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DocSeuss
Member
(10-07-2017, 09:47 AM)
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Originally Posted by Joco

Who are you to call a guy out on his decision on what he wants to support?

Because "Loot boxes are OK when they are only cosmetic" doesn't sound like it's just a personal decision.
Ferr986
Member
(10-07-2017, 09:48 AM)
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If AC:Origins turns out to be good I'll buy it. Don't care if it has loot boxes (wont buy any though).
watdaeff4
Member
(10-07-2017, 09:48 AM)
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Originally Posted by Auctopus

Are people upset that people might complete a game before them because they paid $1.50? :(

I can't speak for others, but personally I'm not concerned that someone might complete a game before me because they paid $1.50.

What I am concerned with is the potential for continual creep into SP progression and that in the future I can't complete the game at all unless I pay 💰 then pray to the RNG higher power.

Originally Posted by DocSeuss

Because "Loot boxes are OK when they are only cosmetic" doesn't sound like it's just a personal decision.

This is only partially directed at you......but this is a discussion board where a lot of posts are opinion-based. Do all of us really need to put the disclaimer "in my opinion" in all of these posts?

EDIT:

you also conveniently left out the very next line when you quote him......you know....the part where he literally says "some may argue against that"

So maybe that was confirmation that he was just giving his opinion? :shrugs:
Last edited by watdaeff4; 10-07-2017 at 09:56 AM.
SixFourMike
Member
(10-07-2017, 09:49 AM)
I have absolutely zero interest in loot boxes or games they're in. I've learned to be more discerning in my choices, and there's far too many games in my backlog (not to mention games I haven't bought) for me to worry about the few who jumped on the latest AAA publisher fad.
Jumeira
Member
(10-07-2017, 09:50 AM)
If games are centered around loot boxes, such that everything to do with progress is a form of coercion that leads to more loot, then i will not support that, especially in SP. Will not make the same mistake Cuphead brothers made, no deal with the devil for me.

Im concered with games like Forza & Battlefront 2
Agent_ShortBus
Member
(10-07-2017, 09:51 AM)
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Nope still buying the games just not spending any money on loot boxes themselves.
myco666
Member
(10-07-2017, 09:52 AM)
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Yes but games that have lootboxes don't usually intrest me so it is rather easy for me to avoid them.
GeoGonzo
Member
(10-07-2017, 09:54 AM)
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Woah, that has to be one of the worst first replies I’ve ever seen of neogaf: Blatantly contrarian and anticonsumer.

Anyway, on topic: I’m not going to be as strict as OP, but lootboxes can feel like a detriment to how enjoyable a game is to play, which is my main reason for usually skipping games who use them. For me it isn’t as much about not supporting predatory gambling practices or trying to make games “better” (a more complete piece of entertainment as opposed to a “fun subscription”)... I just don’t enjoy getting asked for money because it makes me feel bad for me when I do (regret) and for them when I don’t (embarrassment). I’d rather stick to complete games and avoid all this crap.
Kuraudo
Member
(10-07-2017, 09:54 AM)
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I don’t think loot boxes would stop me from buying a game I was really hyped about, but they’ve definitely put me off Shadow of War which I was lukewarm on and could have seen myself picking up just to blow through it in a week or so.
Shengar
Member
(10-07-2017, 09:54 AM)
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Playing older, underrated (indie) games that have respect for their player. Or maybe picked up free to play game with more sensible monetization than a $60 game.

There are many, many underrated games out there waiting to be played. Don't let your selection of games dictated by the mainstream taste that only rewards games with high publicity (some do earned it like Cuphead).
Rosur2a
Junior Member
(10-07-2017, 09:54 AM)
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Depending on how bad they are implemented yea.

I was thinking maybe the ESRB should make it so games that include loot boxes are 18+ (due to the similarities to gambling).
ShadowOwl
Member
(10-07-2017, 09:55 AM)
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No singleplayer loot box games for me. The inclusion of loot boxes also means that these games will most likely never be released DRM free, so screw that.
JayBabay
Member
(10-07-2017, 09:57 AM)
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I'm with you on this one OP. I don't have an issue with loot boxes when they are cosmetic, but when path's to character progression in games are locked behind RNG it really takes out some of the enjoyment of earning or working towards those things, and I'm left assuming the game could have been better if it wasn't built around this idea.

People say developers need more sources of income beyond the $60 retail that a game costs, but can you defend them forgoing more desirable systems in exchange for a fabricated slot machine?
Doctor_Thomas
Member
(10-07-2017, 09:58 AM)
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Originally Posted by Jangowuzhere

You're just talking about a supposed doomsday scenario, which is basically further proving my point. Again, where are these $60 games that force you grind for extreme amounts of time and demand you put tons of money into the game to get anywhere?

I will continue to call these complaints silly, because that's what it looks like to me. People were calling for blood when microtransactions seeped into games a few years ago. Annnd nothing has really changed at all. The progression in games still respect our time and they don't demand that we pay more money just to have a good time.

Yes, it's a doomsday scenario, but why wait for that to happen before complaining? There's already games that aren't getting this right like 2K's recent NBA game. You can argue it's just cosmetic, but since when did cosmetics stop being part of the game?

Microtransactions led to games no longer offering additional skins as unlockables, why give someone something for free when you can sell it to them? This led to lootboxes, why sell something to someone when you can sell them the chance of getting something? This is also your view that they respect your time and don't demand you pay more, but that's entirely down to what content you're enjoying in a game and a lot of people like the cosmetic side of things and addictive personalities are targeted by these very same concepts.
jem0208
Member
(10-07-2017, 09:58 AM)
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Originally Posted by dex3108

In the end it is your choice but loot chest in AC origins is not same as loot boxes people should avoid.



Origins has merchant that roams around the world and sells Heka Chest that contains random loot. It is not standard loot box.

Exactly.

People are seeing random loot in a box and engaging outrage mode. It's a bit ridiculous.


The lack of any form of critical thinking from some people is depressing.
Verecocha
Junior Member
(10-07-2017, 10:00 AM)
I couldn't care less if a game has loot boxes, not a single game that supports them has necessitated getting them for my personal enjoyment so far nor spoiled any MP mode in terms of competitiveness. People obviously buy them, so people obviously want them, and that's fine with me. It's just another subject for gamers to moan about when really it probably isn't impacting them whatsoever. Moan, moan, moan about the most recent 'moral panic' to hit the gaming universe.

Be really nice for there not to be multiple threads about lootboxes on the first page.
Last edited by Verecocha; 10-07-2017 at 10:05 AM.
AntiFacebook
(10-07-2017, 10:00 AM)
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I play hearthstone, so i guess i don't avoid them.
AgentLampshade
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:00 AM)
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Yeah, as soon as a game is announced to have lootboxes, I'm out. That shit infects the core design of a game. I simply can't support that business practice.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
(10-07-2017, 10:01 AM)
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Originally Posted by jem0208

Also, can anyone point out where AC Origins actually has loot boxes?

See this npc from Horizon Zero Dawn:

He will trade certain resources in exchange for specialized Treasure Boxes with a variety of resources in them. His boxes can be a useful alternative method to acquire some items.

^
It's literally this in AC:Origins. No real money involved. Just a common RPG mechanic.

Or are we now saying any form of RNG loot drop is a loot box?

Yes because the OP of that thread has done nothing to rectify the spread of misinformation so now any RNG loot is considered a loot box. :|
Endo Punk
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:03 AM)
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Rocket League and Destiny Loot boxes don't bother me at all.
Chrisdk
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:03 AM)
I have never bought a loot box and never will, but i will be getting most of those games if i think there is enough quality content to justify the price tag. I’m not gonna “boycott” games just because they have loot boxes. Not buying microtransactions is enough for me, it sends the same kind of message.
jem0208
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:03 AM)
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Originally Posted by Crossing Eden

See this npc from Horizon Zero Dawn:


^
It's literally this in AC:Origins. No real money involved. Just a common RPG mechanic.


Yes because the OP of that thread has done nothing to rectify the spread of misinformation so now any RNG loot is considered a loot box. :|

I'm aware, I'm trying to get people to actually think for a second instead of immediately getting outraged at the phrase "loot box".
zashga
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:07 AM)
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It's easy for me to avoid this year since I'm not particularly interested in the games that feature them. Last year was a different story with Overwatch; the time-limited loot boxes started to bother me towards the end of 2016 and eventually drove me away from the game. Now I'm probably much more sensitive to loot boxes and really dread seeing them in a game I'm interested in.
EvB
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:07 AM)
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Originally Posted by Auctopus

Are people upset that people might complete a game before them because they paid $1.50? :(

I think people are upset that games aren’t double the price they were a decade ago...
Egida
Junior Member
(10-07-2017, 10:09 AM)
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I have always been a Gran Turismo player, but Sport being online focused made me look for alternatives. I really wanted to get Forza 7 as it seems to offer something similar to what GT used to be, plus the game looks amazing on its own. That was before knowing lootboxes.

Now I'll have to wait to buy a cheap used copy.
KainXVIII
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:11 AM)
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Yep, skipping them (not only because lootboxes, but its one of the reasons)
PS - but still playing Rocket League 😀
clarknova156
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:11 AM)
Completely all the games OP listed. The presence of loot boxes doesn't bother me however... the push for them and game altering bonuses based on random variables that make it gambling in the most predatory way? Fuck that and fuck the big publishers thinking this is acceptable.

I'm done with games thinking loot boxes are somehow justifiable and not unregulated gambling. The fact that these publishers pander to children should be illegal. The FTC should be putting these companies in such a tight spot that they rethink the whole damn thing.
Last edited by clarknova156; 10-07-2017 at 10:14 AM.
Jangowuzhere
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:14 AM)
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Originally Posted by Doctor_Thomas

Yes, it's a doomsday scenario, but why wait for that to happen before complaining? There's already games that aren't getting this right like 2K's recent NBA game. You can argue it's just cosmetic, but since when did cosmetics stop being part of the game?

Microtransactions led to games no longer offering additional skins as unlockables, why give someone something for free when you can sell it to them? This led to lootboxes, why sell something to someone when you can sell them the chance of getting something? This is also your view that they respect your time and don't demand you pay more, but that's entirely down to what content you're enjoying in a game and a lot of people like the cosmetic side of things and addictive personalities are targeted by these very same concepts.

The invention of DLC for games is the reason why we need to buy skins and other previous unlockables in games, it has little to do with microtransactions.

I'm not new to this dance. People thought DLC would be the end of video games. Then it was mobile gaming, and then microtransactions, and now loot boxes are the hot new topic.

I understand the potential issues and I do feel we need to keep a close eye on publishers to make sure it doesn't get out of hand. At the same time, I have zero desire to boycott games that just happen to have loot boxes in them. I haven't spent any money on boxes, and I still haven't felt any desire to do so.
Nick_C
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:14 AM)
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Originally Posted by Crossing Eden

It's literally this in AC:Origins. No real money involved. Just a common RPG mechanic.


Yes because the OP of that thread has done nothing to rectify the spread of misinformation so now any RNG loot is considered a loot box. :|

I've seen you call this a common RPG mechanic a few times tonight and I have to ask, in which RPGs is this a common feature?
Last edited by Nick_C; 10-07-2017 at 10:17 AM. Reason: removed quoted picture
Rivyn
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:18 AM)
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Wow... Just. Wow.

The amount of controversy and downright outrage regarding loot boxes is becoming a comical ride on this forum.

Everyone gets angry over loot boxes in games like Shadow of War, Origins yet they have zero proof that your progress is going to be hindered if you do not buy them.

GAF. Stay away from the cool aid, please. Because this forum is dangerously becoming a toxic place filled with repeated threads about a certain topic.

We must have had about 5 threads about loot boxes already.
charliePure
Junior Member
(10-07-2017, 10:19 AM)
I really want to get into Battlefront 2, but if I'm going to be constantly ranked by paying whales (12year olds raiding mum and dad's bank cards) then no thanks. Shame as I liked the first one.
eXistor
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(10-07-2017, 10:19 AM)
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Originally Posted by Rivyn

Wow... Just. Wow.

The amount of controversy and downright outrage regarding loot boxes is becoming a comical ride on this forum.

Everyone gets angry over loot boxes in games like Shadow of War, Origins yet they have zero proof that your progress is going to be hindered if you do not buy them.

GAF. Stay away from the cool aid, please. Because this forum is dangerously becoming a toxic place filled with repeated threads about a certain topic.

We must have had about 5 threads about loot boxes already.

It's the principle of the thing. I'm in the group that think the game design is affected as soon as you have loot boxes
Saty
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:22 AM)
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It's easy. Items only available through random loot boxes + can spend real money for loot boxes = bad. There's no two ways about it. You are preventing unlocking/purchase of specific items to push players to buy blind boxes again and again. The design of the game has been directly compromised to promote this. The game serves the business model.

Stuff like in Forza and Mordor are also bad because they take existing functionality and sacrifice it to the loot box business model.
MikeyB
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:22 AM)
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Yep. Expecting a kid and once they get to an age where they start playing video games, I want to keep that garbage away from them. It might be useful to have one game that implements them in the most obnoxious way as an object lesson in psychological tricks, self control, and informed consumption. Compare it with something like Zelda: Breath of the Wild (even though that has amiibo bullshit).
Flame Lord
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(10-07-2017, 10:24 AM)
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I am, there are too many good games out there to be dealing with any of that bullshit.
CecilRousso
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(10-07-2017, 10:24 AM)
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Originally Posted by Jangowuzhere

I understand the potential issues and I do feel we need to keep a close eye on publishers to make sure it doesn't get out of hand. At the same time, I have zero desire to boycott games that just happen to have loot boxes in them. I haven't spent any money on boxes, and I still haven't felt any desire to do so.

What does that close eye in publishers mean, if we don't already voice our concerns? We're already at a state with loot boxes, with how they're being used, where the next step will most likely be one step too far.

We can be very certain that Bethesda are discussing ways to use this in their upcoming RPG's, based om that no other business practices have been off limited for them. And while 2k have mostly left Firaxis, My fav dev, out of shit like this, they är being besieged, at you have to worry about the walls eventually falling.
sirap
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:25 AM)
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Yeah I'll skip them. I was excited about AC:Origins too but now that I think about it I'd feel better rewarding devs that don't put any micro-transactions in their games.

If I really feel the urge to play these games I'll buy them on sale.
bman94
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:25 AM)
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Honestly don't give a fuck if they are in a game or not. They are usually filled with shit I don't care about. I think Injustice 2 was the only one that I liked/cared about. But I'm definitely not going to avoid a game because of it.
farisr
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:26 AM)
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Much like my strict no buying policy for games that require an online connection that is not justified, I'm doing the same with games featuring these types of lootboxes in their SP modes.

It's pretty easy as there are a lot of other great games out there not doing this shit.
Scrooge McDuck
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(10-07-2017, 10:30 AM)
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Originally Posted by Nick_C

I've seen you call this a common RPG mechanic a few times tonight and I have to ask, in which RPGs is this a common feature?

Er, I think listing which RPG that doesn't actually have RNG loot is easier.
Bluth54
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(10-07-2017, 10:31 AM)
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Originally Posted by Rosur2a

Depending on how bad they are implemented yea.

I was thinking maybe the ESRB should make it so games that include loot boxes are 18+ (due to the similarities to gambling).

Why should games with loot boxes be rated 18+?
Loot boxes are the digital equivalent of trading cards or blind box toys where you always receive something for your money, which is legal for anyone of any age to buy in the US and not legally considered gambling (of course you can personally consider them gambling). Unless the US government passes a law that makes receiving any randomized item age restricted/gambling loot boxes aren't going to be considered gambling and I have my doubts we'll ever see a law like that.
Last edited by Bluth54; 10-07-2017 at 10:33 AM.
Drillary Clinton
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:33 AM)
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I think we can go ahead and take Origins off the crucifix for now.
vocab
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(10-07-2017, 10:34 AM)
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If the game is good I don't care. I avoid most AAA rehashes so I don't have to choose.
Fbh
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(10-07-2017, 10:34 AM)
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Nah.

I'll still get them. I just won't buy any loot boxes with real money
jem0208
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(10-07-2017, 10:38 AM)
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Originally Posted by sirap

Yeah I'll skip them. I was excited about AC:Origins too but now that I think about it I'd feel better rewarding devs that don't put any micro-transactions in their games.

If I really feel the urge to play these games I'll buy them on sale.

There is no evidence that Origins has loot boxes.
Savitar
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:39 AM)
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I canned my pre order for Star Wars due to this.
jabuseika
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(10-07-2017, 10:40 AM)
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Originally Posted by Bluth54

Why should games with loot boxes be rated 18+?
Loot boxes are the digital equivalent of trading cards or blind box toys where you always receive something for your money, which is legal for anyone of any age to buy in the US and not legally considered gambling (of course you can personally consider them gambling). Unless the US government passes a law that makes receiving any randomized item age restricted/gambling loot boxes aren't going to be considered gambling and I have my doubts we'll ever see a law like that.

Trading cards, Pokemon and Magic, have a certain known drop rate per box of packs, that is clearly told to the consumer before they purchase.

Slot machines in casinos are carefully monitored and tested for specific win rates advertised.

Game devs never make public the drop rates in loot boxes. Except blizzard, because the Chinese government forced them to.
Mister Wilhelm
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:42 AM)
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I quit buying single player games that feature any paid DLC at launch years ago. I also don't buy fighting games that feature clearly ready DLC characters that come out a month or two after release.

I would never buy a single player game with loot boxes at all.

I vote with my wallet. I wish more gamers would do the same.
xrnzaaas
Member
(10-07-2017, 10:42 AM)
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No, not entirely. I bought Forza, but I don't open any loot boxes (I know I'm making it harder for myself to progress in the game ;)). Never planned to buy Battlefront 2 or Shadow of War (well maybe when it's 80% off). Never planned to buy AC Origins on day 1, but the loot box news convinced me to wait for a bigger sale before picking it up.
glaurung
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(10-07-2017, 10:42 AM)
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Not going to skip games I’m stoked on. Might never purchase them boxes provided they’re not integral to the game play experience.

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