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fortunato
Banned
(10-07-2017, 12:26 PM)

Originally Posted by gundamkyoukai

Having a huge install base don't really help traditional fighting games.

It increase the likelihood of selling well, though, especially when the audience is there.
Psycho_Mantis
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:33 PM)
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Originally Posted by Aters

Like others have pointed out, Arms came out this year and out sold every fighter on PS4, except Injustice 2.

This isn't even true. It hasn't even reached SFV's sales, let alone Mortal Kombat, Tekken or Injustice. Not to mention the game was overshipped and seems to have little legs. Next shipment info should be telling.
fortunato
Banned
(10-07-2017, 12:35 PM)

Originally Posted by Psycho_Mantis

This isn't even true. It hasn't even reached SFV's sales, let alone Mortal Kombat, Tekken or Injustice. Not to mention the game was overshipped and seems to have little legs. Next shipment info should be telling.

The original post was talking specifically about PS4. How much Tekken 7, Mortal Kombat and Street Fighter V sold on PS4 worldwide?
gundamkyoukai
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:41 PM)
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Originally Posted by fortunato

The original post was talking specifically about PS4. How much Tekken 7, Mortal Kombat and Street Fighter V sold on PS4 worldwide?

SFV would be around 1.4 million on PS4 give or take.
The others would be hard to tell since we don't get numbers from all regions \splits.
MKX sold 5 million plus WW and it most likely sold the most on PS4.

Also talking about fighting games and using Japan only make no sense .
Since Smash is only fighting game that does well in Japan .
Last edited by gundamkyoukai; 10-07-2017 at 12:48 PM.
Jarod McChicken
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:42 PM)
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Originally Posted by fortunato

The original post was talking specifically about PS4. How much Tekken 7, Mortal Kombat and Street Fighter V sold on PS4 worldwide?

Street Fighter V shipped 1.7 million last june and has about 330.000 copies sold on SteamSpy if it can help. That is far from over of course, with the launch of the Arcade Edition the game will easily pass 2 million, and we are definitly getting a season 3 in 2018.

I don't think we have numbers for Mortal Kombat and Tekken 7 but in both case PS4 has by far the largest chunk of sales, especially Tekken 7 which had something like 80% of the retail sales in UK I think.
KtSlime
Member
(10-07-2017, 12:47 PM)
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The original point was that a fighting game does not have to be released on PS4 to sell well for a fighting game.

Should a fighting game be released on PS4, yes, and everything else too, because the sales of the genre are small enough it would need all the sales it could get.
Chris1964
Sales-Age Genius
(10-07-2017, 01:37 PM)
sinobi

Despite the fact that the number of shipments for Super Famicom Mini was large, it is currently sold out at many shops.
Since it is said that it will be shipped on a regular basis in the future, please be careful not to put out any handling of products with selling price exceeding the suggested price.
ArkhamFantasy
Member
(10-07-2017, 01:39 PM)
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Someone is going to have to explain to me why you would announce a game but not the platforms that game will be available on.
Lonely1
Member
(10-07-2017, 01:40 PM)
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Originally Posted by ArkhamFantasy

Someone is going to have to explain to me why you would announce a game but not the platforms that game will be available on.

The only reason I can think of is to get free publicity by baiting Switch (and maybe Vita) fans.
Oregano
Member
(10-07-2017, 01:42 PM)
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Originally Posted by ArkhamFantasy

Someone is going to have to explain to me why you would announce a game but not the platforms that game will be available on.

It keeps a game that no one would care about in the discussion cycle.

Look at how much attention Code Vein is getting now.
casiopao
Member
(10-07-2017, 01:50 PM)
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Originally Posted by gundamkyoukai

Having a huge install base don't really help traditional fighting games.
Be it Japan or WW most of them have not been big sellers for a long while.

It depend though. If the fighting game targeted main stream fans like lets said Smash, big install base is sure going to be very important.
Principate
Saint Titanfall
(10-07-2017, 02:06 PM)
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Originally Posted by Oregano

It keeps a game that no one would care about in the discussion cycle.

Look at how much attention Code Vein is getting now.

Isn't that mostly because of anime dark souls. If it was some dime a dozen anime game noone would care.

In this case we know what the platforms are so there's little point.
Principate
Saint Titanfall
(10-07-2017, 02:08 PM)
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Originally Posted by gundamkyoukai

SFV would be around 1.4 million on PS4 give or take.
The others would be hard to tell since we don't get numbers from all regions \splits.
MKX sold 5 million plus WW and it most likely sold the most on PS4.

Also talking about fighting games and using Japan only make no sense .
Since Smash is only fighting game that does well in Japan .

We're in a media create thread of course it makes sense. It always make sense.
gundamkyoukai
Member
(10-07-2017, 02:19 PM)
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Originally Posted by Principate

We're in a media create thread of course it makes sense. It always make sense.

The way how the topic\conversation was going being in a media create thread don't change the facts.
Principate
Saint Titanfall
(10-07-2017, 02:22 PM)
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Originally Posted by gundamkyoukai

The way how the topic\conversation was going being in a media create thread don't change the facts.

Err it made perfectly logical sense we talk about fighting in a Japan only context all the time here. If your talking about worldwide say worldwide otherwise the base assumption will be Japan.
Gotdatmoney
Member
(10-07-2017, 02:23 PM)
No platform announcement will forever be dumb.
ArkhamFantasy
Member
(10-07-2017, 02:26 PM)
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Originally Posted by Gotdatmoney

No platform announcement will forever be dumb.

Ok good, im not alone on this lol.
fortunato
Banned
(10-07-2017, 02:28 PM)
By going with YT tags, it seems the game will be PS4/XB1/PC. How much can a PS4 God Eater game sell in Japan (considering that XB1 and PC versions will likely be DOA there)?
Gotdatmoney
Member
(10-07-2017, 02:33 PM)

Originally Posted by ArkhamFantasy

Ok good, im not alone on this lol.

I think most of us feel that way tbh.

Not announcing platforms doesnt make peoppe more interested in your game. Especially when its Japan and the graphics tell everyone it's a PS4 game.

Originally Posted by fortunato

By going with YT tags, it seems the game will be PS4/XB1/PC. How much can a PS4 God Eater game sell in Japan (considering that XB1 and PC versions will likely be DOA there)?

Publishers have been trying pretty hard to transition everyone to the PS4. The game isn't going to do a lot for the system but it should come out with decent numbers.
OfficerRaichu15
Member
(10-07-2017, 02:34 PM)
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Originally Posted by fortunato

By going with YT tags, it seems the game will be PS4/XB1/PC. How much can a PS4 God Eater game sell in Japan (considering that XB1 and PC versions will likely be DOA there)?

Probably 150k
Hellraider
Member
(10-07-2017, 02:36 PM)
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Originally Posted by fortunato

By going with YT tags, it seems the game will be PS4/XB1/PC. How much can a PS4 God Eater game sell in Japan (considering that XB1 and PC versions will likely be DOA there)?

Something around 100k sounds about right.
TheLegendaryN
Member
(10-07-2017, 03:27 PM)
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Originally Posted by fortunato

By going with YT tags, it seems the game will be PS4/XB1/PC. How much can a PS4 God Eater game sell in Japan (considering that XB1 and PC versions will likely be DOA there)?

I doubt it'll release on Xbox One. Not even in the west, but we'll see.
A quick look at the gamedatalibrary shows:

God Eater {2010.02.04}
PSP - 276k / 618k

God Eater Burst {2010.10.28}
PSP - 267k / 618k (All versions)

God Eater 2 {2013.11.14}
PSV - 259k / 428k (All versions)
PSP - 120k / 206k

God Eater 2: Rage Burst {2015.02.19}
PSV - 221k / 367k
PS4 - 32k / 55k

God Eater Resurrection {2015.10.29}
PSV - 115k / 178k
PS4 - 28k / 47k

Interesting things are that GE Burst on PSP did as good as the original version, which released only 8 months prior, and how the FWs of the two are in the same ballpark as well. Combining PSP+PSV (All versions) of GE2 gives us a Combined LTD of 634k, three full years later. The audience hadn't disappeared. With GE2 Rage Burst, even though this version released 15 months later, this version got 85% of the GE2 sales on PSV. It's quite impressive how such a large part of the audience was still interested in the series AND still playing on PSV. I think it's telling that, while a huge part of the player base shifted over from PSP to PSV, the PS4 version of GE2 Rage Burst nor GE Resurrection sold well. The PS4 versions of the two games did have similar sales tho, but for some obvious reason the player base never grew on PS4, while most of the GE players bought a PSV within two years after release (they were likely among the first to buy a PSV).

I think that the GE player base are hardcore gamers, but they want to play the game on handheld systems. Of course the PSV has declined and mobile has risen in the meantime, but I think that GE3 could still reach 350k+ LTD (which would be slightly below GE2 Rage Burst), but only if it releases on a handheld system. I don't expect the PSV to live on until GE3 releases, which would be Fall 2018 at the earliest. So hopefully the player base shifts to Switch or a hypothetical PSV successor (which I don't believe will happen), and hopefully BNE will bring it to that system. I don't see this game hit any decent amount of sales number on PS4 only.
'But MHW will come to PS4, that's a similar game, right?' Well, the player base did shift to PSV despite MH moving on to Nintendo, so MH presence doesn't matter for this group of players.
Last edited by TheLegendaryN; 10-07-2017 at 03:30 PM.
Principate
Saint Titanfall
(10-07-2017, 03:30 PM)
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Originally Posted by TheLegendaryN

I doubt it'll release on Xbox One. Not even in the west, but we'll see.
A quick look at the gamedatalibrary shows:



Interesting things are that GE Burst on PSP did as good as the original version, which released only 8 months prior, and how the FWs of the two are in the same ballpark as well. Combining PSP+PSV (All versions) of GE2 gives us a Combined LTD of 634k, three full years later. The audience hadn't disappeared. With GE2 Rage Burst, even though this version released 15 months later, this version got 85% of the GE2 sales on PSV. It's quite impressive how such a large part of the audience was still interested in the series AND still playing on PSV. I think it's telling that, while a huge part of the player base shifted over from PSP to PSV, the PS4 version of GE2 Rage Burst nor GE Resurrection sold well. The PS4 versions of the two games did have similar sales tho.

I think that the GE player base are hardcore gamers, but they want to play the game on handheld systems. Of course the PSV has declined and mobile has risen in the meantime, but I think that GE3 could still reach 350k+ LTD (which would be slightly below GE2 Rage Burst), but only if it releases on a handheld system. I don't expect the PSV to live on until GE3 releases, which would be Fall 2018 at the earliest. So hopefully the player base shifts to Switch or a hypothetical PSV successor (which I don't believe will happen), and hopefully BNE will bring it to that system. I don't see this game hit any decent amount of sales number on PS4 only.
'But MHW will come to PS4, that's a similar game, right?' Well, the player base did shift to PSV despite MH moving on to Nintendo, so MH presence doesn't matter for this group of players.

I mean they tried with Code Vein I can't imagine why not unless they're working under the assumption Code Vein bombs on Xb1 as the games are way to similar in look to try one and not bother with the other.
Eolz
Member
(10-07-2017, 03:37 PM)
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I can see God Eater on X1. It seems that at this point it's just a cheap port with a limited run to make for Namco.
James Scott
Member
(10-07-2017, 03:40 PM)
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Originally Posted by Gotdatmoney

No platform announcement will forever be dumb.

I wonder if these publishers think itís better marketing to screw over customers by messing with their expectations
kunnikuman
Junior Member
(10-07-2017, 03:40 PM)
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Originally Posted by Principate

I mean they tried with Code Vein I can't imagine why not unless they're working under the assumption Code Vein bombs on Xb1 as the games are way to similar in look to try one and not bother with the other.

Code Vein is trying to target completely different audience but I can see them trying since Capcom is putting one out for it.
BrokenJohnCena
Member
(10-07-2017, 03:44 PM)
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think again the highest chance is the game will go the Code Vein route as well.Annouce the game at the end of 2017,Wait until the Xbox E3 2018 conference to announce the platforms and release in early 2019
Principate
Saint Titanfall
(10-07-2017, 03:44 PM)
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Originally Posted by James Scott

I wonder if these publishers think itís better marketing to screw over customers by messing with their expectations

Obviously. Look at Namco "Please beg no wait buy this product first!" Genius ideas.
Laplasakos
Member
(10-07-2017, 03:52 PM)
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Originally Posted by BrokenJohnCena

think again the highest chance is the game will go the Code Vein route as well.Annouce the game at the end of 2017,Wait until the Xbox E3 2018 conference to announce the platforms and release in early 2019

I wouldn't be surprised if this was the case. Can't see the game released before summer 2018 and let's not forget that GE2 was released 14 months after it's re-reveal.
KillerMan91
Member
(10-07-2017, 04:01 PM)
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I wonder if after NES and SNES Mini success Sony is also going to make PS1 mini. Would be easy money for them too.
Laplasakos
Member
(10-07-2017, 04:12 PM)
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Originally Posted by KillerMan91

I wonder if after NES and SNES Mini success Sony is also going to make PS1 mini. Would be easy money for them too.

I could see a PS1 mini for the 25th anniversary in 2019.
Chris1964
Sales-Age Genius
(10-07-2017, 04:17 PM)

Originally Posted by KillerMan91

I wonder if after NES and SNES Mini success Sony is also going to make PS1 mini. Would be easy money for them too.

PS1 would have a bigger problem than N64 Mini at how 1st generation 3D games look at TV today.
thefro
Member
(10-07-2017, 04:18 PM)

Originally Posted by Chris1964

PS1 would have a bigger problem than N64 Mini at how 1st generation 3D games look at TV today.

That and they'd need more third party games since not many people care about Sony's first party output from that era (that they actually have the rights to now).
KtSlime
Member
(10-07-2017, 04:21 PM)
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Originally Posted by KillerMan91

I wonder if after NES and SNES Mini success Sony is also going to make PS1 mini. Would be easy money for them too.

It's a bit easier for Nintendo to do it as most of the titles are first party and they don't have to negotiate that many extra licenses to get a good lineup.

It would probably be difficult to come up with enough diverse games and most would be 3rd parties.

I've got:

Dragon Quest 7 (unlikely to get)
Final Fantasy 7
Biohazard 2
Gran Turismo 2 (sony)
Mina no Golf (sony)
Crash
Spyro (America)
Metal Gear Solid
Doko demo Issho (sony, Japan)
Winning Eleven 3
Tekken 2
Tales of Destiny
Twisted Metal (America)
Ridge Racer

And that's about it. Of course, you need to be careful to make sure the list isn't too same-y, sure you could fill it with sequels, but I think part of the charm is to try and make these as a greatest hits type of machine.
Last edited by KtSlime; 10-07-2017 at 04:24 PM.
KillerMan91
Member
(10-07-2017, 04:26 PM)
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Originally Posted by Chris1964

PS1 would have a bigger problem than N64 Mini at how 1st generation 3D games look at TV today.

Well that is true. I wonder though how much average consumer of these products care about image quality. Demand seems rather nostalgia driven.

Originally Posted by thefro

That and they'd need more third party games since not many people care about Sony's first party output from that era (that they actually have the rights to now).

Originally Posted by KtSlime

It's a bit easier for Nintendo to do it as most of the titles are first party and they don't have to negotiate that many extra licenses to get a good lineup.

It would probably be difficult to come up with enough diverse games and most would be 3rd parties.

I've got:

Dragon Quest 7 (unlikely to get)
Final Fantasy 7
Biohazard 2
Gran Turismo 2 (sony)
Mina no Golf (sony)
Crash
Spyro (America)
Metal Gear Solid
Doko demo Issho (sony, Japan)
Winning Eleven 3
Tekken 2
Tales of Destiny
Twisted Metal (America)
Ridge Racer

And that's about it. Of course, you need to be careful to make sure the list isn't too same-y, sure you could fill it with sequels, but I think part of the charm is to try and make these as a greatest hits type of machine.


Sure but I don't think acquiring rights to old third party titles is that expensive. Especially as it would be almost free money (and brand awareness) for third parties too. It's not like they sell their old games anywhere at the moment.
Jigorath
Member
(10-07-2017, 04:28 PM)
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Originally Posted by thefro

That and they'd need more third party games since not many people care about Sony's first party output from that era (that they actually have the rights to now).

They'd have:

Ape Escape
Crash 1-3
Spyro 1-3
Crash Team Racing
Syphon Filter
Wild Arms
Parappa
Gran Turismo
Twisted Metal

Pick like 10 games out of there, throw in 10 3rd party games from nostalgic franchises (Resident Evil, Tekken, Tomb Raider, etc.) And boom, you've got an extremely successful PSX Classic.
MoonFrog
Member
(10-07-2017, 04:34 PM)
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I remember Twisted Metal 2 the most of those games (TM games), personally.
Salvadora
Member
(10-07-2017, 04:35 PM)
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I wonder if licensing fees would make a PS1 classic unpalatable for Sony.

Curious how much Nintendo had to pay for a (presumably) smaller selection.
fortunato
Banned
(10-07-2017, 04:40 PM)

Originally Posted by KillerMan91

Sure but I don't think acquiring rights to old third party titles is that expensive. Especially as it would be almost free money (and brand awareness) for third parties too. It's not like they sell their old games anywhere at the moment.

The problem is mainly about royalties rather than "acquiring rights".

This kind of product is successful because it is sold at a very low retail price. Nintendo can bank on nostalgia because NES and SNES Mini have a really low entry point---hence they can attract a wide audience, even those people that used to play video games on dedicated platforms, and now either are not playing anymore or they are playing on smartphone (hence they are not dropping Ä150+ on a traditional console). Now, this very low price is also possible because most of the games are first party, and most of the third party games are not that valuable nowadays, hence low royalties all around.

90% of games of an hypothetical PS1 Mini would be from third parties, hence Sony would need to pay royalties to many companies, decreasing the mark-up by a wide margin; on top of that, most of the cited games are still highly bankable nowadays (Final Fantasy VII sold 1m+ on Steam, the Crash trilogy is a huge success with simply a graphical make-up), hence companies would require much higher royalties than, say, Contra III or Super Ghouls'n'Ghosts.

Further, I think there would much bigger differences across territories in terms of games that make sense to appear. In Japan, you cannot avoid to include a Dragon Quest game, or, say, Derby Stallion/Densha de Go, while Spyro can be avoided; the opposite would be in the West.
gtj1092
Member
(10-07-2017, 04:51 PM)

Originally Posted by James Scott

I wonder if these publishers think itís better marketing to screw over customers by messing with their expectations


Who gets screwed over and how? It's not like they announce a game for a console and then change their mind. I think it's better this way because it makes people talk about the game and not their console wars.
KillerMan91
Member
(10-07-2017, 04:55 PM)
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Originally Posted by fortunato

The problem is mainly about royalties rather than "acquiring rights".

This kind of product is successful because it is sold at a very low retail price. Nintendo can bank on nostalgia because NES and SNES Mini have a really low entry point---hence they can attract a wide audience, even those people that used to play video games on dedicated platforms, and now either are not playing anymore or they are playing on smartphone (hence they are not dropping €150+ on a traditional console). Now, this very low price is also possible because most of the games are first party, and most of the third party games are not that valuable nowadays, hence low royalties all around.

90% of games of an hypothetical PS1 Mini would be from third parties, hence Sony would need to pay royalties to many companies, decreasing the mark-up by a wide margin; on top of that, most of the cited games are still highly bankable nowadays (Final Fantasy VII sold 1m+ on Steam, the Crash trilogy is a huge success with simply a graphical make-up), hence companies would require much higher royalties than, say, Contra III or Super Ghouls'n'Ghosts.

Further, I think there would much bigger differences across territories in terms of games that make sense to appear. In Japan, you cannot avoid to include a Dragon Quest game, or, say, Derby Stallion/Densha de Go, while Spyro can be avoided; the opposite would be in the West.

Well SNES Mini costs 149€ here in Finland lol (Damn you Bergsala). But yeah maybe royalties would be too much. Would be interesting to know how much Nintendo pays for those few third party titles on SNES mini. I think that PS1 Mini could costs somewhat more than SNES mini though and still be decent success (rising price from $80 to $100 for example).
Stefarno
Junior Member
(10-07-2017, 05:00 PM)
Sony could let people buy additional games for it to get around the royalties (and make extra money) while letting them have the games they'd want.

Hell, just put the Vita TV in a grey box with some PS1 games built in.
TheLegendaryN
Member
(10-07-2017, 05:02 PM)
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Originally Posted by KillerMan91

Well SNES Mini costs 149Ä here in Finland lol (Damn you Bergsala).

Damn, that's a lot! Wasn't importing from Amazon.de or so cheaper when pre-orders opened?
Chris1964
Sales-Age Genius
(10-07-2017, 05:18 PM)

Originally Posted by KillerMan91

Well that is true. I wonder though how much average consumer of these products care about image quality. Demand seems rather nostalgia driven.

Image quality could be an important factor. Many games of that generation look unplayable by today's standards, something that can't be said for 2d games.

Apart from that PS1 has the exact opposite disadvantage of N64. Most first party titles of then are discontinued and lack comparing to third parties.
ItWasMeantToBe19
Member
(10-07-2017, 05:21 PM)
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Metal Gear Solid and Resident Evil would need to be on a PS1 classic so the system would also have the problem of being a rated M piece of hardware.
Salvadora
Member
(10-07-2017, 05:24 PM)
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Originally Posted by Chris1964

Image quality could be an important factor. Many games of that generation look unplayable by today's standards, something that can't be said for 2d games.

Apart from that PS1 has the exact opposite disadvantage of N64. Most first party titles of then are discontinued and lack comparing to third parties.

I would argue that they not only look unplayable but, in large part, control that way too.
Psycho_Mantis
Member
(10-07-2017, 05:24 PM)
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PS1 mini sounds like a good idea, thought I wonder if they rather have PS1 classics bought from the PSN store. N64 mini also sounds like a good idea but these should be the last gen.
fortunato
Banned
(10-07-2017, 05:52 PM)

Originally Posted by Stefarno

Sony could let people buy additional games for it to get around the royalties (and make extra money) while letting them have the games they'd want.

Hell, just put the Vita TV in a grey box with some PS1 games built in.

Too complicated for the mainstream audience; too much competition for those people that would buy those games on PSN or through remasters.
Fiendcode
Member
(10-07-2017, 06:05 PM)
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How about just doing PS1 classics on PS4?
Fukuzatsu
Member
(10-07-2017, 06:22 PM)
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Not exactly pertinent to this week's data, but as I've been browsing the US and JPN PSN stores recently, something occurred to me: Is there any specific reason for the differences in price between 'full-price' games? Obviously in the US this is usually $60 USD, at least for a standard edition, but they seem to be all over the place in Japan.

A few examples that I was looking at (non-sale price on PSN as of right now):
FIFA 18 Standard Edition - •8,424
Trails of Cold Steel III - •7,200
NBA 2K18 - •6,804
F1 2017 - •7,668
Raiden V: Director's Cut - •7,344
Destiny 2 - •8,532

That and certain games seem to sit at a high price basically forever, though I imagine this is true in all regions to some extent.

Dynasty Warriors 8: Xtreme Legends Complete Edition - •7,302
Driveclub - •5,292
Daisenryaku: Tides of War in the Orient III - •7,560
Alien: Isolation - •8,629

These are just a few titles that were basically out in the launch period and yet are still by no means cheap. For what it's worth, Driveclub is on Amazon JP for as low as •2,550 (the US version, oddly enough) and (the PS4 version of) DW8 is on there for around •6,000. In that case though, the original PS3 version is below •1,000. Alien: Isolation strikes me as especially egregious, because even if you account for it being a later release in Japan (June 2015), that's still way too high a price to ask when you can find it on Amazon (again, the US version) for as low as •1,100. Even the Japanese copy goes as low as •4,000.

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