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HawarMiran
Banned
I am from Berlin and I understand him perfectlyDude I'm from germany and it's really hard to understand what you type in here with your abbreviations. It's harder than listening to an Irishman on the phone.
MonkeyPunch
Neo Member
I did not expect them to get worse.This post tells you everything you need to know:
Next-Gen PS5 & XSX |OT| Console tEch threaD
This is tastyyyy I still think this is the best design so far. That and the Black versionwww.neogaf.com
In time people will learn more.
Bonus - no payment required: Tim Dog is also part of that discord. It's where he got his "info".
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
when you are part of a hivemind, things can only get worse. its why those discord channels feel almost incestuous. you want someone to challenge you. discord has basically turned into a safe space.
when did they get the github leaks btw? how comes they were so sure about the ps5 being worse as early as april? komachi didnt get the github leaks until july iirc, but klobrie and others were sure of the 8 tflops number relatively early in the year. this is back when we didnt even know about gcn. they really thought that we would get a 8 tflops gcn console three years after the x1x reveal. how comes?
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
FUD Patrol.
Disco_
Member
Err, no. When Cerny talked about disabling CUs for BC with base ps4 he said butterfly design was the most elegant way to do it;the easiest. It wasn't the only way.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
With all due respect, I got sick of you guys and this so-called NeoGAF forums with all the 9.2TF harassment. I was really considering a golden membership, but I digressed. I heard a lot of down-talking and laughing at REEEEEEE here. So I googled it:
Pushed that, yet again I somehow see freakin NeoGAF in the mix:
Then went in and searched for the speculation thread. Inside the thread I found the amazing poet Colbert along with other civilized members, but what caught my eyes was this post:
Chocolate, Banana, and walnuts. This thread looks more organic and healthy to me. I'm done here, bye.
On second thought, seems like I'm addicted to this thread, and I'm not the vegan.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
I can see both consoles using the same die, with slightly different approach/tweaks. That might benefit both from lowering BOM even if slightly?
MonkeyPunch
Neo Member
there is a lot i want to say but out of respect to some of some there i wont yet. Not all are bad, but theres a terrible persecution complex for some as you would expect. also i dont want them to somehow find out who i was in the channel lol.
i do have some discord screenshots too that i have distributed to some users on era. they can try to claim that i faked them so that would be fun.
that is the last i will say. will just lurk for now.
off to work, bye.
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demigod
Member
Penello.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
that makes sense. Timdog did screw up and admitted to chatting with Penello at E3 2018 when they announced their next gen 'consoles' or maybe it was at some Xbox fuckfest.
i wouldnt be surprised if MS found the github leaks first and devised their entire sandwich strategy around it. the github folders were there in march of 2018 from what i understand.
another reason why they were so sure of setting the bar for next gen consoles in 2018 and then 2019 rolls around and all of a sudden its just the most powerful console they have created.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Just relax, mate
You seem a bit angry. Anyway, why post anything on Github to begin with if it's owned by your rival, Microsoft? Seems to me it's there because it was posted by AMD as the chip seems to be changed with the change of plans from 2019 release, so it theoretically won't hurt Sony or break any NDA.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
not angry. just speculating. which part of my post seemed angry?Just relax, mate
this is fascinating stuff. we have never seen anything like the github leaks before, and it would be amazing if somehow MS found out sonys plans that way.
Gavin Stevens
Formerly 'o'dium'
Gudji
Member
Where do you guys come up with this shit. lmao so good
Bo_Hazem
Banned
It'll only make sense if Sony cancelled that chip, then it's safe to through it to Github by AMD, as it's irrelevant anymore. And if it was relevant we won't see PS5 surpassing XSX or battling on the same level as reported by many devs and insiders.
Agnostic2020
Member
Albert penello and MS always assumed Sony will launch in 2019 with 400 price tag with 8tf . So based on that assumption they decided to sandwich Sony with 4 tf and 12 tf console . (Notice that 8tf console will fall exactly in the middle of that sandwich price wise and spec wise ). That’s why in e3 2018 they prematurely announced Scarlett and claimed performance crown to replay the same tactics of x1x and pro by saying in advance hey we are coming in later but we are stronger .
later in the year the found out Sony had changed its plan to 2020.( If they knew before e3 2018 they wouldn’t announce Scarlett out of no where ). In e3 2019 their tone about performance changed and they thought about dropping the lockhart. Cause ps5 would no longer be sandwiched in between spec wise And they can not control Sony’s pricing which makes 2 sku risky move . Now they r like fuck it we ll do whatever, we don’t care what Sony does .they even say it in interviews and that’s exactly what they r thinking . They are more concerned with the 6 billion imaginary gamers to fight in the imaginary fight with google and amazon over those imaginary customers
even to this day Albert penello thinks Sony is gonna be 8 tf 399 console.they pass on this view to their hardcore fan base and their toxicity gets out of control .
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wowbaggerBR
Member
Just relax, mate
I'll go with points because I don't have the time to elaborate further (got a plane to catch):
- GitHub acquisition by Microsoft is fairly recent
- Even so, it is an extremely professional environment. I wouldn't expect Microsoft going after millions of repositories in order to find what their rivals are doing (it's not only AMD using GitHub)
- It wasn't posted by AMD. The repository was public and personal, created by an intern. How we know this? The guy was so fresh that the repo had some personal files, like his resumeé and even a shop list.
There are a lot of points to take the GitHub stuff in a more skeptical manner - lack of context and what could be errors on the scripts themselves are examples - but I really find it laughable that people are so invested in what could very well be a routine set of tests that a manager gave to the poor sap just to test a new member of the team, or even give something to the new guy do: like "here, take this sample, this scripts and go run this tests while we work on more pressing stuff" . This whole mess happens just because the guy was so fresh that he clearly didn't knew squat about how Git tools work to the point that he ended up posting online sensitive internal data mixed with his own personal files.
A senior engineer would never, ever, ever, ever do such a thing.
* Important to note that I had a copy of the repository, got it in the day that the thing hit the fan by simply searching "oberon" on the GitHub search bar. I also have been posting this take ever since and, before people ask, I have deleted the whole thing due to the fact that they had been explored to greater extent that I did in my free time and by the fact that they would expose the intern that certanly had to update the resumeé
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The others ways being what? Non-existing current design...sure, but unlikely. Not impossible per say just hellishly unlikely. Right now it's a non existing design in any form of current implementation and a pipe dream. You talking about macro architecture changes, designs for RDNA 1 that don't currently exist, and don't exist in any consumer product out or forthcoming with known designs....until proven otherwise.
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SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
very interesting. this does sound plausible. i always wondered why they announced project scarlett at e3 2018. made no sense to announce a console like 2.5 years in advance with no real info lol.Albert penello and MS always assumed Sony will launch in 2019 with 400 price tag . So based on that assumption they decided to sandwich Sony with 4 tf and 12 tf console . (Notice that 8tf console will fall exactly in the middle of that sandwich price wise and spec wise ). That’s why in e3 2018 they prematurely announced Scarlett and claimed performance crown to replay the same tactics of x1x and pro by saying in advance hey we are coming in later but we are stronger .
later in the year the found out Sony had changed its plan to 2020.( If they knew before e3 2018 they wouldn’t announce Scarlett out of no where ). In e3 2019 their tone about performance changed and they thought about dropping the lockhart. Cause ps5 would no longer be sandwiched in between spec wise And they can not control Sony’s pricing which makes 2 sku risky move . Now they r like fuck it we ll do whatever, we don’t care what Sony does .they even say it in interviews and that’s exactly what they r thinking . They are more concerned with the 6 billion imaginary gamers to fight in the imaginary fight with google and amazon over those imaginary customers
even to this day Albert penello thinks Sony is gonna be 8 tf 399 console.they pass on this view to their hardcore fan base and their toxicity gets out of control .
Bo_Hazem
Banned
No problem, it only means more meltdown. Just prepare some popcorn or nachos and enjoy the drama.
Gavin Stevens
Formerly 'o'dium'
AMD does more business with MS than Sony, why on earth would they do this?
DaGwaphics
Member
I'm sure it was something nefarious. Couldn't have been a way to combat the false rumors swirling that Scorpio was their swan song and they were out of the console business going forward. Nope, something like that couldn't have had a thing to do with it.
01011001
Banned
that was normal before the PS4 and Xbox One gen...
the PS3 was first talked about 2 E3s before it launched! it was literally at 2 E3s before it was released and even before the first E3 appearance it already was talked about.
the Wii was also at 2 E3s before it was released... this is not special it was the last generation that was the weird one here, that one was the anomaly not the norm
bitbydeath
Gold Member
Sony was said to be involved with creating Navi so the roadmap wouldn’t be any surprise to them.
Bo_Hazem
Banned
Maybe indirectly, someone works for AMD but got Sony connections?
Agnostic2020
Member
They don’t have to . They just tell them hey look we have 84cu gpu launching in 2020 . And with that sony would know 36 cu is entry level in 2020 due to gpu release schedule of amd and how many cu they need to pack to be technically relevant . In 2013 amd had 36 cu max (their top of the line )and Sony went with 20 cu. if we apply the same logic as ps4 Sony would choose a gpu around 50 cu for 2020 . So they don’t need to see what MS is doing . They just have to redo what they did in 2013 gpu wise
Gavin Stevens
Formerly 'o'dium'
The biggest issue I have with this and things like this way of thinking is that it always assumes side A changed their plan, and went all in, while side B, Knowing this, did nothing at all to counter this. If it’s plausible that sony were to release early and then said no, to change their plans... it’s just as plausible MS caught wind and changed course as well to counter.
And that’s the game, really. It’s all about one side making a move and the other side countering. Sooner or later you run out of time or options, and it’s no longer realistic to counter.
So to assume Sony some how two whole years ago changed their plans and Ms have been sat with their pants down for all that time... doesn’t sit well with me. Two years is a LONG time, and neither side will have stayed the course of their plans 100% from then.
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thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Member
With all due respect, I got sick of you guys and this so-called NeoGAF forums with all the 9.2TF harassment. I was really considering a golden membership, but I digressed. I heard a lot of down-talking and laughing at REEEEEEE here. So I googled it:
Pushed that, yet again I somehow see freakin NeoGAF in the mix:
Then went in and searched for the speculation thread. Inside the thread I found the amazing poet Colbert along with other civilized members, but what caught my eyes was this post:
Chocolate, Banana, and walnuts. This thread looks more organic and healthy to me. I'm done here, bye.
No one who's mentioning, say, PS5 is 9.2, is doing it as a personal attack against you. Same with someone saying XSX is 10TF and some Xbox fan mistakes that as a persona attack. A lot of people are using dumb metrics and logic (or lack thereof) to come up with their predictions but I highly doubt they are doing it to specifically target a particular poster. Some are just doing it to fanboy, others are trying to be fair and partial but may not be up-to-date on all the rumors, leaks etc., others still might have good intentions but not know a lot about how tech works and there are others who are just trying to be fair with all the sources and weigh them against each other.
Uh...so I'm gonna guess this was sarcasm?
Would immediately put AMD in threat of litigation by Microsoft if they did so. Those NDAs, they're to be respected on both sides, and if AMD did that it'd come off like them playing favorites.
Which would mean they'd have to do MS a favor or two as well to make up for such a thing, such as preferred discount pricing or some other perks. Why would AMD put themselves in this kind of position?
Still don't know what's up with Layden and the others leaving, we'll probably not find out for a very long time. I do wish they were still there though; Ryan just lacks charm from head to toe so any new people coming onto the PS team, I hope they can make up for that.
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Mriverz
Member
. Idk just trying toss theories out.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
there was nothing nefarious about what agnostic speculated. i really dont know why you guys are getting so butthurt over simple speculation. They went to E3 and revealed scorpio a year and a half before it came out just to have a console of their own in people'd minds as Sony revealed and released the pro. There is precedent. why is nefarious to assume they would do the same for the PS5 and Xbox Series X?
it seems people think im saying that MS hacked into github to steal Sony's info. they didnt need to hack anything, its a public directory. komachi found it. rogame found it. why is it hard for people to believe that someone from MS found it as well?
Bo_Hazem
Banned
wowbaggerBR
Member
Not only Sony, but the whole industry, has learned some valuable lessons after the STI developed PPC going inside of the X360 CPU debacle. This wouldn't happen.
The more rational take is this: as soon as they decided to launch in 2020, for whatever reason, a whole new set of tech is open to them. So it would be suicidal and beyond stupid going with last years tech in a product that surely will compete with a more advanced one.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
Not true.
PS3 was announced at E3 2005 and released a year and a half later.
Wii was announced at E3 2005 and released a year and a half later.
Scarlet was announced at E3 2018 and would not released for TWO and a half years later.
Thats THREE E3s before it was released compared to the 2 E3s for the Wii and PS3.
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Agnostic2020
Member
Why do u think they went with 12 and 4 instead of 12 (4k)and 3 (HD) or 12(4k ) and 6(2k)? They wanted to sandwich Sony price wise and spec wise and have the same $/TF as Sony . But Sony fucked that plan up
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Disco_
Member
There's nothing that I'm aware of that says butterfly design is necessary for ps5 to do ps4 bc. I'll let you show me otherwise.
At the time of pro, "butterfly" design didn't exist either. Hell, each side of the "butterfly" isn't even the same. They could've just done a single sided chip with the front end on one side rather that it being sandwiched between both halves.
It's interesting that your post reads almost exactly as what was recently posted on era.
ps3 was talked about at e3 2005 because it was supposed to release that year.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
god imagine a 3 tflops next gen console. just kill me.
i have a feeling they have reworked the lockhart and part of the reason its being revived is because its a 6 tflops console aimed at $399 instead of $299.
01011001
Banned
these were full reveals with prototype hardware and stuff tho.
this right now was literally just "YO we are working on a new console!" which everyone already knew about... and that's it. no details really other than PR speak about oh the graphics will be so good!
it was not really comparable with what Nintendo and especially Sony did where they showed full on gameplay and console designs right off the bat
and WE STILL have no idea what the PS5 or even its controller look like...
we have 1 render in a trailer of the Series X along with leaks... that's it. ZERO gameplay, ZERO actual first hand infos on the hardware other than leaks and target features
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Agnostic2020
Member
It would not surprise me at all if they are sure Sony is not sandwiched and is launching at 499.
Which honestly is better for the whole industry tbh.
The whole 4 ,8,12 at 299,399,499 was dream scenario for what MS believed would happen when Sony would launch in 2019 (tech wise also 8 was max in a console in 2019) lol but those damn Sony fools didn’t follow the plan
Gamernyc78
Banned
The talking points come behind specially marked bags of Dorito and Mountain dew Broooo get with the program
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Disco_
Member
I don't think "scarlett" is what you think it is.
IkarugaDE
Member
Scarlett Johansson!
Lol i ment lockhart. These names I miss the dolphin days.
01011001
Banned
pretty sure a new system based on navi hardware at 4TF would not only outperform the One X but also be cheaper to manufacture since it won't need the massive heatpipe of the One X and also would be a smaller die. so that wouldn't make sense IMO
thicc_girls_are_teh_best
Member
Well that's because the internet's changed a lot since 2013, let alone 2004. We never saw companies use platforms like Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, Discord etc. before to marketing and messaging until just a few years ago, when higher-ups finally started to understand how to leverage them.
We've never really seen companies use open-source, 3rd-party messaging and communication tools until a few years ago, either. Doesn't mean there was a scheme involved or MS found out about Sony's plans in any way unusual. And IIRC, AMD are the ones handling the repository databases, same with the product benchmarks, wouldn't your theory implicate AMD being somewhat at fault?
Again, I guess it's possible. Anything's technically possible. But it's extremely improbable.
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