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Salty Rice
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:27 PM)
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Difference here OP:

Horizon: Ingame money only without any intention of greed

ACreed: Predecessors had real money shit and you know its gonna be in the final build. Dont be naive.

Of course they avoid putting in real money shit in preview build if they can avoid bad press too early.
Jigolo
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:28 PM)
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Ocarina Of Time had loot boxes too
NullPointer
#INTESTINAL
(10-07-2017, 12:28 PM)
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Originally Posted by texhnolyze

I only think that 'guilty until proven innocent' is not a good way to support the argument.

True, but they've made some significant design changes with this new game, that make it look awfully lootbox-ready. Their full semi-random smart loot system for one, and strict leveling that makes you depend more upon leveling up and having high quality items. *If* you were going to start selling lootboxes this is the kind of foundation you'd want to start with.
panda-zebra
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:28 PM)
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Originally Posted by dex3108

In short i created this thread to see how people will react and most of you did as i thought you will.

First and foremost Assassin's Creed had MT since AC3 and you couldn't buy main in-game currency with money ever. So far as we can see Heka Chest in AC Origins is purchasable only with main-in game currency.

And main issue i had with thread that inspired me to create this one is that majority of users treated info presented there as absolute truth and jumped to conclusion.


Now if on game release we see that you can buy main in-game currency or loot boxes i will be first one to say "f-you Ubisoft". But until then can we please stop jumping to conclusion and debate about non issue things here on GAF?

P.S. Mods i am sorry if i caused any trouble with this thread and if i deserved ban me but i just wanted to point out how misleading info can be.

Fliesen
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:28 PM)
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Originally Posted by texhnolyze

I only think that 'guilty until proven innocent' is not a good way to support the argument.

I don't think it's invalid to look at Ubisoft's track record with regard to microtransactions in their full priced games. It's part of their strategy - wasn't there (years ago) reports where they pretty much stated this in an investor conference?

Also, this isn't a court of law, it's a discussion forum.
jayu26
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:29 PM)
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Originally Posted by Doctor_Thomas

I don't understand.

Assassin's Creed has, in the past, had in-game currency, the new game has loot boxes.

Why is this such a hard stretch to imagine lootboxes costing money? Why wait until it's out? Why not call them on it now to make sure it never happens?

I can't believe OP and couple of others don't understand this part. Pre-emptive noise about these kinds of non-sense to make sure it actually doesn't happen is okay. Even if it was never going to happen, it is still okay to say that this shouldn't happen.
Hektor
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:29 PM)
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Originally Posted by texhnolyze

I only think that 'guilty until proven innocent' is not a good way to support the argument.

Given AC's and by extensions Ubisofts history? It absolutely is.

AC2 cut content from the game and sold it as DLC

AC4 locked an entire type of sidemissions behind a long grind or conveniently priced "timesaverpacks"

AC Unity basically made everything in the game purchasable for real money.

And as far as i'm away For Honor and recent R6: Seej updates containt real money lootboxes too, tho i might be wrong about that.


Either way, there is no reason at all to give ubisoft the benefit of a doubt unless you want to defend your favorite videogame franchise from the meanies on the internet
Combichristoffersen
Combovers don't work when there is no hair
(10-07-2017, 12:30 PM)
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I've completed Horizon and I frankly never noticed MT lootboxes in-game, so they can't have been very in your face about it.
FlutterPuffs
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:30 PM)
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A loot box where the loot gets significantly worse when you're doing well. Damnit Nintendo.
dex3108
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:30 PM)

Originally Posted by BoxManLocke

This won't stop anything and your little "experiment" at the expense of everyone else mostly makes you look like a douche.

You're ignoring context about other games and Ubisoft's history with MTs.

I am fully familiar with Ubisoft history with MT. That is why i am not worried at all about AC Origins. Their implementation in their SP games is so basic. By the second half of any of their games with MT you have so much resources to buy anything. As Chairmanchuck pointed out they did lock Collectibles maps behind Helix credit in Unity but there was also another cache with that, even if you went and purchased those they never revealed all collectibles on the map. That was way worse than locking them behind Helix points.

Originally Posted by OléGunner

So you admit to trying to spread disinformation?
Isn't this ban worthy?

At this time show mi what is not true? Both mechanics are 99% identical. But as i said i created this thread ready to be banned if mods find it appropriate.

Originally Posted by GearFourth

Lol sure it was it just backfired hard on you now your just making up some shit to protect yourself from the backlash

And i would come back and talked here in that case? :D
Mega Caprison
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:31 PM)
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Just say sorry and done with it.. Sheeesh
NullPointer
#INTESTINAL
(10-07-2017, 12:31 PM)
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Originally Posted by Combichristoffersen

I've completed Horizon and I frankly never noticed MT lootboxes in-game, so they can't have been very in your face about it.

Your memory is fine, those things didn't exist in Horizon at all.
Markitron
Is currently staging a hunger strike outside Gearbox HQ while trying to hate them to death
(10-07-2017, 12:31 PM)
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Originally Posted by jayu26

I can't believe OP and couple of others don't understand this part.

Tbh I honestly can't believe that anyone on GAF defends the rise of lootboxes. The only solid argument any of these defenders have is that they been in games before.

Yea lets not try to change shitty things just because we never noticed them before.............

Originally Posted by dex3108

Both mechanics are 99% identical.

You don't know this and that is the problem. You're equating two things and one of them is an unknown quantity.
Egida
Junior Member
(10-07-2017, 12:31 PM)
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Originally Posted by Combichristoffersen

I've completed Horizon and I frankly never noticed MT lootboxes in-game, so they can't have been very in your face about it.

That's because there isn't any MT. Unless your post was a joke in which case nvm.
Forkball
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:32 PM)
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Why didn't anyone care about the original loot boxes?

danthefan
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:32 PM)

Originally Posted by Combichristoffersen

I've completed Horizon and I frankly never noticed MT lootboxes in-game, so they can't have been very in your face about it.

There were no MT loot boxes in the game.
Combichristoffersen
Combovers don't work when there is no hair
(10-07-2017, 12:32 PM)
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Originally Posted by NullPointer

Your memory is fine, those things didn't exist in Horizon at all.

Originally Posted by danthefan

There were no MT loot boxes in the game.

My memory is shite, but yeah, I now noticed OP was talking about the mystery boxes which can be bought for in-game money. So.. yeah. Thread backfire? Thread backfire.
Last edited by Combichristoffersen; 10-07-2017 at 12:35 PM.
Jawbreaker
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:32 PM)
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Originally Posted by watdaeff4

Read his original post. To his credit there is no disinformation there. He never said real money was required to buy the loot boxes

Also to his credit he is telling mods to ban him if he broke the TOS

Well, if they get banned, they better hope NeoGAF employs a microtransactioon model where paying a set amount of money gets you unbanned or the ban period commuted.
jayu26
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:32 PM)
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Originally Posted by Combichristoffersen

I've completed Horizon and I frankly never noticed MT lootboxes in-game, so they can't have been very in your face about it.

You didn't because there were none.
le.phat
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:33 PM)
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Originally Posted by jem0208

This is a reaction thread to the one about loot boxes in AC: Origins.

In the other thread half the posters are some variation of "Fuck loot boxes, I'm not buying the game".

In this thread half the posts are about how the loot boxes in Horizon aren't real loot boxes.

The point the OP is making is that despite the fact that the loot box systems in both games are basically the same, tons of people are attacking AC whereas tons of people are defending Horizon.


Did you read the very post in the thread? Ie: the OP?

What a stupid comparison then. Horizon has already proven that it's lootsystem wasnt built around maximizing MT profits, whereas AC has a history with nickel 'n diming it's customers.
Markitron
Is currently staging a hunger strike outside Gearbox HQ while trying to hate them to death
(10-07-2017, 12:34 PM)
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Originally Posted by Combichristoffersen

My memory is shite, but yeah, I now noticed OP was talking about the mystery boxes which can be bought for in-game money. So.. yeah. Thread backfire? Thread backfire.

It's not a thread backfire, it's an 'experiment'.
ActWan
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:34 PM)
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You missed the point. It's not about loot boxes per-se, it's about using real money for them.
Egida
Junior Member
(10-07-2017, 12:35 PM)
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Also are we turning crazy? Are people trying to spin this arguing that random mechanics have always been present? The problem comes when the player not getting something in game turns into profit for the publisher.

Imagine MTs on Monster Hunter, or a Dark Souls with limited lifes tied to a MT system.
Combichristoffersen
Combovers don't work when there is no hair
(10-07-2017, 12:36 PM)
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Originally Posted by Markitron

It's not a thread backfire, it's an 'experiment'.

A failed one, at that.
tuxfool
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:37 PM)

Originally Posted by Jawbreaker

Well, if they get banned, they better hope NeoGAF employs a microtransactioon model where paying a set amount of money gets you unbanned or the ban period commuted.

Nah, you pay for a chance to get unbanned.

I just found the new NeoGAF ad free model.
ViviOggi
(10-07-2017, 12:37 PM)
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*gets roasted for posting a garbage thread* It's just a social experiment bro!
watdaeff4
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:37 PM)
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Originally Posted by Egida

Also are we turning crazy? Are people trying to spin this arguing that random mechanics have always been present? The problem comes when the player not getting something in game turns into profit for the publisher.

Imagine MTs on Monster Hunter, or a Dark Souls with limited lifes tied to a MT system.


I don't think that was his point, no.

In fact, not at all.

Originally Posted by ViviOggi

*gets roasted for posting a garbage thread* It's just a social experiment bro!

Actually it was pretty obvious that's what he was doing, it's pretty much why I said that very thing prior to his first admission of it
Fliesen
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:38 PM)
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My main issue with people trying to discourage pre-release critique of a game is the fact that it shifts the supposed 'proper' way to go about things to look like this:

"Wait and see, give them the benefit of the doubt"
- Publisher releases game with shady microtransaction mechanics
"Well, turns out you were right ... gotta vote with your wallet now and just don't buy the game"

No thank you, i'd rather have people create a bit of scrutiny pre-release, maybe have the publisher significantly tone down their nickel-and-diming to avoid further scrutiny and be able to buy and play the game. Because i personally really like the games that Ubisoft makes.

And if we engage in a discussion about the possibility of microtransactions in AC:Origins and the game was never meant to have these kinds of microtransactions, well then we're all going to be looking rather dumb. Big whoop, I can live with that.
Last edited by Fliesen; 10-07-2017 at 12:41 PM.
texhnolyze
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:38 PM)
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Originally Posted by Hektor

Given AC's and by extensions Ubisofts history? It absolutely is.

AC2 cut content from the game and sold it as DLC

AC4 locked an entire type of sidemissions behind a long grind or conveniently priced "timesaverpacks"

AC Unity basically made everything in the game purchasable for real money.

And as far as i'm away For Honor and recent R6: Seej updates containt real money lootboxes too, tho i might be wrong about that.

Either way, there is no reason at all to give ubisoft the benefit of a doubt unless you want to defend your favorite videogame franchise from the meanies on the internet

Tbf, I never played AC game sincd Black Flag, and that was only for like a couple of hours or so. As I sais in the other thread, I'm also against MT in $60 games and I'll be there when there's a confirmation regarding this. It's just my code to not give anyone bad prejudices until proven.
Danjin44
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:39 PM)
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Here is my question. What is the purpose of those mystry boxes anyway!!? All you find on those boxes are crafting items that can be easily bought in shop? So.....what are they for?
HStallion
Now what's the next step in your master plan?
(10-07-2017, 12:39 PM)
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Originally Posted by dex3108

And i would come back and talked here in that case? :D

"hur dur its an experiment bro" was probably a dumber thing than not saying anything at all so you probably shouldn't have come back.
Brotherhood93
Junior Member
(10-07-2017, 12:39 PM)
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Horizon: Zero Dawn had loot, some of which came in boxes, but I think that is different from what people mean when using the term "loot boxes" because there was no micro-transactions involved. Clearly, the reason for the loot in Horizon was never based around making money for Sony.

If I remember correctly the so-called loot boxes in Horizon were stored in a different part of the inventory to the items they contained. I always assumed this was a work around to keep inventory capped but so it never caused an issue when receiving quest rewards.
privitsan02
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:40 PM)
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Originally Posted by Stygr

Try what?
I was obviously joking if you mind, but i know if i dont put the /s you can't take a joke. Don't be triggered my dear.

Nice recovery.
tuxfool
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:40 PM)

Originally Posted by texhnolyze

Tbf, I never played AC game sincd Black Flag, and that was only for like a couple of hours or so. As I sais in the other thread, I'm also against MT in $60 games and I'll be there when there's a confirmation regarding this. It's just my code to not give anyone bad prejudices until proven.

I'm not sure it can be a prejudice if you're basing your decisions on a clear pattern of past behaviour.
Ikuu
Had his dog run over by Blizzard's CEO
(10-07-2017, 12:40 PM)
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OP you can't pick a Sony game to make a thread like this.
Fliesen
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:40 PM)
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Originally Posted by Danjin44

Here is my question. What is the purpose of those mystry boxes anyway!!? All you find on those boxes are crafting items that can be easily bought in shop? So.....what are they for?

In other games, they're literally just a way to burn money on the thrill of maybe getting a neat item.

It's like Gheed in Diablo 2, like the slot machine in Borderlands 2, ...
GraveRobberX
Banned
(10-07-2017, 12:41 PM)
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Originally Posted by Egida

Also are we turning crazy? Are people trying to spin this arguing that random mechanics have always been present? The problem comes when the player not getting something in game turns into profit for the publisher.

Imagine MTs on Monster Hunter, or a Dark Souls with limited lifes tied to a MT system.

Bloodborne 2

$4.99 for 10 Super Blood Vials (exclusive, 50% discount)
$6.66 for the Hunter Chest, stuffed with goodies, chance @Boss resources*
*Have to have beaten boss at least once!
sn00zer
(10-07-2017, 12:41 PM)
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Do people realize that lootboxes the mechanic is not the issue, its that you pay for them.


I love loot boxes as a mechanic, i dont like paying for them, its that easy
tuxfool
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:41 PM)

Originally Posted by Ikuu

OP you can't pick a Sony game to make a thread like this.

Forget Sony game. It is just a wrong comparison, end of.
Sailent
Junior Member
(10-07-2017, 12:41 PM)
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DE: Mankind Divided had microtransactions and nobody cared too.
Bishop89
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:42 PM)
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no real life money in Horizon im sure.

Pretty sure AC:O there is.
jayu26
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:42 PM)
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Originally Posted by texhnolyze

Tbf, I never played AC game sincd Black Flag, and that was only for like a couple of hours or so. As I sais in the other thread, I'm also against MT in $60 games and I'll be there when there's a confirmation regarding this. It's just my code to not give anyone bad prejudices until proven.

Originally Posted by tuxfool

I'm not sure it can be a prejudice if you're basing your decisions on a clear pattern of past behaviour.

.
BibiMaghoo
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:43 PM)
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Weren't the loot boxes in horizon just shitty ammo packs? I don't remember there being anything of worth in them at all, just a selection of arrows and crafting materials. All the cosmetic and mechanical items needed to be purchased in game directly. They were like lucky dips for shit you didn't need, pretty pointless all in.
Lifeline
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:43 PM)
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Horizon lootboxes is probably the worst example you could've come up with. That's one of the games that did lootboxes right by making them completely useless. I bet a majority of players didn't even bother opening them once they figured out they contained nothing useful.

Originally Posted by dex3108

In short i created this thread to see how people will react and most of you did as i thought you will.

First and foremost Assassin's Creed had MT since AC3 and you couldn't buy main in-game currency with money ever. So far as we can see Heka Chest in AC Origins is purchasable only with main-in game currency.

And main issue i had with thread that inspired me to create this one is that majority of users treated info presented there as absolute truth and jumped to conclusion.


Now if on game release we see that you can buy main in-game currency or loot boxes i will be first one to say "f-you Ubisoft". But until then can we please stop jumping to conclusion and debate about non issue things here on GAF?

P.S. Mods i am sorry if i caused any trouble with this thread and if i deserved ban me but i just wanted to point out how misleading info can be.

Another IWasOnlyPretendingToBeRetarded.jpg thread.
jayu26
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:44 PM)
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Originally Posted by Ikuu

OP you can't pick a Sony game to make a thread like this.

Of course he can. Pick MLB. Plenty of people have expressed their displeasure with Micro transactions in that game.
tuxfool
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:44 PM)

Originally Posted by Sailent

DE: Mankind Divided had microtransactions and nobody cared too.

We're talking about RNG loot boxes. In the end the ones there were jammed in at the last minute and didn't impact the game.

There is a new trend where the game design is being gimped in order to incorporate them. It could turn out to be nothing in AC, but given the clear trends we've been seeing lately, there are reasons not to give them the benefit of doubt.
privitsan02
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:45 PM)
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Originally Posted by Ikuu

OP you can't pick a Sony game to make a thread like this.

He can, he just picked the wrong one which makes him look like an idiot.

Pick any of the recent Naughty Dog games. Their MT's are some of the worst in the industry for online, making it almost pay2win yet they will always get away with it.

How many times do people need to say it, KEEP IT COSMETICS ONLY. This is exactly why I can't give a flying tool about Call of Duty anymore when they started to put guns in drops.

Best wishes.
watdaeff4
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:45 PM)
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Originally Posted by Fliesen

My main issue with people trying to discourage pre-release critique of a game is the fact that it shifts the supposed 'proper' way to go about things to look like this:

"Wait and see, give them the benefit of the doubt"
- Publisher releases game with shady microtransaction mechanics
"Well, turns out you were right ... gotta vote with your wallet now and just don't buy the game"

No thank you, i'd rather have people create a bit of scrutiny pre-release, maybe have the publisher significantly tone down their nickel-and-diming to avoid further scrutiny and be able to buy and play the game. Because i personally really like the games that Ubisoft makes.

And if we engage in a discussion about the possibility of microtransactions in AC:Origins and the game was never meant to have these kinds of microtransactions, well then we're all going to be looking rather dumb. Big whoop, I can live with that.

While I'm not personally going to crucify AC/Ubi until it's known- I do respect you giving meaningful commentary as to why you will beyond just raging.
Jawbreaker
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:45 PM)
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Originally Posted by BibiMaghoo

Weren't the loot boxes in horizon just shitty ammo packs? I don't remember there being anything of worth in them at all, just a selection of arrows and crafting materials. All the cosmetic and mechanical items needed to be purchased in game directly. They were like lucky dips for shit you didn't need, pretty pointless all in.

Yeah, they're mostly there to keep you stocked on supplies.
Danjin44
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:45 PM)
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Originally Posted by Fliesen

In other games, they're literally just a way to burn money on the thrill of maybe getting a neat item.

It's like Gheed in Diablo 2, like the slot machine in Borderlands 2, ...

What thrill!!? it's not like you can get some kind of super rare weapons or armours, all you are getting is same crafting items you can collect on the fileds or buy it on the shop. To me it's so pointless.

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