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Neil Druckmann's Response To Uncharted 4 Black Character Controversy

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sonicmj1 said:
I feel like "controversy" really overstates the level of venom in that earlier discussion.

It's the classic sort of internet noise amplification where a few people bothered by a creative decision becomes the entirety of NeoGAF beside themselves with anger.
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That's... not true though? If you read through the thread, the people who are getting angry or irritated are those claiming that this was just outrage culture, people looking for something to be offended by, etc. There was actually no venom in the proper "discussion", only drive-by shitposting.

Lol, a prime example:
GeoramA said:
People get outraged over everything these days, yeesh.
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soultron said:
Initially, I raised an eyebrow at finding out Nadine was being played by a white actress, but I am OK with the answer. Makes total sense. It is cool to see an awesome, fierce black woman in the game. It was good of Miller to ask the question and for Druckmann not to shy away from giving an honest answer.

Still, I'm not sure if the game will cover this, but if Nadine as a character ever deals with racism in UC4 or has to recount past experiences, it might be a bit strange. But then we can throw ourselves down another hole, asking ourselves is it OK for a white woman to pretend to talk about pretend experiences with racism written by someone who might be white. But, I ultimately don't think UC4 will really delve into that kind of weighty stuff. And again, the answer Druckmann gave is good, in my opinion.
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i don't think a person who hasn't directly experienced what they're writing about can't do it in a respectful way just because of that. it's not as if they can't draw from sources ranging from other literature to working with those that have experienced that to ensure it's done well.
 
Garrett Hawke said:
That's... not true though? If you read through the thread, the people who are getting angry or irritated are those claiming that this was just outrage culture, people looking for something to be offended by, etc. There was actually no venom in the proper "discussion", only drive-by shitposting.
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That's exactly what I meant.

The discussion itself was fine, but it's perceived by people outside it as something more heated and contentious than it actually was.
 
I'm the type of person who tends to be very progressive on just about everything, and I'm all for diversity -- But in this case I find myself amazed that there's even a controversy and I even find the existence of this controversy mildly annoying.

My initial reaction was basically what Neil ended up saying. This is a fantasy. The beauty of it is that you can be anyone. That's the beauty of VO and games/animated stories. Given that it's Naughty Dog, which is an extremely progressive company, which has cast diverse actors in their various games, I even more don't see the issue.

And -- Last of all -- again, like I said before, it's quite possible (and indeed was the case, according to Neil) that the role was cast before the ethnicity of the character was even established.

Y2Kev said:
Guys, stop "one and done"ing like its a prize fight and he just knocked someone out.
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With that last bit in mind, it actually is a bit of a knock out punch. What else is there to say? That they should fire their actor if they decide later to make the character black? At what point can we declare this controversy completely silly?
 
Garrett Hawke said:
That's... not true though? If you read through the thread, the people who are getting angry or irritated are those claiming that this was just outrage culture, people looking for something to be offended by, etc. There was actually no venom in the proper "discussion", only drive-by shitposting.
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Not 100% true. At the beginning there were some drive-bys of people annoyed by the "controversy" and some people annoyed by Laura's casting, both of whom failed to contribute in a meaningful way. But as the thread went on, yes, most drive-bus tended to be people laughing at the controversy.

The actual conversation we had was actually mostly respectful and indepth.
 
What a dumb contraversy. People have been voicing characters of different race for decades. Why did people suddenly start to care now?

Hell, Phil Lamaar has probably voiced more white characters than most white voice actors.
 
Wait, so people are mad because a white actor portrays a black character?

Dang, no chill. Anyways good on ND for sticking to their guns.
 
Quoting myself from the other thread.
Frog-fu said:
That the design followed the casting is a significant mitigating factor that softens my disappointment, but it shouldn't be taken as legitimisation of the belief that white actors should be cast for black character roles with little thought put into it. They shouldn't.

The reality of the industry remains that the number of black character roles is but a fraction of that of white characters. Those roles should prioritise talented black actors filling them over talented white actors in order to promote diversity on and behind the screen in the industry.
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I believe Druckmann when he says the design followed the casting. They were already in production with mocapping and whatnot and they already gave the job to Bailey.
 
The people conflating this with Hollywood casting issues were way off the mark (before Niel even responded). On the other hand you had people arguing it would have been nice to see more minority actors get voice rolls but that would have compromised their vision of the character. You had a few people saying that there's no such thing as a 'best' choice and I gotta say when it comes to realizing someone's vision I gotta disagree and based off of the response Neil does too.
 
Kralamoonard said:
Well it's not really a bunch of guys, is it? It's clearly big enough that some developers took notice of it, and thus, they were asked about it.
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I guess I just read that thread under a different filter. I just saw some folks actually trying to discuss something while a bunch of others were just dropping their 2 cents and leaving.
 
zswordsman said:
Wait, so people are mad because a white actor portrays a black character?

Dang, no chill. Anyways good on ND for sticking to their guns.
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"sticking to their guns" what tf were they going to do delay the game and change the character? druckmann explained the process behind the creation of the character which is a great thing to do.
 
Obliterator said:
I had no idea there was even controversy over this. Somehow missed the entire thing. Jesus Christ
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It was basically a very active discussion. Some people was annoyed with the discussion. It wasn't like the RE5 Africa video type of outrage. There wasn't much outrage at all from what I saw.
 
Spring-Loaded said:
If you're a child


Naughty Dog are well-adjusted adults, were able to recognize this wasn't an attack on them, and were able to respond to the issue without throwing a hissy fit.
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Exactly, if it wasn't an issue he wouldn't have even addressed it. Look, nobody wants to talk about race but kudos to them for sticking with their choice even though they knew it would create controversy and discussion. Even internally they were afraid of the controversy it would cause and wanted to redesign the character.

Neil came out and talked about something that most people in this industry and the film industry would ignore because he felt that it was a discussion worth bringing up. He then went onto say that they cast a black man to do a white actor to prove that these decisions are made race-blind.
 
I'm in love with the Nadine character. I suspect she is the UC character that has been most openly accepted by my imagination so far. I feel she is just saturated with depth and uniqueness but that is besides the point.

I am shocked at some of what happened in that thread.

I also encourage Neil and anyone else to participate in discussions (yes even in potentially toxic gaming forum threads) in a thoughtly, honnest & compassionate way. He has already done so with at least one Reddit AMA after TLoU launched.

In my opinion, leading by example is the best way to enocurage the gaming community to save itself from toxicity.
 
Y2Kev said:
Frankly, I'm sorry Neil reads GAF against his better judgment. He's a highly respected figure here with highly respected ideas and highly respected works of art. I hope he can look past what he perceives as noise.
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He never said that, though. He said "as people always warn me not to do", which implies he enjoys doing so, even if people around him tell him it's for the best he doesn't. The previous line is even "I was up late last night reading NeoGAF", so they could even be warning him not to read it late at night or he'd certainly lose sleep because it's addicting.

Or maybe it doesn't, sorry if it's my mistake and I'm not getting the meaning behind "against his better judgment"
 
orthodoxy1095 said:
Not 100% true. At the beginning there were some drive-bys of people annoyed by the "controversy" and some people annoyed by Laura's casting, both of whom failed to contribute in a meaningful way. But as the thread went on, yes, most drive-bus tended to be people laughing at the controversy.

The actual conversation we had was actually mostly respectful and indepth.
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I didn't read a lot of the early posts to be fair so my impressions might not be fully representative. But I agree that towards the end the conversation became really interesting.
sonicmj1 said:
That's exactly what I meant.

The discussion itself was fine, but it's perceived by people outside it as something more heated and contentious than it actually was.
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Ah, my mistake. Yeah I agree.
 
Gbraga said:
He never said that, though. He said "as people always warn me not to do", which implies he enjoys doing so, even if people around him tell him it's for the best he doesn't. The previous lien is even "I was up late last night reading NeoGAF", so they could even be warning him not to read it late at night or he'd certainly lose sleep because it's addicting.

Or maybe it doesn't, sorry if it's my mistake and I'm not getting the meaning behind "against his better judgment"
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I always get the feeling he's kinda joking when he says how he shouldn't be reading it. I never have taken offense.
 
As a black guy I never saw the problem in the first place. There are actors/actress who ever is best for the role gets the job.
 
Ryuuga said:
Amazing response. That all this created controversy still boggles my mind.
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AntMurda said:
I'm in shock really. Everything is a controversy!
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univariate said:
Everything is a controversy these days.
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la flama blanca said:
Why it was even an issue is just weird.
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Get_craycray said:
There was a controversy for this? Really?
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Obliterator said:
I had no idea there was even controversy over this. Somehow missed the entire thing. Jesus Christ
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The Boat said:
I didn't even know there was a controversy and I still dont understand why there is one.
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fernoca said:
People trying to stir controversy...as always.

Sad that developers have to discuss ..well, every decision they make because someone somwhere is already starting a controversy around it.

Then some are surprised game reveals, previews and even review events are PR now.
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paragonpro said:
There was controversy? Really? Over what?
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The outrage over "outrage culture" in these threads is always amusing to see.
 
Jobbs said:
I always get the feeling he's kinda joking when he says how he shouldn't be reading it. I never have taken offense.
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Yeah, he even used all of our avatars as his twitter banner thing for a while, does anybody remember that? Someone shopped a picture of a plane with his face as the pilot, and then everybody started to add their own avatars to it, then Druckmann saw it, thought it was awesome and used it on his twitter.

I managed to sneak Hibiki in there! That was an awesome thread.
 
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