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Next-Gen PS5 & XSX |OT| Console tEch threaD

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Bo_Hazem

Banned
I've said this since the beginning and made a post earlier saying "gamepass effect". The little sales thy were making in software thy cannabalized with gamepass and planned on reducing individual game budgets bcus games would be on gamepass. Now you'll get a fleet of AA type budgeted games.

No thnx I like my AAA blockbusters with the occasional golden indie or AA game tht pops up tht turns out dope.

So let's wrap the rap sheet:

-No XSX exclusives for 2 years.
-No AAA first party games.
-Might get 4TF Lockhart to babysit for the entire generation.
-Must put into account potato PC's.

Sounds promising, only needs to be priced at $500 and PS5 at $400.
 

pasterpl

Member
gamepass effect


So he knows better than Matt Booty? Let's check out what's his work there might be just a cleaner:

148012.jpg


Hmmm? Maybe he was drunk, Xbox fans know better.

LOL...I am not saying that, but we know about games like Halo Infinite, AoE4, Forza and FH that are all AAA games, Hellblade I still consider a solid AA game. So M Booty comment is obviously not 100% accurate. Just saying that, as that twitter person said, it is naive to believe that there will be no AAA games from MGS.

In addition, don't forget about this;


Lots of developers from big publishers were hired by the Initiative

The Initiative has been on an impressive hiring spree, adding experienced developers from studios like Naughty Dog, Rockstar Games, and Crystal Dynamics to its team. In January 2019, the studio hired God of War‘s Senior Staff Level Designer, Chris O’Neill, to its team.

Oh almost forgot...full interview with M Booty;


He says that these type of high-quality AA games (that you can finish in 10-15h) fit perfectly in between their AAA releases.

Hellblade, State of Decay and Age of Empires are AAA games all of a sudden?

Hellblade is AA, SoD is AA, AoE is AAA game, I have spent 100s of hours playing AoE (but I love RTS).
 

Bo_Hazem

Banned
LOL...I am not saying that, but we know about games like Halo Infinite, AoE4, Forza and FH that are all AAA games, Hellblade I still consider a solid AA game. So M Booty comment is obviously not 100% accurate. Just saying that, as that twitter person said, it is naive to believe that there will be no AAA games from MGS.

In addition, don't forget about this;


Lots of developers from big publishers were hired by the Initiative



Oh almost forgot...full interview with M Booty;


He says that these type of high-quality AA games (that you can finish in 10-15h) fit perfectly in between their AAA releases.



Hellblade is AA, SoD is AA, AoE is AAA game, I have spent 100s of hours playing AoE (but I love RTS).


There is room for all of us, doesn't need to end like this. Jump! :lollipop_tears_of_joy:

 
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JägerSeNNA

Banned
Exactly this. I think we're reaching diminishing returns with output res, I prefer super detailed textures myself.

The devs are all fapping over the PS5 tech for a reason, and I can't wait to see what they do with it.

".. the ability to load in the highest resolution version of any asset just in front of you and drop it immediately as you turn around means that every tree can have 3d bark and moss and ants marching on it just when needed, without blowing up the budget. It's going to be great." 🔥
Sony will win the power race with that incredible SSD. No matter how stronger GPU and CPU the Xbox has. That SSD is almighty. When the time comes,SONY won’t even need that crazy fast GPU. The SSD will handle everything alone that the GPU and CPU have to do.
 

FeiRR

Banned
Hellblade is AA, SoD is AA, AoE is AAA game, I have spent 100s of hours playing AoE (but I love RTS).
AAA is about budget, not length of the game or its quality. AoE is developed by an external studio and that studio isn't AAA size. They have a record of quality releases (I loved Homeworld even though I don't play RTS in general) but you have to notice that this project was passed to them from another publisher. Gamedev history shows that it usually doesn't bode well for sequels.
 

Bo_Hazem

Banned
Fun facts:

In August last year, Sony purchased Insomniac Games, developer of the PS4-exclusive Spider-Man. That game has been the most successful superhero game of all time, selling 13 million copies. ... According to an SECC filing by Sony they paid $229 Million, mostly in cash, for the studio. That's a bit of a bargain.


Go Big, or Go GamePass.
 

Gediminas

Banned
Bend did Days Gone. And yeah I don’t think they’re as big as some others, but still probably 100+. San Diego is rumored for have to expanded, they did move into a new bigger building. Some think they’re making a new Uncharted game. The known San Diego team does the MLB game. I have no idea how many devs that team is.
Bend was like 50 people for years building Days Gone. just in the last phase there was support from other sony's studios. and they manage to craft amazing game. one of the best sony's exclusives.
 

pasterpl

Member

Article from 2018...just saying. Matt Booty said that they want these AA games to be released between their big AAA games. I love how Sony fans are reaching and trying to convince themselves that "the most powerful console next-gen" will not have games :messenger_beaming: Ignoring the fact that some of these studios were/are hiring left and right people from SSM, RockStar etc. there was a list I have posted 100s of pages ago showing the scale of talent drain from SSM.

But since we are looking at old info;

Microsoft believes that its new studios will help it to achieve a primary goal, the delivery of one AAA game per quarter in order to drive Xbox Game Pass. With that said, it does not want to rush its new studios into delivering games before they are fully baked, and believes that any acquisition takes time to get its legs. Its ideal acquisition targets have proven content and strong development teams.

In addition, going to some of these devs websites you can see what they are hiring for and potential scale of these games e.g.

Playground Games is looking for an experienced animation specialist to join our brand new open-world action / RPG development team. You will join the team and project at an early stage, giving you the rare opportunity to shape the technology used to build a large-scale AAA title.
 

PocoJoe

Banned
Out of four things, you manage to get one right. One and a half, if you count Lockhart.

"
-No XSX exclusives for 2 years.
-No AAA first party games.
-Might get 4TF Lockhart to babysit for the entire generation.
-Must put into account potato PC's. "

No XSX exclusives from 1st party for 1-2 years, didn't they say that? +1.0
There will be AAA I think, so not true +-0
if 4Tf series S is true, then maybe, maybe not +0 - 1.0
if all/most games must work on PC then it surely will have some effects into games +0.5 - 1-0

So that is like 1.5 - 3 right :messenger_grimmacing_

Anyway it doesnt matter unless they affect PS5 games.

Just hope that xsex(or ps5) wont get avalanche of shitty indies like switch that make it difficult to find the good games
 

FeiRR

Banned
Article from 2018...just saying. Matt Booty said that they want these AA games to be released between their big AAA games.
We know that most of those AAA games will be Halo, Gears and Forza plus The Initiative game which has just started so it's going to be 3-4 years till its release. That's half of the generation without major new titles. If you're a teenager who likes supersoldier boom-boom and fantasy car vroom-vroom, then fine. Sales of those franchises show that there's a certain, quite substantial market for such games, but that market isn't growing.

I love how Sony fans are reaching and trying to convince themselves that "the most powerful console next-gen" will not have games :messenger_beaming: Ignoring the fact that some of these studios were/are hiring left and right people from SSM, RockStar etc. there was a list I have posted 100s of pages ago showing the scale of talent drain from SSM.
What does talent have to do with the budget you're working with? I'll tell you: exactly nothing. A lot of devs have a burnout after working for big studios and they switch to smaller projects. Maybe those projects will be of great quality, who knows. But they won't be big. Having a very powerful console with no games to utilize that power is a stupid idea.
 

ZywyPL

Banned
As much as I know it does not fit the notion of this forum that only AAA matters, what I find truly tragic this gen, is death of AA games. Only AAA or indie shovelware. Not much in between, I hope that next-gen we see games more in the line of X360/PS3 gen.

I'm personally more concern about the lack of linear dudebro corridor shooters, PS360 era was the shit for real, I want to blow stuff up, now walking around for miles in all those open-world walking sims, and neither MS nor Sony provided me any of that, maybe except Gears 4/5 in which I have no interest. Or any 3rd party for the matter, with BF going all the way downhill, and CoD being willed with retarded exo-skeletons and monkey-like jumping all over the place. The Division and Titanfall 2 are the only shooters I remember from this gen, I cannot recall anything else that had guns in it and sucked me for longer than 2-3h, like Doom for example. And with the rise of SSD I fear that I'll get even more open-world games, with even larger worlds a.k.a. even more walking, and that's simply not my cup of tea, I don't have time for that bullshit.
 

M1chl

Currently Gif and Meme Champion
I'm personally more concern about the lack of linear dudebro corridor shooters, PS360 era was the shit for real, I want to blow stuff up, now walking around for miles in all those open-world walking sims, and neither MS nor Sony provided me any of that, maybe except Gears 4/5 in which I have no interest. Or any 3rd party for the matter, with BF going all the way downhill, and CoD being willed with retarded exo-skeletons and monkey-like jumping all over the place. The Division and Titanfall 2 are the only shooters I remember from this gen, I cannot recall anything else that had guns in it and sucked me for longer than 2-3h, like Doom for example. And with the rise of SSD I fear that I'll get even more open-world games, with even larger worlds a.k.a. even more walking, and that's simply not my cup of tea, I don't have time for that bullshit.
Yeah well this is pretty in line with my internal thoughts. I don't want more open worlds and especially not bigger ones, full of filler. Give me Syndicate, Max Payne 3, Revengeance, 50cent: Blood on Sand, CoJ: The Cartel, Crysis 2, etc... Oh and fucking Black Ops, why the fuck cannot be good anymore. Also Bad Company, semi open world game still can be fun. I sure wish I could stay entertained in AC: Oddysey, but I just could not do it. Only Open World which I thoroughly enjoyed this gen, was...suprisingly 2 Watch_dogs games.
 
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We know that most of those AAA games will be Halo, Gears and Forza plus The Initiative game which has just started so it's going to be 3-4 years till its release. That's half of the generation without major new titles. If you're a teenager who likes supersoldier boom-boom and fantasy car vroom-vroom, then fine. Sales of those franchises show that there's a certain, quite substantial market for such games, but that market isn't growing.


What does talent have to do with the budget you're working with? I'll tell you: exactly nothing. A lot of devs have a burnout after working for big studios and they switch to smaller projects. Maybe those projects will be of great quality, who knows. But they won't be big. Having a very powerful console with no games to utilize that power is a stupid idea.
I already considered that big budgets are not a good thing at this point, teams are going for 500+ people, videogames are already a very complex medium, to get all those people working together in a span of 3-4 years is a fuck ton of guaranted problems, I think we are kind of reaching the limit of how it is possible to manage a vast production, at least until we don't get some new magic tech that seriously speed up and make work much easier.
We all know where Ken Levine went: nowhere. After Bioshock Infinite he got the fuck out because he was tired of taking compromises and cutting shits from games, and he's just one of many that actually prefers small/medium size teams. The heads of Obsidian said the same for The Outer Worlds.
So that's why, again, I don't trust MS in what they are doing as I don't trust almost anyone else but Sony, especially with this Gamepass. On the other hand I'm fine with AA titles: Prey and Dishonored 2 are AA titles, Dark Souls basically was one, it's a sweet spot that can do magic, so unless MS doesn't want to simply release group of average games but actually use the focus of smaller teams than I'm happy.
Golden rule: with less you do more.
I'm personally more concern about the lack of linear dudebro corridor shooters, PS360 era was the shit for real, I want to blow stuff up, now walking around for miles in all those open-world walking sims, and neither MS nor Sony provided me any of that, maybe except Gears 4/5 in which I have no interest. Or any 3rd party for the matter, with BF going all the way downhill, and CoD being willed with retarded exo-skeletons and monkey-like jumping all over the place. The Division and Titanfall 2 are the only shooters I remember from this gen, I cannot recall anything else that had guns in it and sucked me for longer than 2-3h, like Doom for example. And with the rise of SSD I fear that I'll get even more open-world games, with even larger worlds a.k.a. even more walking, and that's simply not my cup of tea, I don't have time for that bullshit.
I don't miss dudebro corridor shooters at all, at least not the standard ones. At the very least I need Bulleststorm, Titan Fall 2 saw me sleep after 3 hours because the story, the art style and the I.A. were so bland I couldn't play it for long. However, Doom Eternal...
But try Wolfenstein.
Yeah well this is pretty in line with my internal thoughts. I don't want more open worlds and especially not bigger ones, full of filler. Give me Syndicate, Max Payne 3, Revengeance, 50cent: Blood on Sand, CoJ: The Cartel, Crysis 2, etc... Oh and fucking Black Ops, why the fuck cannot be good anymore. Also Bad Company, semi open world game still can be fun. I sure wish I could stay entertained in AC: Oddysey, but I just could not do it. Only Open World which I thoroughly enjoyed this game, was...suprisingly 2 Watch_dogs games.
Some really good classics there. Syndacate is very underrated, but immersive sims and stuff never got enough attention and sales. Also too bad StarBreeze went for other things, Riddick and The Darkness were interesting as well.
Max Payne 3 is Rockstar version of Max Payne, so it's different and similar at the same time. Good times for sure.
Crysis 2 is one of the best shooter of its generation, with one of the best single players but I also liked a lot the multiplayer.
Bad Company was a very good start for the series, Bad Company 2 felt more linear and simplistic, didn't like it as much. At the time, 60 fps, very good graphics, big maps, destructible scenarios, crazy audio, big multiplayer... it was next gen.
 
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DaGwaphics

Member
He says that these type of high-quality AA games (that you can finish in 10-15h) fit perfectly in between their AAA releases.

Ssshhh... certain groups don't want the context, just the soundbite .


As much as I know it does not fit the notion of this forum that only AAA matters, what I find truly tragic this gen, is death of AA games. Only AAA or indie shovelware. Not much in between, I hope that next-gen we see games more in the line of X360/PS3 gen.

+ 1, 000 We've settled into a pattern of endless sequels and movies with mild interactivity sold as games. We need the AAs back.
 

Gamernyc78

Banned
Fun facts:

In August last year, Sony purchased Insomniac Games, developer of the PS4-exclusive Spider-Man. That game has been the most successful superhero game of all time, selling 13 million copies. ... According to an SECC filing by Sony they paid $229 Million, mostly in cash, for the studio. That's a bit of a bargain.


Go Big, or Go GamePass.

And I "pass" on that literally. Give me those big production, graphically retina melting, story driven games any day. Or those lush, open world RPG action games like Horizon. Those big budgets show in the finer details, production values, and so forth. I don't want no trash state of decay or mediocre recore type game.
 
And I "pass" on that literally. Give me those big production, graphically retina melting, story driven games any day. Or those lush, open world RPG action games like Horizon. Those big budgets show in the finer details, production values, and so forth. I don't want no trash state of decay or mediocre recore type game.
If I had to be honest I found Spiderman pretty average, swing swing aside. Very simple and standard design.
At this point talent takes over money, Miyazaki changed the industry with two pennies. It's very easy to use UE or Unity with PC hardware to make good games at this point.
I want some AAA too, but I'd rather prefer that a lot of teams could scale back and think before acting.
 

JägerSeNNA

Banned
And I "pass" on that literally. Give me those big production, graphically retina melting, story driven games any day. Or those lush, open world RPG action games like Horizon. Those big budgets show in the finer details, production values, and so forth. I don't want no trash state of decay or mediocre recore type game.
Recore is one of the most fun game in this gen. I hope we can get a sequel. I liked recore much more than HZD if I need to b honest.
 

Fake

Member
San Diego is also fairly small, iirc? What they pulled off with Days Gone is impressive for a studio their size.
I kinda impress what they could archieve with such a small group. In the other hand Days Gone got compromisse with bugs and crash, with for me was a let down.
Sony should hire more people for his studio at least for solve those bugs.
 

Gamernyc78

Banned
If I had to be honest I found Spiderman pretty average, swing swing aside. Very simple and standard design.
At this point talent takes over money, Miyazaki changed the industry with two pennies. It's very easy to use UE or Unity with PC hardware to make good games at this point.
I want some AAA too, but I'd rather prefer that a lot of teams could scale back and think before acting.

Scaling back does not equal better production or better games. Thinking and talent of course is one of the most important aspects of a game. I can count on one hand the amount of indie or lower budget first party or 3rd party games I enjoyed compared to the AAA high production games I enjoy. We can just look to meta averages to see that consensus. Fun, skill, talent, good game development is not exclusive to the budget of a game but when your spending money, acquiring all the right pieces and going all out it shows at least in Sony's case. I thoroughly enjoyed a lower budget indie type game like say Journey or hotline miami but those are far and few and we get more of the recore mediocrity, state of decay 2, etc. My top games of this gen for instance are Bloodborne, Horizon Zero Dawn, Days Gone, Nioh, Spiderman (which unlike you i loved) , and a few others.

Idk maybe it's because Sony gives their devs space and wiggle room according to them but thy produce some of the finest top tier games and if tlou, Horizon, etc were of a lower budget I could see how the production values would take a big hit and I don't want that. I'm glad Sony doesn't cannabalized their sales via gamepass and puts their top games on it only a year or two later. Get tht sales money and go all out on the sequel. Rest assured tlou 2 will be another master piece.
 

Gamernyc78

Banned
Recore is one of the most fun game in this gen. I hope we can get a sequel. I liked recore much more than HZD if I need to b honest.

Thts fine and game experiences and fun factor are subjective, not production value. Recore meta is in the 60s so alot more ppl didnt fancy it like you did. I'm glad you enjoyed it. I think Horizon Zero Dawn so far is the best open world game created and I thought Botw was bland and empty. I also dropped Witcher 3 and RDR 2 which had huge budgets after three hours because I thought Witcher had trash combat and RDR 2 was clunky and boring. There are always outliers so thts not my point.

Hey like what you like and budgets don't make a fun game, the ppl behind them do but I enjoy my AAA big budget, Sony quality games over most indie, smaller titles, that's just me.
 
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Scaling back does not equal better production or better games. Thinking and talent of course is one of the most important aspects of a game. I can count on one hand the amount of indie or lower budget first party or 3rd party games I enjoyed compared to the AAA high production games I enjoy. We can just look to meta averages to see that consensus. Fun, skill, talent, good game development is not exclusive to the budget of a game but when your spending money, acquiring all the right pieces and going all out it shows at least in Sony's case. I thoroughly enjoyed a lower budget indie type game like say Journey or hotline miami but those are far and few and we get more of the recore mediocrity, state of decay 2, etc. My top games of this gen for instance are Bloodborne, Horizon Zero Dawn, Days Gone, Nioh, Spiderman (which unlike you i loved) , and a few others.

Idk maybe it's because Sony gives their devs space and wiggle room according to them but thy produce some of the finest top tier games and if tlou, Horizon, etc were of a lower budget I could see how the production values would take a big hit and I don't want that. I'm glad Sony doesn't cannabalized their sales via gamepass and puts their top games on it only a year or two later. Get tht sales money and go all out on the sequel. Rest assured tlou 2 will be another master piece.
I never said scaling back= good games lol
I already specified what I meant: big teams seems more and more historically difficult to manage. Evidently, picking all the right pieces, making all the right decisions and respect timelines isn't possible for a lot of big teams at this point. I respect Sony because is the exception, but apparently I can't pretend that also others reaches that level, so I would prefer less big ass games and more consistent choices of desing. To me is the exact contrary than yours: this gen at least I enjoyed more smaller games than bigger ones.
But anyway Bloodborne and especially Nioh I think aren't that big at all, at least compared to Spiderman of GoW. Days Gone didn't have a big team behind it seems, they got the budget to go on for 6 years and that's good, problem is: if you are not a big team, usually you don't get big budgets.
Having 10x the budget should lead to a game 10x better or so (example), but it's clear that we surpassed a line where the scaling of the quality is less and less important the more you increase resources, to the point that you actually decrease the quality lol
Sony doesn't need to do this, but others do in my opinion.
 
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Zzpaff

Member
Gamepass is bread for today and hunger for tomorrow, now they will put all the meat on the grill, to win diners and progressively everything will be based on quantity to the detriment of quality, seasoned from time to time with something of quality, why spend 200 million if with 20, I already have your 9 euros a month, they want to be Netflix and just like Netflix we will have to remove trash until we find something decent.
 

Deto

Banned
LOL...I am not saying that, but we know about games like Halo Infinite, AoE4, Forza and FH that are all AAA games, Hellblade I still consider a solid AA game. So M Booty comment is obviously not 100% accurate. Just saying that, as that twitter person said, it is naive to believe that there will be no AAA games from MGS.

In addition, don't forget about this;


Lots of developers from big publishers were hired by the Initiative



Oh almost forgot...full interview with M Booty;


He says that these type of high-quality AA games (that you can finish in 10-15h) fit perfectly in between their AAA releases.



Hellblade is AA, SoD is AA, AoE is AAA game, I have spent 100s of hours playing AoE (but I love RTS).




Look at the curriculum, all freelancers

Xbox Game Studios 'The Initiative' talks 'staying small, staying agile'



all new studios gonna make AA, Indies, filler for gamepass.

AAA?

Halo "5h" 5, like AA
Gears
Forza.
 
Gamepass is bread for today and hunger for tomorrow, now they will put all the meat on the grill, to win diners and progressively everything will be based on quantity to the detriment of quality, seasoned from time to time with something of quality, why spend 200 million if with 20, I already have your 9 euros a month, they want to be Netflix and just like Netflix we will have to remove trash until we find something decent.
I don't think it will go like this, but if so then I will finally move to PC to at least play some experimental/indipendent stuff, otherwise I will likely play far, far less.
 

pasterpl

Member
Look at the curriculum, all freelancers

Xbox Game Studios 'The Initiative' talks 'staying small, staying agile'



all new studios gonna make AA, Indies, filler for gamepass.

AAA?

Halo "5h" 5, like AA
Gears
Forza.

Article you shared is from March 2019, but then in Dec 2019;


  • The studio is working on a "AAAA" project.

PlayGround is also saying that they are working on "AAA" action RPG.

Remember XBSEX will be "the most powerful" next-gen console and it is very foolish to assume that with all that studio acquisition there will be no AAA games. It is obvious that some of these studios will be tasked with producing AA/Indie games for GamePass updates, but there are others that will be working on AAA system sellers.

I am not a fanboy but I get very annoyed when people throw sh*t around and trying to create narratives that are matching their preferences.
 

Gamernyc78

Banned
I kinda impress what they could archieve with such a small group. In the other hand Days Gone got compromisse with bugs and crash, with for me was a let down.
Sony should hire more people for his studio at least for solve those bugs.

I was thoroughly impressed with the scale, graphics and dynamic weather/ Al which frankly was a step up from any other open world game I played. The al did stuff I never expected.

Bugs aside Days Gone is one of my games of this gen and idk maybe it was updates but I experienced maybe three to four minor bugs in my play through.
 

Deto

Banned
Article you shared is from March 2019, but then in Dec 2019;




PlayGround is also saying that they are working on "AAA" action RPG.

Remember XBSEX will be "the most powerful" next-gen console and it is very foolish to assume that with all that studio acquisition there will be no AAA games. It is obvious that some of these studios will be tasked with producing AA/Indie games for GamePass updates, but there are others that will be working on AAA system sellers.

I am not a fanboy but I get very annoyed when people throw sh*t around and trying to create narratives that are matching their preferences.

Of course, ONLY ONE hired employee guarantees that it is AAAA
 
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Fake

Member
I was thoroughly impressed with the scale, graphics and dynamic weather/ Al which frankly was a step up from any other open world game I played. The al did stuff I never expected.

Bugs aside Days Gone is one of my games of this gen and idk maybe it was updates but I experienced maybe three to four minor bugs in my play through.

I agree, but get really dissapointed by the amount of bug. Get me by surprise. Days Gone even turn off my PS4.

I don't expect this type of quality from Sony studio. Was really embarrassing.
I want the sequel, but not this kind of quality.
 

Dabaus

Banned
With both sony and Microsoft putting out statements about software possibly being delayed i think some (all?) next gen software could be delayed. Id say this would hurt Microsoft more since they were banking hard on halo infinite reviving the xbox brand at launch. Id say sony would slightly ahead only because of backwards compatibility (Assuming it works lol) and strong games line up this year. Assuming the systems themselves dont get delayed.
 
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