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HAL-01
Member
That is what they’re worried about, yes. Devs will have to choose between building their multi platform games to the XSS’s bottlenecks, or come up with different code for the XSS entirely
azertydu91
Hard to Kill
I think he had a meltdown about why the series S wouldn't hold back the series X and if it did then the ps5 would hold it too.Nothing really surprising coming from him.
azertydu91
Hard to Kill
Sadly a pigeon would shitpost less.
LordOfChaos
Member
"1080p, check that box" - reggie on the Wii U
GribbleGrunger
Dreams in Digital
Maybe initially but in the long run I do not think it will hold the PS5 versions back. Both are likely to sell better than the Xbox alternative and Sony are coming out of the gate showing what to expect from the console graphically.
Agnostic2020
Member
I like “dev” part as he has not made a single game yet
Neo Blaster
Member
I know people are saying next week Sony can't do anything because Iphone and Xperia, but they are not console gaming products. Besides, XSX/XSS pre-orders begin in 12 days, is Sony really going to let customers without any info on price/release date/pre-order date till there? It's practically an invitation for people to grab an MS console.
Crazychipmunx
Member
"We said it can do 8K, 120fps. We never said it would do 8k, 120fps."
zaitsu
Banned
So XSX is resolution machine because of weaker SKU...
Good lord, playstation exclusives will obliterate whole competition...
Agnostic2020
Member
Ps5 IO and ssd is not to be compared with XSS and XSX. For a current gen game XSS does 12.5 second vs ps5 0.8 second
kyliethicc
Member
zaitsu
Banned
Maybe 21 show with preorders available as it end.
FunkMiller
Gold Member
Not being honest about a product’s capabilities in marketing and promotional materials always... ALWAYS... comes back to bite you in the ass.
I hope for Microsoft’s sake that they can back all the words up with evidence.
3liteDragon
Member
(timestamped, 0:52-3:57)
Wow this video has aged like fine wine, there's a part for everything. Cerny talks about how the first three consoles were built in complete secrecy with engineers guessing what the best set of capabilities for each console would be instead of talking to developers first. The target with each console was a revolution each time with a brand new feature set. And the result of that?
Time-to-Triangle went up with each console and got even worse with the PlayStation 3. He talked about how they struck a good balance with PS4 in terms of performance and familiarity (1-2 months, back to PS1 levels) after listening to developer feedback instead of building the console in complete secrecy (ex. 8GB GDDR5 mic drop moment). I'm honestly finding it hard to believe that MS kept Series S a secret and somehow devs didn't know about it's existence during it's development phase, but on the other hand something tells me if MS was actually being open to devs about Lockhart way back during it's development, we wouldn't have gotten this RAM setup. But who knows at this point.
Wow this video has aged like fine wine, there's a part for everything. Cerny talks about how the first three consoles were built in complete secrecy with engineers guessing what the best set of capabilities for each console would be instead of talking to developers first. The target with each console was a revolution each time with a brand new feature set. And the result of that?
Time-to-Triangle went up with each console and got even worse with the PlayStation 3. He talked about how they struck a good balance with PS4 in terms of performance and familiarity (1-2 months, back to PS1 levels) after listening to developer feedback instead of building the console in complete secrecy (ex. 8GB GDDR5 mic drop moment). I'm honestly finding it hard to believe that MS kept Series S a secret and somehow devs didn't know about it's existence during it's development phase, but on the other hand something tells me if MS was actually being open to devs about Lockhart way back during it's development, we wouldn't have gotten this RAM setup. But who knows at this point.
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Great Hair
Banned
zaitsu
Banned
Yeah on playstation, not on xbox.
Their waste die space for those 12TF to handle higher resolution. Really XSS crippled whole nextgen multiplatform games.
jimbojim
Banned
The rest his comments :
Full thread :
This tweet of his :
I don't get the strategy thinking that being ultra price aggressive will deeply cut into the Sony/Nintendo's marketshare without next-gen 1st party exclusives
Moridianae
Member
With devs commenting freely on how it somewhat holds back next gen due to RAM or otherwise..
I trust
HeisenbergFX4
and its easy to see why Sony's checkbook got busted out(if true). Sony has the same PS5 either way..use all the power you want to make your games shine.
Don't have to worry about skimping for the baseline system to run(though XSS isn't totally a slouch).
I trust
HeisenbergFX4
and its easy to see why Sony's checkbook got busted out(if true). Sony has the same PS5 either way..use all the power you want to make your games shine.Don't have to worry about skimping for the baseline system to run(though XSS isn't totally a slouch).
Agnostic2020
Member
The rest his comments :
Full thread :
This tweet of his :
I don't get the strategy thinking that being ultra price aggressive will deeply cut into the Sony/Nintendo's marketshare without next-gen 1st party exclusives
Damn .they r not happy
zaitsu
Banned
The rest his comments :
Full thread :
This tweet of his :
I don't get the strategy thinking that being ultra price aggressive will deeply cut into the Sony/Nintendo's marketshare without next-gen 1st party exclusives
I think only stupid people had ever different idea of how XSS will be for big brother.
Agnostic2020
Member
more dev comments
Fortuneelsewhere
Member
The rest his comments :
Full thread :
This tweet of his :
I don't get the strategy thinking that being ultra price aggressive will deeply cut into the Sony/Nintendo's marketshare without next-gen 1st party exclusives
Since I was a child I was told that “the only thing worst than a incompetent is a motivated incompetent”. Unfortunately Microsoft fills this role perfectly....
Hawking Radiation
Member
Lol how are Xbox fans going to spin all these dev complaints on Series S.
And to be honest this developer makes a good point.
This upcoming gen is going to be essentially a repeat of this generation. Weakest Xbox and most powerful Xbox with PS5 sandwiched between the two.
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HAL-01
Member
Xbox will still be able to stream into ram during gameplay, but that doesn’t make up for greatly reduced ram capacity. There is base game code and assets that must remain in ram at all times, and so the ram pool for streaming would be much smaller compared to xsx.
GribbleGrunger
Dreams in Digital
If you're not serious about continuing with consoles but don't want to piss your userbase off, which strategy would you go for? You can simply tell your userbase you're no longer interested in the console business or you can put a console out knowing it isn't going to do that well and so save yourself millions in promotions and manufacturing. One leads to 'Microsoft didn't intend to ever be competitive and sold us down the swanny' the other leads to 'Well, they lost but at least they gave it a damn good try'.
They're not interested in winning the console war, folks.
They're not interested in winning the console war, folks.
DonkeyKong
Member
These devs are talking like they haven’t even seen the S yet, strange
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
The rest his comments :
Full thread :
This tweet of his :
I don't get the strategy thinking that being ultra price aggressive will deeply cut into the Sony/Nintendo's marketshare without next-gen 1st party exclusives
Who knew the guy who worked on that shark game Maneater had so much to say.
gt_connect
Neo Member
Hi! New to the forum 
Looks like that even SFS they showed on last series S teardown will not make up for the lack of memory, it will have compromises :/
Looks like that even SFS they showed on last series S teardown will not make up for the lack of memory, it will have compromises :/
Agnostic2020
Member
Yea for shame . We won’t see next gen truly cause of XSS
zaitsu
Banned
Yes same xbox one S game with 120 fps.
It looked fuvkin ugly.
zaitsu
Banned
Beside Sony exclusives
jose4gg
Member
The rest his comments :
Full thread :
This tweet of his :
I don't get the strategy thinking that being ultra price aggressive will deeply cut into the Sony/Nintendo's marketshare without next-gen 1st party exclusives
TheGreatWhiteShark
Do you want to call out this dev too? Or we are clear here?
kyliethicc
Member
And last gen both console makers entered the gen almost tied on units sold (PSE/360 ~85m)...
Now its 115m for PS4 vs 50m Xbox at the beginning...
PS5 will only need 2-3 years of their quality exclusives and it'll be game over.
FranXico
Member
Cerny made no mention of magic memory multipliers. He did mention that thanks to IO speed, there would be less of a need to retain idle assets in RAM, for example.
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kyliethicc
Member
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
What they can do is send a memo to every first party employee to tweet how awesome it is.
ZehDon
Member
Yeah, not particularly vested in his comments.
The comments from the id devs are more relevant, because their engines are always pushing envelopes. If they're commenting that the XSS will have RAM issues, I'm more inclined to believe them because id generally delivers cutting edge tech with each release. With that said, Microsoft have bet a lot on their Velocity Architecture, to act as a multiplier on RAM. Microsoft also know their stuff - literally some of the best computer and data science folks on the planet. I'm curious to see how this one actually plays out - did Microsoft get it wrong, or do Dev's just need time to get to grips with the new hardware?
jose4gg
Member
Yep, in fact there is no way to calculate multipliers, 10GB are 10GB no matter what you do, you can have things outside of it because you don't need it (What cerny wants), but you cannot guarantee in all cases that you can save space in the ram, it will all comes down to a game, to a scene, to a level, and when reducing the idle memory is not a possibility for XSX or for PS5, XSS will suffer the most.
mejin
Member
He's a FUD developer.
alstrike
Member
Saw this on twitter. Looks nice for Year 1.
"Goodbye Volcano High" sticks out like a sore thumb...
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
id has roots in PC game making for 30 years. And their game engines always run well on any console or PC spec.
Don't see the problem.
If they think Series S is underpowered compared to latest tech, then don't make games for it, Xbox One, PS4 or any PC rig that is more than 5 years old.
kyliethicc
Member
The thing is he's not pointing out highly technical game dev stuff. Its just basic stuff that seems fairly clear. Even if he's a shit developer, he's sorta just stating the obvious.
Wraith Phantom
Member
Does xbox have some clause that studios have to make games for Xbox family of devices?? Cause this S about to get switch treatment at this rate.
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