.... And to me it just seems like you're using a leftist tactic of feigning ignorance to make others feel guilty.
Well I think you're barking up the wrong tree for a start off because I'm neither a leftist nor have any intention of making anyone feel guilty.
I honestly, genuinely don't see there being a problem. If I did, I'd say something about it as I really do not enjoy being preached at when I'm just hoping to be entertained.
Harping on about it when there is no overt messaging is to me a red flag
To say that you wouldn't understand the outrage if a game featured black men getting shot repeatedly, in the light of recent events seems extremely disingenuous. But you may not have turned the TV on in months, I don't know.
Depends on the context and who's shooting the black men! I'd expect a different response if I was controlling a British soldier fighting the Zulu at Rorke's Drift, or playing as Omar in a videogame adaptation of The Wire. Personally I'd argue both are valid but I know the former would draw a lot more comment than the latter in the media.
Perception and cultural climate obviously factor in, and sometimes you have to consider that there is an inherent "ickyness" to certain things. Men killing women is more taboo than men killing other men, killing children even more so which is why its rarely done. These are not "progressive" ideas however, they are equally traditional and conservative sentiments.
And you seem to be coming from the point of view that I do have a big issue with it. I don't. I enjoy the discussion though as they have made an interesting game.
I enjoyed the game a lot and agree that most of what you say was in the background -- But I can clearly see why some take issue as ND are deliberately trying to antagonise and have stated as much. That's not really up for debate, as the people making the game say that was their intention.
First of all I wasn't having a go at you personally, I was simply laying out my viewpoint. Although I quoted your post I didn't intend my reply to be exclusively for you (I'd have PM'd if that were the case!), and likewise was referencing the pushback against the game generally.
But let me be blunt, I think the discussion surrounding this game really has flushed some shitty people with shitty attitudes out into the open. I do not like SJW-types, but I like bigots even less. And I'm sorry but if the presence of gay and or trans characters offends on principle, then what else can it be but bigotry? That's how I see it anyway,
I'm all for civil discussion, and there is most definitely room for criticism on grounds like tokenism, opportunism, unearned or insincere preachyness and sanctimony etc. But if a person chooses to argue that case then they have to be quite precise in articulating what their issues are, so as not to appear to be just another common bigot.
Because as I've said, and I defy anyone to argue otherwise, there is no shortage of bigots out there. There always have been and there most likely always will be.
Slipping subtle (or not so subtle) political messages into games annoys people as it distracts from the core gameplay, if you are politically minded. Going by what you've written, you're probably not politically minded so you don't see it.
There is a reason that you are warned never to talk politics at the dinner table -- it's because that is a space that you are supposed to relax and enjoy -- and it's the same with videogames. If you're young you generally don't care about that sort of thing, but the older you get the more it annoys you as your time is more limited. Doubly annoying here as ND deliberately prevented the press telling people about that part of the story.
To me the crucial thing is if the messaging has a point, as in it is attempting to make an overt statement as opposed to just incorporating elements of the author's political outlook. For me TLOU2 is very much in the latter category.
At no point did I feel that the game was preaching at me or trying to communicate a message about gender/sexual orientation. The story is basically a cautionary tale about the destructive effects of seeking violent retribution, even when its seemingly morally justified.
I didn't come away thinking any different about gay or trans folks. I wasn't shocked to my core that women can be as tough and violent as men, or that female bodybuilders (gasp!) exist having been a fan of both pro Wrestling and MMA for years...
I'm not being wilfully obtuse or apolitical, I just don't think there is a message to be taken from the game. The defining relationships in the game are parent child, or at least protector and ward, ironically the romantic relationships are the primary casualties of the impulse to revenge.
It really doesn't even push the female empowerment button as pretty much every act of violence in the game is presented as being ugly and pointless. For all their toughness and determination the end result is that they simply take more pain for no gain.
