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[wowbaggerBR]

It's variable because it makes no sense to have them not variable. The clocks are based on the workload. PS5 does not throttle down the clockspeed based on core temps. That's what normal boost modes do on PC. Why would you have fixed clock speeds? What if you're running an indie game that doesn't require such high clock speeds?

Every GPU & CPU has variable clock speeds, to have a fixed clock speed seems stupid IMO and judging by the way it's worded from DF, sounds purely reactionary to what Sony had in the pipeline.

Sure, the workload wont affect thermal output when you'll be running Horizon Zero Dawn 2 the GPU will stay at 2,2 GHz all the time it'll be needed because reasons and won't throttle back to cool itself. Sure.

 

[TLZ]

I wonder what the extra space on the slide in bc is for

I was waiting for that PS1-PS3 bomb

I'm still hoping it comes later.

 

[Fake]

He's alive?????

Yeap. He's back.

Back to the topic, I find so bullshit Cerny saying about testing 'top 100' games played on PS4. Probably Call of Duty, Fortnine, and all those online games I really don't care much.
BTW, ARK is one of the top 7 games popular on Brasil if someone is curious.
Man... What a mess.

 

[Fun Fanboy]

What tells me about Kleegamefan, O'dium and OsirisBlack and their stated numbers is that MAYBE the dev kits of PS5 were more than 12 TeraFlops, that's the only explanation of why they were saying nmbers that were really off the mark with 10.3 TFs to be honest with you guys.

Maybe the PS5's dev kits were more powerful than XSX, because this is what Klee even said, he said that these are dev kit numbers, retail might change.

I posted something like this one time. I'd have to find it. Said that it would be funny if they were giving out dev kit flops and thinking they were final retail flops.

 

[Reindeer]

It's variable because it makes no sense to have them not variable.

Lol what?? Now I've heard it all.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

I think it's obvious Sony is stuck with a design intended for 2019. It would have been a beast during the holiday 2019 season. It will hold it's own up-clocked,. It's good enough until the pro arrives.

That's what many people suspected. Those old ass Oberon leaks held up and they first came out a year ago.

But the silver lining was if Sony had enough time to do a mass overhaul and up the ante for a 2020 release. By the looks of it they upped the gpu clock 10% and probably spent a lot of time making a custom SSD at a huge 5.5 gb/s speed.

 

[CJY]

Lol what?? Now I've heard it all.

Why would you want a GPU or CPU running full-tilt all of the time?

 

[ruvikx]

But I have little sympathy for those on the 13-15 TF hype train who got taken in. They refused to hear anything or accept any insiders that didn't paint the PS5 as superior. The better the PS specs anyone claimed the the more credence they gave them. They refused to hear ANYTHING about GitHub and harassed the hell out of anyone that claimed Oberon was the PS5

Console discussions have been seriously unenjoyable since the new year. The entire GitHub leak was immediately trashed (including insults aimed at digital foundry for repeating it), with the theory whereby "backwards compatibility mode" was being tested & ray tracing was going to send it way higher in the flops count (certainly enough to hit the magic 12 number). Add the RDNA2 reveal a few weeks ago which gave people the impression the ps5 was a "beast" & the most hardcore fanboys went full militant mode (insofar as anything which was deemed negative against the playstation 5 was viewed as literal hate propaganda).

Now here we are, with a console reveal which looks like a typical product created by a company targeting the magic "power/cost/profit" result. It's just some fanboys don't like to know their favorite toy company actually wants to make money out of them. Otherwise both Microsoft & Sony would just say "f*ck it" & drop a 25 teraflop console on the market at $399 if they didn't care about profits.

 

[SonGoku]

Welcome back SonGoku

Thank you and everyone for giving me such nice welcome messages

 

[Ptarmiganx2]

I don't think we are going to see any difference in resolution between the machines. Maybe a few frame rate issues, but what are we looking at 7-10 fps max?

 

[Bladed Thesis]

I honestly think they are more disappointed in the way it was delivered today.

If anyone wants to simply use TFs to measure a consoles success here again they are just fan boys looking to poke people.

I get it that some people are not so familiar with dry technical talk and now they are disappointed but we have to keep in mind that this was a GDC presentation and not a PlayStation Meeting.

This shouldn't have been the first reveal of console details then. They shouldn't have teased "PS5 news tomorrow" if the intent was to be strictly technical and basically go over 99% of their audiences' head when they know their consumers have been dealing with months of silence.

That's tonedeaf PR.

 

[mouchete]

It would have come across better if they just dropped specs in a article and had uploaded a short tech demo/gameplay showing performance and custom SSD usage.

Also this PS4 backward compatibility is a mess, not clear at all. From the way I interpret it, they will have almost 100 of the 'most popular' games available at launch only, with more to follow. People defiantly got blindsided, conversations were all about PS1-3 compatibility, when in reality it may only have a fraction of ps4 games available at launch.

 

[SonGoku]

I don't think we are going to see any difference in resolution between the machines. Maybe a few frame rate issues, but what are we looking at 7-10 fps max?

I think resolution differences and slight fps boost for xbox

 

[Reindeer]

Why would you want a GPU or CPU running full-tilt all of the time?

Because Stability

 

[Zero707]

Welcome back SonGoku

Everyone else in here, a reminder to keep it civil and dial it back on the insults, and don’t take personal offense for criticisms towards your favorite brands.

good now bail out Bo_Hazem

 

[Bladed Thesis]

PS5 has amazing specs, what's wrong in being excited for a developer friendly machine? There's no need to be so mad about that.

Now they're the developer friendly brand? Because Nintendo and Microsoft aren't?

 

[Thedtrain]

I don't think we are going to see any difference in resolution between the machines. Maybe a few frame rate issues, but what are we looking at 7-10 fps max?

I think we’ll see res differences to maintain frame rates

 

[hemo memo]

He didn't mess up anything.

Marketing and decision makers did badly. Who the hell thought this was a good strategy? How a bunch of people who get paid a fortune thought this was a good idea? Truly baffling.

 

[Reindeer]

I don't think we are going to see any difference in resolution between the machines. Maybe a few frame rate issues, but what are we looking at 7-10 fps max?

You are more likely to see resolution difference than you are to see FPS difference. Look at any two GPUs with 2 tflop difference and you will always see difference in resolution.

 

[Investor9872]

People say $100 isn't a lot of money. Tell that to all the working parents out there when they're choosing which console to buy at Christmas time for little jimmy.

The $100 isn't a lot to me, but it's the difference between me buying a PS5 + an Xbox SX, or just a PS5. If they're priced the same, chances are high I would buy both. No way I'm buying a secondary console that's more expensive that my primary one.

Jimmy doesn't need a $500 or $600 system. You get that one for yourself, and pass the old PS4, not the PS4 pro, to Jimmy.

 

[Karuyag]

Grats to MS on the spec win. Now all they need is the software win.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

It would have come across better if they just dropped specs in a article and had uploaded a short tech demo/gameplay showing performance and custom SSD usage.

Also this PS4 backward compatibility is a mess, not clear at all. From the way I interpret it, they will have almost 100 of the 'most popular' games available at launch only, with more to follow. People defiantly got blindsided, conversations were all about PS1-3 compatibility, when in reality it may only have a fraction of ps4 games available at launch.

That was another rumour that had zero facts.

It was common sense PS4 would have BC, just like SeX has BC, but for PS5 to stretch out to have PS1-PS3 built in too was a dream.

Likely another insider BS rumour that originated somewhere.

 

[SonGoku]

SonGoku check the second post of this thread. I guess you will keep up just by there.

Nice and thanks for the save Imtjnotu

 

[CJY]

Because Stability

Stability of what? The game? You really think that the stability of a game engine would be impacted or even affected by a chip switching clocks at the rate of nanoseconds? Or whether that is even humanly perceptible? You must trolling.

If you're talking about system stability, the same logic applies. I'm not saying Xbox SX doesn't have more GPU power. I'm saying fixed clock speeds don't make sense and my guess is that Xbox SX's GPU is capable of downclocking, but they chose to say fixed as a marketing gimmick only.

 

[Maxwell House]

Exactly as I was saying before. Those custom chips are super interesting and seem to be doing a lot of the heavy lifting.

He was only talking about the speed differences of the ssds, not the consoles overall. He says XSeX’s CPU/GPU is more powerful.

 

[Wandering Leopard]

I think resolution differences and slight fps boost for xbox

I'm guessing the most common resolutions for both should be:
4k 30fps
Or
4k checkerboard 60fps.
Or
4k unlocked

 

[PSX]

Either you'er getting PS5 or XSX its going to be exciting year! I hope you all have a good rest of the night and wash your paws, Be safe!

 

[VanSiriusGabriel]

Microsoft releases a new console a year later, as they did with the One X. So what then?

And no mid gen refresh will fix this, since the Pro woud have to run games made for the PS5. One X and PS4 Pro are extremely under tapped because of this.

There is no case of a huge bottleneck like the CPU this time. PS5 will not held back anything, the sole idea that PS5 could held back a 20% more powerful console like SeX or even a Pro is silly, if the hardware is functionally the same you just need scaling.

 

[Md Ray]

Most Exciting Console In 20 Years? Give me a break.

It is indeed most exciting. The SSD alone is a game changer. Couple that with extremely potent CPU. We'll see a radical shift in game design and other areas we've never seen before, or thought possible. More or less the games have kind of looked the same since PS3 but with prettier graphics. This is about to change completely. SSD isn't just there for quick loading times. It is bringing a huge shift in many other areas.

 

[ph33rknot]

Kind of boring now everyone took their ball and went home

 

[Null_Key]

I was waiting for that PS1-PS3 bomb

I'm still hoping it comes later.

I think it will happen, they may have not said anything until BC for PS4 is 100 percent right. No point in over committing if they can't deliver it in time. Not sure if PS3 will happen but currently the specs should be able to support it.

Mark Cerny is as usual delivers in his speech, but the new ceo ryan comes off as incompetent, Sony need to bring back Andrew House or get Shu promoted.

 

[Roronoa Zoro]

I believe Sony’s 1st party will do wonders with 10 tflops. Gorgeous looking games. I mean, look at what they did with the PS4. No need to worry guys.

And an SSD and much improved ram and new sound

 

[Gavin Stevens]

With regards to memory, as I still haven’t caught up yet.

Was that 16gb total? 16gb+X for os? 16gb and then a little of that reserves for os? And Is the full 16gb own set speed?

Cheers ears.

This is important, because people are already getting the “SX only has 10gb” bits wrong, and don’t understand why 10@gddr6 and 3.5@gddr4 is totally fine and makes sense.

I saw one post in here say it’s 16gb for ps5 vs 10 for sx, which isn’t true.

 

[it_wasn't_me]

Best case it's a 15% difference. They already said that that is practically boost mode, and it won't always run at that level... So probably most of the time 9.2 just like Github, that's a 30% difference.

Yeah....no. Boost mode can be on all the time.

 

[Fdkenzo]

From the other forum
“ XSX vs PS5 specs break down as...
CPU: 3.6GHz vs 3.5Ghz 8C/16T Zen 2 (Xbox wins +3%)
GPU: 52CU@1.825Ghz vs 36CU@2.235Ghz RDNA2 GPU (Xbox wins +17% shading and RT but PS5 wins +20% rasterisation)
RAM: 10GB@560GB/sec + 6GB@330GB/sec vs 16GB@448GB/sec (Xbox wins ~20-25% more bandwidth, total amount is a tie)
SSD: 1TB@2.5GB/sec vs 825GB@5.5GB/sec (PS5 wins speed +110%, Xbox wins capacity)

The consoles are within spitting distance of each other. Everyone who said they were both super close, and way more close than any of the consoles this generation, were right.”

 

[Md Ray]

Apologies if this has been posted already.

 

[IllegalLemon]

It's 12.15

So 18% then. It's not like 2 percentage points are going to make a huge difference but if you put it that way, let's raise that slightly to 18%. Happy?

 

[Reindeer]

Stability of what? The game? You really think that the stability of a game engine would be impacted or even affected by a chip switching clocks at the rate of nanoseconds? Or whether that is even humanly perceptible? You must trolling.

I'm trolling? Go and read Eurogamer article on this, they clearly explain that those clocks on CPU and GPU will not be maintainable and will depend on variety of factors. Now put that against Series X that can have set target performance and maintain it all the time. You obviously talking without any technical knowledge on this and just making your own assumptions.

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

I think Gavin Stevens , @OsirisBlack, @BGs and probably some I'm forgetting were legit and honest and just maybe got some bad info or miscommunication and @HeisenbergFX4's SIE source was pretty much on the money with 10.5 for the PS5 with the XsX having the power advantage.

@Tommy Fisher I have NO respect for. He is either an attention whore trolling everyone or a Microsoft astroturfer deliberately conning PS fans - neither scenario is acceptable to me.

But I have little sympathy for those on the 13-15 TF hype train who got taken in. They refused to hear anything or accept any insiders that didn't paint the PS5 as superior. The better the PS specs anyone claimed the the more credence they gave them. They refused to hear ANYTHING about GitHub and harassed the hell out of anyone that claimed Oberon was the PS5

I forgot Heisenberg had a SIE source that said 10.5TF. Yeah, that would've pegged them very close then but I can understand the reservation in rolling with that given the climate at the time.

Tommy is such a weird one. If anything I would say they had a MS inside contact but that's assuming they didn't just piggyback off other rumors. Mixing in the now definitely fake PS5 rumors kinda does feel more like a ruse against PS fans. Brass balls, but maybe tasteless. Still tho I give them credit for putting the 1.82 GHz clock out there because even the Github stuff did not have that clock.

Hopefully this whole circus will get people who were just 100% anti-Github and anti-hard data a wake-up call; NEVER turn away a possible source of info, even if it's not what you personally hope for. The number of people who were using Github to antagonize PS was extremely small, but for those vehemently against giving Github and testing data any consideration, they ONLY focused on the negative trolls who just made up a fraction of all people looking at that information.

There was nothing preventing anyone from giving some kind of equal consideration to both Github/testing data AND insiders, because that was the safest approach to take. And even if the Github and testing data was pretty much correct for both systems in terms of most major specs (and a couple of the insiders too namely Tommy with XSX and Heisenberg with PS5 going by that SIE contact), some of the insiders were still right about other things. They were ALL right about SSD being PS5 > XSX for example. And a lot were still right about some software rumors, dev acquisition rumors, and even some events (IIRC Klee mentioned something about the TGAs a couple days before the XSX reveal there, but don't quote me on that).

 

[Ellery]

In the end looks like everyone was wrong.

I am still amazed at a console running at 2.23GHZ and all the advantages that come with it. Looking at the whole thing I have a feeling that we will get to experience some Mark Cerny magic at the end of the year.

Also holy hell at what clockspeeds are discrete AMD third party PCB graphic cards going to run? If a console can manage 2.23GHZ are we about to see 2.5GHZ out of the box GPUs soon? Give us new cards AMD !

 

[Null_Key]

Why would you want a GPU or CPU running full-tilt all of the time?

In fact alot of the games Sony has does this already, its why God of War makes the PS4 Pro sound like a 747 jet. What Sony is trying to do is make that the norm, but make it practical without performance hit or hit to the lifecycle of the system.

 

[Md Ray]

Now they're the developer friendly brand? Because Nintendo and Microsoft aren't?

Don't put words in my mouth. And pls read my post again.

 

[hemo memo]

From the other forum
“ XSX vs PS5 specs break down as...
CPU: 3.6GHz vs 3.5Ghz 8C/16T Zen 2 (Xbox wins +3%)
GPU: 52CU@1.825Ghz vs 36CU@2.235Ghz RDNA2 GPU (Xbox wins +17% shading and RT but PS5 wins +20% rasterisation)
RAM: 10GB@560GB/sec + 6GB@330GB/sec vs 16GB@448GB/sec (Xbox wins ~20-25% more bandwidth, total amount is a tie)
SSD: 1TB@2.5GB/sec vs 825GB@5.5GB/sec (PS5 wins speed +110%, Xbox wins capacity)

The consoles are within spitting distance of each other. Everyone who said they were both super close, and way more close than any of the consoles this generation, were right.”

If they try harder, PS5 will be more powerful.

 

[Fun Fanboy]

That was a pretty good guess yesterday. But I went too high! The low is right, but I went too high!!!

9.2-10.6

 

[Roronoa Zoro]

From the other forum
“ XSX vs PS5 specs break down as...
CPU: 3.6GHz vs 3.5Ghz 8C/16T Zen 2 (Xbox wins +3%)
GPU: 52CU@1.825Ghz vs 36CU@2.235Ghz RDNA2 GPU (Xbox wins +17% shading and RT but PS5 wins +20% rasterisation)
RAM: 10GB@560GB/sec + 6GB@330GB/sec vs 16GB@448GB/sec (Xbox wins ~20-25% more bandwidth, total amount is a tie)
SSD: 1TB@2.5GB/sec vs 825GB@5.5GB/sec (PS5 wins speed +110%, Xbox wins capacity)

The consoles are within spitting distance of each other. Everyone who said they were both super close, and way more close than any of the consoles this generation, were right.”

Wait but some of the ram on Xbox is slower?

 

[CatLady]

Console discussions have been seriously unenjoyable since the new year. The entire GitHub leak was immediately trashed (including insults aimed at digital foundry for repeating it), with the theory whereby "backwards compatibility mode" was being tested & ray tracing was going to send it way higher in the flops count (certainly enough to hit the magic 12 number). Add the RDNA2 reveal a few weeks ago which gave people the impression the ps5 was a "beast" & the most hardcore fanboys went full militant mode (insofar as anything which was deemed negative against the playstation 5 was viewed as literal hate propaganda).

Now here we are, with a console reveal which looks like a typical product created by a company targeting the magic "power/cost/profit" result. It's just some fanboys don't like to know their favorite toy company actually wants to make money out of them. Otherwise both Microsoft & Sony would just say "f*ck it" & drop a 25 teraflop console on the market at $399 if they didn't care about profits.

OMG, yeah, I totally forgot about the obscene abuse hurled at John D dark10x and Digital Foundry for having the nerve to talk about GitHub, which as we now know was the only legitimate hard data for the PS5. That was absolutely appalling.

Full Disclosure: I admit I didn't really believe the GH leaks were the final PS5 either but I never felt it was a reason to go ballistic on those that did.

 

[Reindeer]

It is indeed most exciting. The SSD alone is a game changer. Couple that with extremely potent CPU. We'll see a radical shift in game design and other areas we've never seen before, or thought possible. More or less the games have kind of looked the same since PS3 but with prettier graphics. This is about to change completely. SSD isn't just there for quick loading times. It is bringing a huge shift in many other areas.

SMH, you must be one of those folks that thinks data streaming at paltry 7GBs is gonna change gaming when GDDR6 operates at 448GBs on PS5. Sure, it will help with minor stuff, but nothing game changing like you think. We all saw how bad Xbox One was with 68GBs GDDR3 and you expecting miracles from 7GBs Virtual Ram.

 

[Shio]

Well, at least Microsoft give us a taste (Demo) of how fast will be the SSD unlike Sony.

So what was that spiderman SSD demo about?

 

[CJY]

I'm trolling? Go and read Eurogamer article on this, they clearly explain that those clocks on CPU and GPU will not be maintainable and will depend on variety of factors. Now put that against Series X that can have set target performance and maintain it all the time. You obviously talking without any technical knowledge on this and just making your own assumptions.

Here's what it says:

So how does boost work in this case? Put simply, the PlayStation 5 is given a set power budget tied to the thermal limits of the cooling assembly. "It's a completely different paradigm," says Cerny. "Rather than running at constant frequency and letting the power vary based on the workload, we run at essentially constant power and let the frequency vary based on the workload."

An internal monitor analyses workloads on both CPU and GPU and adjusts frequencies to match. While it's true that every piece of silicon has slightly different temperature and power characteristics, the monitor bases its determinations on the behaviour of what Cerny calls a 'model SoC' (system on chip) - a standard reference point for every PlayStation 5 that will be produced.

The PlayStation 5 has variable frequencies for CPU and GPU, with an internal monitor adjusting clocks to keep the system within its power budget.
"Rather than look at the actual temperature of the silicon die, we look at the activities that the GPU and CPU are performing and set the frequencies on that basis - which makes everything deterministic and repeatable," Cerny explains in his presentation. "While we're at it, we also use AMD's SmartShift technology and send any unused power from the CPU to the GPU so it can squeeze out a few more pixels."

It's a fascinating idea - and entirely at odds with Microsoft's design decisions for Xbox Series X - and what this likely means is that developers will need to be mindful of potential power consumption spikes that could impact clocks and lower performance. However, for Sony this means that PlayStation 5 can hit GPU frequencies way, way higher than we expected. Those clocks are also significantly higher than anything seen from existing AMD parts in the PC space. It also means that, by extension, more can be extracted performance-wise from the 36 available RDNA 2 compute units.

Nowhere does it say "a variety of factors". Console developers will always need to work within the thermal and computational constraints of a system.

The bottom line is that it's a different approach. One is not better than the other and a "fixed" clock speed doesn't result in more "stability". It's down to the developers at the end of the day.

 

[Deleted member 775630]

Yeah....no. Boost mode can be on all the time.

This "variable frequency" is a marketing trick, you see through this, right? Otherwise they would've just said it's always 2.23Ghz, but because the gap would be too large between the GPU's they decided to come with this variable frequency thing. Which means, if we up the GPU, we get a lower CPU, and vice versa. You can't have both, otherwise they would've done this out of the box.

So each game on PS5 now has to decide if they want to use less CPU or GPU power to match some aspects of the Xbox Series X.