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On paper, the GPU in the Xbox Series X is faster than a GeForce RTX 2080 Super.

I don't doubt the 12 tflops number. I just really have a hard time believing that the gpu itself is close to 2080ti levels of performance.
Why? You're not rationalizing WHY....

The 5700 XT at 9.75 Teraflops on RDNA 1.0 is already in between a 2070 and 2070 Super, this is 2.25 Teraflops more than that and on the updated RDNA 2.0 architecture.

What's puzzling about this?
 
Anyone have links to video of 12 TF pc graphics? I tried to find some on YouTube and I wasn't hugely impressed

That's an odd way to look at it.

Tflops are more about performance .... which can then lead to better graphics, or not. It could just be used for running older games at very high framerates.
 

V4skunk

Banned
Yup. Devs can much much better optimize games for console. So yeah, Xbox is a beast.

I wonder what the price will be. Honestly, looking at the specs it’s worth $1000+
of course it would never be priced like that.
But all pc games use low level api like Mantle and DX12. Consoles don't have any where near the advantage you think with coding to the metal.
 

S0ULZB0URNE

Member

At 12 TFLOPs, the GPU inside the Xbox Series X is a tad faster than Nvidia's GeForce RTX 2080 Super, and just a bit behind a 2080 Ti, currently the best graphics card for gaming.

Here's a rundown of graphics cards from both AMD and Nvidia in terms of TFLOPs:

  • GeForce RTX 2080 Ti (Turing TU102)—13.45 TFLOPs
  • Radeon RX Vega 64 (Vega 10)—12.66 TFLOPs
  • Xbox Series X (Navi - RDNA 2)—12 TFLOPs
  • GeForce RTX 2080 Super (Turing TU104)—11.15 TFLOPs
  • Radeon RX Vega 56 (Vega 10)—10.54 TFLOPs
  • GeForce RTX 2080 (Turing TU104)—10.07 TFLOPs
  • Radeon RX 5700 XT (Navi 10)—9.754 TFLOPs
There are different ways of looking at this. Analyzing just the raw FP32 numbers, the Xbox Series X offers up around 20 percent more graphics power than AMD's Radeon RX 5700 XT. It's also nipping at the heels of the 2080 Ti by 1.45 TFLOPs. Other factors dictate performance too, however, such as the underlying architecture, memory configuration, and so forth.

There probably will not be a direct equivalent on the PC. However, it's a safe assumption that we will see both slower and faster variants in graphics card form. Given what Microsoft has just revealed, there is every reason to believe that upcoming Navi cards will be equal to and potentially faster than Nvidia's current top offering in the consumer space. At least until Nvidia rolls out its next-gen cards as well (Ampere).






XSX should be much higher than the X in those graphs.
 

HolyTruth

Banned


Agreed. PS5 for exclusives. PC for Xbox and PC only games.


MS bought a lot of studios. There will be much more exclusive games nextgen.

Now, tell me: what games have been announced for PS5? So far a single one: godfall, which comes to PC.

Secondly, most PS games come to PC too now, look at horizon etc.

Also, again, most people DO NOT buy a console for exclusive games. Maybe the minority, a few hardcore gamers, but most gamers are buying a console to play Multiplatform games on the best platform with the best price possible.

FIFA, CoD etc. This is what sells consoles. That’s why Sony won, their console cost $100 LESS and had BETTER graphics for third party games.
 
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what is AMD's market share for CPUs at the moment? as far as I knowbtzey have been shitting on Intel for at least a year now with all of their current Ryzen lineup completely obliterating Intel.

and for their professional CPU lineup they also at least destroy Intel in terms of performance for price.

According to Techradar, it's currently at 18%. So while not great, it is the best they have had since the days of the Athlon.

Neither the PS5 or XBSX is going to make AMD a ton of money or turn AMD's GPU and CPU marketshare around, but it helps ease the pain.

The problem with AMD on the gpu side is that Nvidia, unlike Intel, currently haven't been overly lazy and are on fighting a somewhat lop-sided single front. AMD is fighting on two fronts and currently are focused, in both R&D spending and manpower, on the CPU front, since they can get higher margins.
 
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sendit

Member
MS bought a lot of studios. There will be much more exclusive games nextgen.

Now, tell me: what games have been announced for PS5? So far a single one: godfall, which comes to PC.

Secondly, most PS games come to PC too now, look at horizon etc.

Also, again, most people DO NOT buy a console for exclusive games. Maybe the minority, a few hardcore gamers, but most gamers are buying a console to play Multiplatform games on the best platform with the best price possible.

FIFA, CoD etc. This is what sells consoles. That’s why Sony won, their console cost $100 LESS and had BETTER graphics for third party games.

Disagree. Xbox exclusives will be made available day 1 on PC. The moment Sony does the same (day 1 release on PC), my reason to own a Playstation will be non-existent.
 

HolyTruth

Banned
Disagree. Xbox exclusives will be made available day 1 on PC. The moment Sony does the same (day 1 release on PC), my reason to own a Playstation will be non-existent.

Again, you are the minority. Only a few people buy a console because of their exclusive games.

Why else do you think Sony now releases their games on PC? Why else we didn’t saw any PS4 exclusive game in the yearly top 10 of France and Germany? CoD and FIFA sold much more units and thus more consoles.

Also, tell me, what Great exclusive have been announced for PS5 launch? :D
for PS4 the first two years it was basically nothing great available
 

RPS37

Member
So yeah...my $2k laptop has a 2070 and can run basically anything so I guess I’m getting a SeX to play Cp2077 and Halo.
 
Anyone have links to video of 12 TF pc graphics? I tried to find some on YouTube and I wasn't hugely impressed
If you aren't impressed, next gen games will be even more unimpressive. Best hardware still is in Nvidia's ballpark, and will only get better with the 3xxx gen in June.
 

Barakov

Gold Member
So yeah...my $2k laptop has a 2070 and can run basically anything so I guess I’m getting a SeX to play Cp2077 and Halo.

NVd1ZOy.gif
 

Moomalade74

Banned
I have it on good authority the XSX capabilities are about on par with a 2080ti. I'm not a tech person, so don't personally understand how to interpret this info in relation to the announced specs.
 
AMD are expected to spill the beans about RDNA2 arch in March 5th. After that we should know what architectural gains will the RDNA2 bring to the table. If I'm not mistaken, the RDNA1 was suppose to be some kind of RDNA/GCN hybrind and not the real next gen RDNA architecture. So gains could potentially be significant.
 

abcdrstuv

Banned
That's an odd way to look at it.

Tflops are more about performance .... which can then lead to better graphics, or not. It could just be used for running older games at very high framerates.

So like, Assassin's Creed Odyssey on max settings on a 2080ti isn't indicative of the quality of next-gen graphics?
 

kraspkibble

Permabanned.
true. now imagine if it released today and not at the end of the year by which then we will have new more powerful Nvidia + AMD gpus.

anyway, the CPU will still likely be a huge bottleneck. lol ... a 12TF gpu running with a weak low powered CPU? hahaha.

"BuT iTz ZeN2 !!!11!!"

and? doesn't mean it's the same performance as a 3600, 3700X, 3800X, 3900X, or 3950X. they just share the same architecture.

OH...

and it'll be inside a tiny case with shit airflow so if the CPU doesn't bottleneck it then it will thermal throttle.
 
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Caffeine

Member
imagine being stronger than a gpu from sept 2018 in november 2020, and 3080 has a fall release most likely as well.
 

Ellery

Member
Remember that this is the based on having the card run at 1815MHZ which is the MHZ they give you in the specs. Even out of the box without changing anything the cards run much higher.
Very commong to see 2080 cards hit 2000MHZ without overclocking (mine included).

I think my non-Super 2080 runs at around 12.3 Teraflops, but like others pointed out it is a flawed comparison becuse AMD isn't Nvidia.

Maybe RDNA2 will have architectural improvements which make it faster. Hard to tell yet. I am excited for more information from AMD regarding the newer cards that come out this year (and of course their RayTracing solution). I am a huge fan of RayTracing having experienced it in Metro Exodus and Control on my PC and especially the reflections in windows are amazing.

One thing I am very much looking forward to when Naughty Dog and other PS first party studios are going to optimize for the RayTracing solution that is in the PS5 and how that is going to look. So far the RTX implementations we have seen in games were more like added on instead of being inclunded in the fundamental process of creating a game. Something that solely exclusive Next Gen games are going to do. Very excited for this.
 

Jigga117

Member
true. now imagine if it released today and not at the end of the year by which then we will have new more powerful Nvidia + AMD gpus.

anyway, the CPU will still likely be a huge bottleneck. lol ... a 12TF gpu running with a weak low powered CPU? hahaha.

"BuT iTz ZeN2 !!!11!!"

and? doesn't mean it's the same performance as a 3600, 3700X, 3800X, 3900X, or 3950X. they just share the same us architecture.

OH...

and it'll be inside a tiny case with shit airflow so if the CPU doesn't bottleneck it then it will thermal throttle.

Wow, that’s some gymnastics triggered Nastrodamus shit over an announcement of just some of the specs.
 

HolyTruth

Banned
and it'll be inside a tiny case with shit airflow so if the CPU doesn't bottleneck it then it will thermal throttle.
Tiny? I thought series X is huge af?
AlsoC don’t forget that series X is a CLOSED and FIXED system. Devs can perfectly optimize their games for it. Also with the fast af SSD etc.
 

Jigga117

Member
The benefit that gamers are going to see on these new consoles have already gotten of taste of how fast load times happen on PC with SSD. Take Division 2 for example. On PS4 and XBO it can take up to 30-50 seconds from the White House to any part of the map for fast travel. PC SSD version for that same fast travel has been 3-5 seconds.
 
Do some people realize that you can't really compare full fledged HEDT GPU's to consoles? If you were able to stick a 2080 TI chip, into a console, it doesn't suddenly make it on par with a desktop variant.(Although it would probably fall in line with the Max Q mobile chips, instead of the full fledged desktop card with blower or liquid cooled). There are boost clocks, thermal dissipation, POWER requirements, etc. 12TF doesn't suddenly mean rtx 2080S performance. There needs to be taken in account what I previously mentioned, plus how well the laptop ryzen cpu chip can perform. This will be like a 25 watt cpu, and i would guess around 175 watt gpu. You won't get "sustained boost clocks" or any boost to begin with, when limited by a power supply. Unlike on pc, which doesn't have these constraints and limitations.

I do hope that these consoles are at least somewhat powerful, so that the lowest common denominator, doesn't hold back PC games this generation.
 
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alucard0712_rus

Gold Member
LOL. No. PC gaming is a clusterfuck. A lot of driver issues. Unoptimized Games. Denuvo. It sucks.
It's a joke?
I'm on Intel/Nvidia - 8700k, 2070s, 32gb ram, SSD .
Zero problems. Games I've played all runs MUCH better.

RDR2 - 50-80fps
Sekiro ~ 120fps
KCD ~ 40-80fps
Star Citizen - 35-90fps...etc.

All this in 1440p with Free-sync and in 5-litre case that looks like this. (you can put 1080ti or 2070s here)

DYXfD-KUMAAa0KI.jpg


Tell me if it worse than on consoles lol.
 

Jigga117

Member
It's a joke?
I'm on Intel/Nvidia - 8700k, 2070s, 32gb ram, SSD .
Zero problems. Games I've played all runs MUCH better.

RDR2 - 50-80fps
Sekiro ~ 120fps
KCD ~ 40-80fps
Star Citizen - 35-90fps...etc.

All this in 1440p with Free-sync and in 5-litre case that looks like this. (you can put 1080ti or 2070s here)

DYXfD-KUMAAa0KI.jpg


Tell me if it worse than on consoles lol.

This whole post didn’t disprove what he just said. Details on RD2 like you said 50-80fps. What do you have to set to get that and we all know it is t maxed out for the settings.

I know this because I have a 9900k 2080ti EVO 970s OLED C9 55” with GSYNC and based on game to game sacrifices have to be made and worked out PER SYSTEM to get the best balance for you to achieve.

Making blanket statements that they just run better is bs. You have to lower specs for it to run better because the option is there to do so because the games are designed to work with multiple configurations.

None of these games are designed for your 2070 or my 2080ti specifically. We just have the option to adjust and get better FPS. But none of us is at max settings with all games at 4K or 1440p
 
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darkinstinct

...lacks reading comprehension.
But all pc games use low level api like Mantle and DX12. Consoles don't have any where near the advantage you think with coding to the metal.
Yes, they do. No PC game today is built for a 2080 Ti. They are built for the mainstream cards and then the additional performance is used to make them look better. It's a brute force approach. A console game built for 12 TF will crush any PC game that can use a 12 TF GPU but is built for 6. The 12 TF are the baseline for Xbox next gen. The 13.5 TF of a 2080 Ti are the maximum of PC gaming (aside from the $2.400 Titan RTX). It's going to be a huge leap forward and anybody who thinks what a 2080 Ti can deliver today will be more than what a XSX can deliver in a year will be proven wrong.
 

Jigga117

Member
Yes, they do. No PC game today is built for a 2080 Ti. They are built for the mainstream cards and then the additional performance is used to make them look better. It's a brute force approach. A console game built for 12 TF will crush any PC game that can use a 12 TF GPU but is built for 6. The 12 TF are the baseline for Xbox next gen. The 13.5 TF of a 2080 Ti are the maximum of PC gaming (aside from the $2.400 Titan RTX). It's going to be a huge leap forward and anybody who thinks what a 2080 Ti can deliver today will be more than what a XSX can deliver in a year will be proven wrong.
 
Yes, they do. No PC game today is built for a 2080 Ti. They are built for the mainstream cards and then the additional performance is used to make them look better. It's a brute force approach. A console game built for 12 TF will crush any PC game that can use a 12 TF GPU but is built for 6. The 12 TF are the baseline for Xbox next gen. The 13.5 TF of a 2080 Ti are the maximum of PC gaming (aside from the $2.400 Titan RTX). It's going to be a huge leap forward and anybody who thinks what a 2080 Ti can deliver today will be more than what a XSX can deliver in a year will be proven wrong.
Games are built with several varying factors at play. Texture resolution size, what effects can or can't be enabled, etc. If there is such thing as lockheart, 12TF will NOT be a baseline. If PS5 has weaker specs than series X, 12TF will not be the baseline. Having to make games for a system that isn't even 2TF, will be the baseline for some time.

With PC gaming, the sky is literally the limit. If someone has a weaker pc than current gen consoles, is he/she excluded from playing current gen games? No, they can just turn the settings down (just about every game for the last few years automatically adjusts settings based on hardware detected anyways). This is a better option than having to buy a whole new gpu/cpu just to play a game. Now let's say you have a 2080/2080S/2080 TI, you'll be able to play every game for next gen, with higher Fidelity, textures, settings, than any console available, till the next-NEXT gen (after xbsx/ps5). Just because of the sheer bandwidth, power from power supply (not limited to 200 watts give or take), better cooling, and running full fledged desktop parts such as desktop class cpu/gpu. Not a laptop style ryzen APU with shared bandwidth, and much lower TDP. It's common sense that current gen parts will be better than next gen consoles. It's always been this way, and always be this way, just from the difference of open and closed systems.

By the way 2080 ti is much higher than 14TF, which is the worst metric to judge a gpu in the pc world in the first place
 
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XSX games should be significantly better than a 2080 Super do to the set development environment they should edge out the ti as well.
Keep in dreaming. Look back at history. Which console was better than a moderate cpu paired with the equivalent gpu on pc? Isn't the xb1x supposedly a rx 480/580? Can you show me where that same gpu DOESN'T desecrate the xb1x? Or the same thing for previous gen? It's sad that people eat up this PR that every console manufacturer spews out ONLY BEFORE the release of a console. Then digital foundry always corrects all the easily influenced people. History repeats itself, as it always will. Until they put in hardware that trumps CURRENT pc specs, it'll always be outdated before it even releases.
 
Xbox X overall put out better games than the 480/580.
I don't recall AMD putting out a single game before... Maybe your confused about something else? How about this. I challenged someone before on this. If a game comes out next gen that can beat my current gpu, you can have it for free. I'll even pay shipping. Now if I win, you owe me NOTHING. Let's see how confident you are on these "claims"


ZIUrQpq.jpg
 

S0ULZB0URNE

Member
I don't recall AMD putting out a single game before... Maybe your confused about something else? How about this. I challenged someone before on this. If a game comes out next gen that can beat my current gpu, you can have it for free. I'll even pay shipping. Now if I win, you owe me NOTHING. Let's see how confident you are on these "claims"


ZIUrQpq.jpg
The same games running on a 480/580 and a similar CPU to the X=X versions running better overall.

Does your build have a single 2080ti? Not OCed?
If so I can see games running as good if not better on XSX.
 
The same games running on a 480/580 and a similar CPU to the X=X versions running better overall.

Does your build have a single 2080ti? Not OCed?
If so I can see games running as good if not better on XSX.
:messenger_tears_of_joy::messenger_grinning_smiling::messenger_grinning_sweat::messenger_grinning_squinting:Can you show me some examples?! Cause I must have missed this somehow.

I have a single liquid cooled 2080 TI. I have not OC'd it. But, it does auto OC by itself, and by a huge margin.(Native GPU's from both Nvidia and AMD do this automatically because of the environment of pc's). I'm touching 16TF plus, continuous (even though TF numbers don't count). That's just because of the cooling it can provide as well as the power it can receive. But even if I were to limit it to stock frequency, and not auto overclock, it will still beat out every new game for ALL of next gen, just because if the difference in PC architecture. No TDP or power limitations, cooling limitations, cut down chip, etc. So.... You backing out from that bet, or not? You have absolutely NOTHING to lose, except your reputation.
 
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