this much in a long long time

 

[zubairali2]

forza horizon 4 is still a great looking game

 

[Dibils2k]

forza horizon 4 is still a great looking game

i still play this game, it is by far the greatest racing game ever made (not a sim fan). Horizon 4 with the 4k/60fps patch will easily be the best looking racing game on Day 1

 

[sandkiller]

Burger King ad with the startup sound had today’s date

... i don't get the connection between the promo and the UI reveal

 

[jasondefaoite]

i still play this game, it is by far the greatest racing game ever made (not a sim fan). Horizon 4 with the 4k/60fps patch will easily be the best looking racing game on Day 1

Ok looking again at it, I'll give you that ... it looks similar to Dirt 5. But Dirt Rally (2015) looks better than both. Maybe Codemasters lost some key people after that game.

 

[geordiemp]

LOL, you've already been shown proof that abstraction layers are not being used for XSX when it comes to DX12 and GPU usage.

Your proof is you saying no lol. what proof ?

I linked for you hypervisor and abstraction stuff from 360, xbox1 DF article from Metro dev about indirect apis, amd thats not enough. You gave NOTHING.

Believe whatever you want, I was being kind for what we have seen in XSX performance. You think up your own excuses.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

“This is Dirt compared to Horizon” - Cherno, 2020

 

[Zathalus]

Your proof is you saying no lol. what proof ?

I linked your hypervisor and abstraction stuff from 360, xbox1 DF article from Metro dev about indirect apis, amd thats not enough. You gave NOTHING.

Believe whatever you want, I was being kind for what we have seen in XSX performance. You think up your own excuses.

I gave nothing? So I suppose this post was my imagination?

Try and not use sources that are years out of date.

Hot Chips 2020 Live Blog: Microsoft Xbox Series X System Architecture (6:00pm PT)

www.anandtech.com

09:35PM EDT - Q: Are you happy as DX12 as a low hardware API? A: DX12 is very versatile - we have some Xbox specific enhancements that power developers can use. But we try to have consistency between Xbox and PC. Divergence isn't that good. But we work with developers when designing these chips so that their needs are met. Not heard many complains so far (as a silicon person!). We have a SMASH driver model. The games on the binaries implement the hardware layed out data that the GPU eats directly - it's not a HAL layer abstraction. MS also re-writes the driver and smashes it together, we replace that and the firmware in the GPU. It's significantly more efficient than the PC.

Even the quote you linked as "proof" debunks your claims:

Each XDK that has been released both before and after the Xbox One launch has brought faster and faster draw-calls to the table. They added tons of features just to work around limitations of the DX11 API model. They even made a DX12/GNM style do-it-yourself API available

 

[Darius87]

That's not the new miles Spiderman doofus. It's from the old game.

 

[zubairali2]

it is by far the greatest racing game ever made

for me, that honour goes to this game

 

[DaGwaphics]

I love that:

WTF is that which I have just seen?

 

[geordiemp]

I gave nothing? So I suppose this post was my imagination?



Even the quote you linked as "proof" debunks your claims:

There is a common SDK and environment now for the MS dev kits. If you believe that is going to produce results which are as direct as a single platform like ps5, then whatever. It does not matter anyway, its the performance that matters.

What do you think the deficit is, hardware or software ? Whats your theory.

 

[cudiye]

it is by far the greatest racing game ever made (not a sim fan).

Uh no.. since we not talking sims.

Spoiler

 

[Gudji]

Today is UI day.

 

[geordiemp]

So with regards the PS5 this is what we don't know...

1. UI (how it looks & what are the features, e.g Suspend & Resume?)
2. 16GB GDDR6 (How much is available for Devs)
3. Is there additional RAM other than GDDR6
4. Is there an Infinity Cache to compensate for the RAM bandwidth
5. RDNA 2 (what features are present, ML, VRS?)
6. what additional RDNA features are present if any... e.g features that may appear in RDNA 3... etc.

Feel free to correct and add anything I've missed.

Ps5 does not need suspend resume, SSD is too fast anyway so its just a waste of SSD space for ps5 IMO.

We dont know what infinity cache is, other than 80 CU and 23 TF uses a 256 bit bus, how Sony have optimised will be a lower scale as it does not need to feed 80 CU.

There is rumour that RDNA2 has higher compression also, so 256 bus is fine. MS likely went higher as the server function has allot more memory (is it 20 or 40 GB, cant recall ?)

The unknowns and interest is around ps5 architecture and what has been employed, optimising caches, speed, Geometry engine optimisations and the like.

You wont get that until after RDNA2 reveal on 28 th Oct, there are allot of recent AMD patents, we will find out after this month whats been adopted by who and in which partnership.

 

[SlimySnake]

Dude insomniacs literally said that the ps5 version will have a flash screen instead of load times. So in those instances when the ps4 level loads, the ps5 level will do a fade in and fade out. There is no fancy loading skipping happening here. They aren't making two versions of the same game. Otherwise it would've looked next gen.

You need to grow up. Don't communicate in gifs like a modern day cave man. This isn't Twitter. You are meant to use words on forums. Your parents and teachers didn't waste their lives trying to educate you, teaching you how to speak then write then finally use that thick brain of yours instead of console warring like a 12 year boy.

You can do it. I believe in you.

 

[Zathalus]

There is a common SDK and environment now for the MS dev kits. If you believe that is going to produce results which are as direct as a single platform like ps5, then whatever. It does not matter anyway, its the performance that matters.

What do you think the deficit is, hardware or software ? Whats your theory.

I don't think there is any deficit, for the games we have been shown so far they are multiplatform cross-gen games. You can't use Yakuza as an example of how much weaker the Xbox Series X is when it appears to be on par with the PS5 version. The only valid comparison that can be made is like for like, in order to determine how powerful a console is. Compare Dirt 5 XSX vs PS5, or AC Valhalla XSX vs PS5, or Watch Dogs XSX vs PS5.

Comparing Yakuza vs Demon Souls is about as valid as comparing Bugsnax with Watch Dogs Legion. Two different games on two different engines developed by two totally different teams.

 

[Deleted member 775630]

Ok looking again at it, I'll give you that ... it looks similar to Dirt 5. But Dirt Rally (2015) looks better than both. Maybe Codemasters lost some key people after that game.

Have you ever played FH4 at ultra settings on PC? Because that looks way better than Dirt 5

 

[geordiemp]

I don't think there is any deficit, for the games we have been shown so far they are multiplatform cross-gen games. You can't use Yakuza as an example of how much weaker the Xbox Series X is when it appears to be on par with the PS5 version. The only valid comparison that can be made is like for like, in order to determine how powerful a console is. Compare Dirt 5 XSX vs PS5, or AC Valhalla XSX vs PS5, or Watch Dogs XSX vs PS5.

Comparing Yakuza vs Demon Souls is about as valid as comparing Bugsnax with Watch Dogs Legion. Two different games on two different engines developed by two totally different teams.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

Why is there no Series S? What's happening?

EDIT: XSS is all digital, smh. More confusion for the average Joe and little Billy.

 

[zubairali2]

Why is there no Series S? What's happening?

because theres no disc drive lol